Hopefully Cybertruck tow range is better than F-150 Lightning

[TyPope]

Had to get my head around it, but I think I get it.

Basically, the CT's shape advantage is negated by the tow, and comes back to the same aerodynamic capability of the Ford.

That would for example bring the CT's range from 500 miles to say 400 miles, and we would then have to reduce that figure by 60% ish to get the towing range.

So I had calculated 500 miles less 60% = 200 miles range when towing

When in fact, it could be
400 miles less 60% = 160 miles range when towing

"Engineering Explained" did a great YouTube video showing how/why towing efficiency on an EV will never match an ICE.

I was going to explain here but the video is actually really good thought it's REALLY in-depth on all the forces acting against efficiency.

Engineering Explained. Why Teslas (and all EVs) are bad at towing

Check it out. If you don't care about the technical stuff, skip to 16:00

To be fair, my F150 got right at 8.5 miles per gallon pulling my 7,056 pound loaded camper (yes, I weighed it). With it's 23 gallon tank, I could go 180 miles before I was desperately seeking a gas station.

So, if the CT can get somewhere close to that, it will be okay. I get that charging will take longer and that charging stations aren't as convenient but, really, for me, I don't tow often enough to be swayed. I'm buying the CT for my 95% of the time use and just want to have a pickup around for all those situation that pop up. I mean, I have three daughters living in town at their own places and one that will be with us for at least another 6 years...

Seriously, check out the video, set your expectation, and join me in waiting impatiently for our Cybertrucks!

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[CyberGus]

easy fix

 

[AlexD]

Had to get my head around it, but I think I get it.

Basically, the CT's shape advantage is negated by the tow, and comes back to the same aerodynamic capability of the Ford.

That would for example bring the CT's range from 500 miles to say 400 miles, and we would then have to reduce that figure by 60% ish to get the towing range.

So I had calculated 500 miles less 60% = 200 miles range when towing

When in fact, it could be
400 miles less 60% = 160 miles range when towing

Less than 200 miles of towing range is completely useless to me and is a deal-breaker.
It's not like there are so many charging stations that you can find one convenient to match your range limitations. Unfortunately, they are not like gas stations that are more or less everywhere. From where I live to the lake where I go boating (about 100 miles away) there are no charging options without doing a fairly major detour.

 

[Jhodgesatmb]

"Engineering Explained" did a great YouTube video showing how/why towing efficiency on an EV will never match an ICE.

I was going to explain here but the video is actually really good thought it's REALLY in-depth on all the forces acting against efficiency.

Engineering Explained. Why Teslas (and all EVs) are bad at towing

Check it out. If you don't care about the technical stuff, skip to 16:00

To be fair, my F150 got right at 8.5 miles per gallon pulling my 7,056 pound loaded camper (yes, I weighed it). With it's 23 gallon tank, I could go 180 miles before I was desperately seeking a gas station.

So, if the CT can get somewhere close to that, it will be okay. I get that charging will take longer and that charging stations aren't as convenient but, really, for me, I don't tow often enough to be swayed. I'm buying the CT for my 95% of the time use and just want to have a pickup around for all those situation that pop up. I mean, I have three daughters living in town at their own places and one that will be with us for at least another 6 years...

Seriously, check out the video, set your expectation, and join me in waiting impatiently for our Cybertrucks!

I have seen that video before but I watched it again from your post and its quite clear that to pull a rated load 100 miles to 1 mile above sea level would be pushing it for a Cybertruck with even a 200 KwH battery pack with the 2170 energy density. Like you, I only occasionally fill a bed with heavy loads and even more rarely (at least at present) do I pull a boat. I imagine that something like the Cyberlander would be much better as it doesn't weigh a lot and doesn't add to the aerodynamic load but then you would lose the cargo capacity.

Using the 4680 cell specs there should be an improvement but not as large as was talked about being needed for parity with ICE trucks in the video. We will have to count on superchargers. It is interesting to note that he doesn't predict anywhere near a 500 mile range while towing or even without towing.

 

[Gaston]

Just saw an interesting youtube on a test comparing a round trip towing a 10k pound enclosed trailer (with a Tesla car for the weight). Very interesting. The Rivian range was about 100 miles towing compared to about 300 without towing.
The Ford F-150 Boost was close to the same cost to refill as the Rivian (on a public charger)

(38) Towing With An Electric Truck - Is It Cheaper Than Gas? Rivian R1T vs Ford F-150 PowerBoost - YouTube

 

[Crissa]

... You are going to have to drop the trailer for many, probably safe to say most, chargers. If you have a large trailer with a weight distributing hitch, that is a hassle even in good weather.

