CoyoteJim

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You talk like you are the only person here with real work experience and only you know what makes economic sense.
Well you are NOT the only one.

Despite being in Mexico. I am a trained EE too & have several friends who are EEs too who work at electronic/electrical component suppliers to US/Mexico automotive industry.
I probably know more about BEVs operate than you do.
I have installed solar panel systems.
I have hands on in work in metal fabrication of heavy equipment (steel, cast iron, aluminum).

You are the one that makes claims about Cybertruck consuming huge levels of KwH without any real data to back it up.

Elon said nothing about how many KwH the solar on Cybertruck would create.
Elon said 15 miles or more a day.
Maybe the Cybertruck only uses 300 Kwh/mi.
Whatever Elon has in mind with the solar option it is much more than just for phantom drain.

And another one of your expert perceptions is wrong.
There is nothing in my writing to indicate I am not a native speaker. In fact I am a native English speaker and grew up in U.S. I did not learn Spanish until I went to college. For over 20 years I have also taught English. When I worked in the U.S. corporate world we all had to go to seminars on how to be more effective communicators when work in teams. Some training was similar to the skills airline pilots & copilots use. Even when I am in the U.S., my English is well above average and so is my knowledge of history, science, economics, business.
Agree. And wth does a person’s primary language have to do with anything anyway?
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ajdelange

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There are plenty of people who have paid for their home solar with the energy cost savings that they have netted. Most of these folks are in states with high energy costs. However, those with solar roof installs are reporting impressive cost savings even in low-cost states. The data is out there. You sound bitter.
Bitter? My last two electric bills were $7 with a credit for hundreds of kWh against the winter. How could I be bitter about that?

Personally, I dislike solar and wind. Hate it on a utility scale. I want nuclear power, everywhere, and no utility-scale “renewables” at all. I’m looking at solar roof for a new construction home, because when I crunch the numbers, it saves me money.
The mistake most people make with solar is not getting enough. The companies that sell solar obviously use canned software packages and a satellite photo of your roof to come up with a number of panels that will cover 2/3 of your electric bill on average. They do not do a thoroug systems engineering analysis of your needs, how they are distributed over the seasons etc. They can't afford to. You wouldn't be willing to pay for such a thorough analysis. The system the company designed for me covered nearly all my electric needs during the summer months aroung the summer solstice and only 16% around the winter one. So I went back to the drawing board and did the systems engineering. Wound up having to nearly double the panel count. Performance since March has been like gang busters but we have yet to see what happens in the winter. So my installation got to be pretty expensive. Eventually, of course, the system will pay for itself but that's going to be a long time coming. The thing I love about solar is not related to $ but rather to apparent simplicity of grabbing the energy that nature heaps on me at the source and turning it into the energy that heats my house and moves my car. It's free!
 
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ajdelange

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Despite being in Mexico. I am a trained EE too & have several friends who are EEs too who work at electronic/electrical component suppliers to US/Mexico automotive industry.
I am sure your CV is most impressive.

I probably know more about BEVs operate than you do.
Now that's a pretty risky assertion to make without really knowing anything about me. I wouldn't have the temerity to make a claim like that. Do you know what the Clarke and Park transforms are and how they apply to BEV? It's quite probable that you know more about some aspects of BEV than I do. And conversely.


You are the one that makes claims about Cybertruck consuming huge levels of KwH without any real data to back it up.

Elon said nothing about how many KwH the solar on Cybertruck would create.
Elon said 15 miles or more a day.
Maybe the Cybertruck only uses 300 Kwh/mi.
Yes and maybe pigs have wings. Until actually we get our hands on the vehicles we have to rely on what Tesla reveals and if you know Tesla you know they don't reveal much and I don't blame them. Thus in trying to create a picture of how the cars will perform we have to use what we do know based on the Teslas we have now, engineering principles and common sense. The X is Tesla's biggest car at this point. It's rated consumption is 282 Wh/mi. The CT is bigger than the X by quite a bit. Does common sense suggest that its consumption is going to be greater or less than 282 Wh/mi? ABRP think it's going to be 485 Wh/mi. I don't think it's going to be that high. My calculations suggest that 450 is more likely. Others think it could be below 400, perhaps as low as 375. But all of us are guessing to some extent. I don't know what the drag or rolling resistance coefficients are going to be. I don't know what the regen round trip efficiency is going to be. I don't know how big the battery will be. So I have to use reasonable numbers for all of these. I tend to be conservative (experience has taught me this is wise) and so arrive at 450 Wh/mi. I won't be surprised or upset if it turn out to be less than that. If it turns out to be 300 I will be very surprised and at the same time delighted.



Whatever Elon has in mind with the solar option it is much more than just for phantom drain.
You consistently miss the point of comparison to phantom drain. No one ever suggeted that the energy from the panels was exclusively dedicated to covering phantom drain.


And another one of your expert perceptions is wrong.
There is nothing in my writing to indicate I am not a native speaker.
I am afraid that you are the one laboring under the misperception. Please go back and check No. 83, the post you quoted and the one which you perceived as suggestingt that you are ESL.

Even when I am in the U.S., my English is well above average and so is my knowledge of history, science, economics, business.
A real renaissance man (if not a modest one).

You talk like you are the only person here..
Correct English is "You talk as if.....]
 
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ajdelange

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Agree. And wth does a person’s primary language have to do with anything anyway?
I don't know why I bother to respond to posts like this. AR I guess. One's primary language has nothing to do with it if one's comprehension of English is good. In the first place the comment about English comprehension was not directed to the guy who took offense at it but at someone else who was apparently confused by something which Elon wrote doubtless due to a combination of the sloppy English Elon uses in his tweets and this gentleman's level of familiarity with the idiom.
 

CoyoteJim

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I don't know why I bother to respond to posts like this. AR I guess. One's primary language has nothing to do with it if one's comprehension of English is good. In the first place the comment about English comprehension was not directed to the guy who took offense at it but at someone else who was apparently confused by something which Elon wrote doubtless due to a combination of the sloppy English Elon uses in his tweets and this gentleman's level of familiarity with the idiom.
Sounded a little ad hominem to me, but then what do I know, right? I misunderstand everything and just can’t grasp concepts.
 

rr6013

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Not just camp sites. I have had to leave my car for 3 weeks in airport parking. If I had solar on Cybertruck I would not have to try and find a parking lot that has chargers (there might not even be an option at any of the lots), or pay extra for parking spot with charger or trust attendant to plug my truck in.
Many a Tesla have been flatbed hauled off airport parking lots with a dead 12v battery. The vehicle cannot be jumped, recharged once dead and must be returned to a Tesla Center to be entirely rebooted.
 

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via https://www.teslarati.com/tesla-cybertruck-solar-panel-tonneau-cover-patent-elon-musk/

Tesla Cybertruck’s Solar Panel Tonneau Cover comes to life in new patent

May 27, 2021

The Tesla Cybertruck’s many features are now appearing as patents that the automaker has submitted to the United States Patent Office, and one of the most notable is the tonneau, or truck bed cover. While the retractable design of the tonneau provides convenience at the touch of a button for owners, it will protect any goods or cargo that drivers will store in the Cybertruck’s massive bed. However, the design is now hinting toward even more versatility and usefulness as the patent describes the potential use as a solar panel that will provide range for the all-electric truck by capturing the sun’s energy.

In Tesla’s newly published “Integrated Tonneau Cover for a Vehicle” patent, several inventors submit their idea and designs for the Cybertruck’s fully mechanical tonneau cover. Guided along a set of channels in the bed of the truck, the tonneau cover will provide protection for any cargo that is stored in the back of the vehicle. Whether it be tools or luggage, the tonneau cover is Tesla’s way of giving owners a way to protect their belongings without having to purchase expensive aftermarket bed covers, which other trucks do not provide. The retractable tonneau is shown in the images below.

tesla-cybertruck-retractable-tonneau.jpg


“In order to mitigate the possibility of such damage, many truck owners install aftermarket truck bed covers that cover the bed of their truck,” the patent states. “However, not only may such aftermarket truck bed covers be difficult to install, they also may not fit exactly with the specifications of the truck beds of different models of trucks. If a truck bed cover does not have an accurate fit it can leak rain or snow through the gaps between the truck bed cover and the walls around the truck bed, and cause cargo damage. In addition, not only are many aftermarket truck bed covers difficult to install and inconvenient to use, but they also take up space in the truck beds and reduce the overall utility of the trucks.”