Won't the truck with its variable height suspension be like a weight distributing hitch?

-Crissa

 

[Deleted member 12457]

Has anyone seen any towing comparisons done on an ICE semi truck? What's their mileage without a trailer? What's their mileage when towing an empty trailer vs a fully-loaded trailer? I'm sure Tesla wouldn't be building the Semi if it hadn't figured these things out. Is the Semi's mileage defined without no load or fully loaded?

 

[Crissa]

Unfortunately, they are not like gas stations that are more or less everywhere.

They literally are.

I bet there's power to your boat launch, too.

-Crissa

 

[Zabhawkin]

Won't the truck with its variable height suspension be like a weight distributing hitch?

-Crissa

Not really, but it would act as a variable drop hitch to allow getting the trailer level which will improve stability.

 

[Deleted member 12457]

Won't the truck with its variable height suspension be like a weight distributing hitch?

-Crissa

I use it that way on my Tacoma with rear air shocks/bags. That's also the only way to adjust my headlights.

 

[Crissa]

Not really, but it would act as a variable drop hitch to allow getting the trailer level which will improve stability.

Why not really?

It's changing the level. That's what the hitch does, right?

-Crissa

 

[Deleted member 12457]

Why not really?

It's changing the level. That's what the hitch does, right?

-Crissa

A variable or adjustable height hitch is used when needing to tow trailers (and other things) where the tongue is at grossly different heights. These are most used on jacked up trucks but also when towing trailers with different size wheels and different axle arrangements. I changed to about a 2-3" drop receiver for the various trailers I've had, using my air shocks to lift the rear end so I'm not porpoising but also to provide a more rigid rear end so everything didn't bounce all over the place. I'm talking about something like this which would/might be needed if the CT's shocks are adjusted to a higher level. I think these are not really that safe but are the only way to tow something with such a great disparity between the hitch level and the trailer tongue level.

 

[Zabhawkin]

Why not really?

It's changing the level. That's what the hitch does, right?

-Crissa

A weight distribution hitch uses 2 bars that attach to the tongue of the trailer and pry the front of the truck down. While it does help level the truck its purpose is to put weight back on the front tires to aid in steering and braking.

 

[rr6013]

A weight distribution hitch uses 2 bars that attach to the tongue of the trailer and pry the front of the truck down. While it does help level the truck its purpose is to put weight back on the front tires to aid in steering and braking.

Slight caveat - two loadbars? They form a connection, a three point hitch. This is superior to the single ball pivot hitch with N degrees freedom.

Dynamic adjustable suspension per Tesla‘s info is shock-driven variable valving dynamically weight sensitive so that Cybertruck never drags ass. In consumer imagining its purpose is to relevel the Cybertruck.

In actual use, re-leveling is a positive side-effect that can be over-ridden to force the shocks to extend and firm compliance to a desired height. This is like building a suspension system in software. Then changing the use case, adapting it to become an airLift kit remotely overidden.

Software developers appreciate(sarcasm) the mis-application and misjudgment that accumulates as the airLift is knocked for yielding a shitt-y ride, comfort and dangerous suspension rebound. It’s original design brief was shock control.

WDH employs loadbars(i.e. torsion) retaining the suspension compliance adding to the rated vehicle load rating. Tesla dynamic suspension provides neither from the information released by Tesla.

Thus, yes it can dynamically adjust Cybertruck ride level by added hitch weight. It can’t control rebound going thru a dip. Bottom-out maybe recoil possibly its not been released the engineering safety factor built-in.

SO it will never enable a three point hitch control of the Cybertruck/ trailer connection. Tesla chest thumping 16000# pulling power in its Cybertruck have experienced tow’rs implementing WDH for that controlled connection over leveling the truck.

May be, tow’rs deactivate dynamic suspension as it interferes to such a degree to shift weight back(CE) onto the trailer creating (i.e.wobble). Wobble== wiggle with two wheels .v. two feet! LOL

 

[CostcoSamples]

This is why Tesla better deliver on that "500+" mile range!

I might never tow, but I need a big battery to survive Canadian winters. Imagine towing in the winter! cut range to 1/4?

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