The tonneau, in a revolutionary new design, will also be able to recharge the vehicle’s battery pack thanks to 110 solar electric cells that are electrically connected to a photovoltaic charging system and battery. “When the tonneau cover is deployed to cover the bed and the solar electric cells that make up the slats are facing the sun, the battery within the electric vehicle can be charged by solar electric cells,” the patent states.

While solar panels on an electric vehicle have been looked at as a possibility in the past, the idea has never come to fruition due to ineffectiveness. Because a car doesn’t provide much surface area, to begin with, the contribution of charge from solar panels would be minimal, and it would require extremely clear and favorable weather conditions to provide any effective additional range to the vehicle. However, CEO Elon Musk hinted just days after the Cybertruck’s unveiling event in November 2019 that Tesla would be adding an option to add solar power that could generate up to 15 miles per day. Musk also hinted toward “fold-out solar wings” that could generate an additional 30-40 miles per day, which could alleviate the need to stop at a Supercharger for some owners.

Screen Shot 2021-05-27 at 9.09.50 AM.jpg


The tonneau would be completely covered in solar electric cells, and the patent claims that when the “truck bed cover is in a closed position, it is configured to recharge the battery pack, the closed position of the truck bed cover enabling the plurality of solar electric cells to face a sun.”

Musk also hinted toward the possibility of installing solar cells on the roof of a potential Tesla van with Joe Rogan in a podcast interview earlier this year. Musk said that the van would be a favorable design due to its “big, flat area,” and “solar could start to make a little more sense.” Because the tonneau is flat and covers a considerable surface area, there is some potential for it to be just as effective as Musk’s idea for the van.

The full patent document is available below.

I hope any solar tonneau option is one we can opt out of. I don’t want it. To me this is like when automakers add nifty features to a loaded vehicle that often fail early, $$$, and don’t really add much utility for the cost. I don’t think 15 miles/day is enough to interest me even though I like the idea for camping applications. I’d rather have that really strong, solid motorized cover that we’ve already seen and no problems. For a couple grand to make this work I’d rather choose more cells on board.
 

ajdelange

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Many a Tesla have been flatbed hauled off airport parking lots with a dead 12v battery.
True


The vehicle cannot be jumped, recharged once dead and must be returned to a Tesla Center to be entirely rebooted.
Not true. The 12 V battery can be recharged and when it is the vehicle will come back to life.

But in any case the good news is that the 12V batteries will, in the short term future (not sure when that is) be lithium ion like the main battery. One can also buy a lithium ion after market dropin (Ohmu) if one is so inclined. Rather dear though.
 

ajdelange

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I hope any solar tonneau option is one we can opt out of. I don’t want it. To me this is like when automakers add nifty features to a loaded vehicle that often fail early, $$$, and don’t really add much utility for the cost. I don’t think 15 miles/day is enough to interest me even though I like the idea for camping applications. ...
Now what would make sense for camping applications and which I have mentioned previously in this forum (and which someone mentioned earlier in this thread) is connectors which interface to the standard solar panel connectors so that someone could come into camp, unfold some solar panels of enough size to make a difference, properly orient them and collect some charge.
 

ajdelange

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I misunderstand everything and just can’t grasp concepts.
You are not alone and as is the case for many of those folk you would probably find your comprehension going way up if you would just slow down and read the posts carefully. Had you done that in this case you would have realized that plaintiff took exception to a remark that didn't even refer to him but was, rather, in response to another member who has indicated, in so many words, that English is not his first language. Thus I really don't see how recognizing this via my comment "I realize that English is not your first language and thus understand how you might be confused by this." could be considered ad hominem.
 
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DVANDERM

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I live in a condo in Florida and park in the sun all day long. I drive very little each week as I work from home. I might never need to charge with 15 miles per day charging from the bed cover. Sure would be nice to utilize the sun for something other than giving me a sun burn and damaging my car.
 
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