Some reasons Auto Pilot not yet operational on Cybertruck

roadrunner32

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I dont think the Tesla team needs huge amounts of real world data for autopilot only. It should be simple, Just keep the vehicle in between the white lines.
It's not like FSD. So here are some thoughts of why autopilot is not yet functional on the CT :

1. Software programming is complicated because of the variable ratio steering.

2. There is triple redundancy (I've heard it stated) in the steer by wire motors which further complicates the software algorithm.

3. The best redundancy is accomplished by dissimilar control actuators (the SBW motors) which further complicates the programming.

4. The Tesla team is probably running auto pilot in the background on all the CTs on the road now. Testing it out without actually sending the signal to the SBW motors. What a fantastically large test bed.

5. I have a feeling that Tesla will roll out auto-pilot with the FSD package later after auto-pilot software is proven to work...... and with a bigger price tag.

I look forward to ya'lls thoughts.
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i think: waiting for wide release of FSD12 and the need to incorporate it with steer by wire
 

smoknyreyz

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i think: waiting for wide release of FSD12 and the need to incorporate it with steer by wire
Literally this. FSD 12 hasn’t gone out to anyone other than a test population in CA at this point for the most part. Cybertruck is running 12, hence not available. I don’t see it releasing until there’s a fleet wide rollout of FSD 12.
 

Jhodgesatmb

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I didn't see anything about 4WS, only SBW. I think that 4WS will confuse their software and require a redo of some kind. And if they change the amount that the rear wheels can turn they will likely have to redo it again.
 


Tony stank

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Ahh man this is my career.

My professional opinion is that they need real life data to use in simulation and analysis all that data to make adjustments to the intended behavior.

They aren’t running auto pilot in the background of your CT, that’s not cost effective at all and they need raw data, not just post process data.

Also 2WS and 4WS is a huge difference. My current company is only doing 2WS 1st and then 4WS. That’s a really big one.

SBW should make it easier because u get a higher degree of control. The redundancy system would already be ironed out by the motion management and controls teams already.

As someone that stated there career at Tesla engineering, if Elon wants it done, it will get done ASAP. As Elon last said, there aren’t enough CT on the road so it’s bottom of the pile. Probably have a few interns and junior engineers working on it rn 😂.
 

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There current method of teaching requires a large sampling of very conservative drivers that completely stop at each stop line.

That's probably not helping the replication of FSD 12.

But they have to do a whole series of camera calibration and training to even get Autopilot out. The camera samples for the Cybertruck are probably just to few at this point.

-Crissa
 

hokietima

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Perhaps they are being more cautious with the rollout timeline due to the continued scrutiny of FSD? Engineering aspects are certainly the main contributor, but the external scrutiny is contributing to the timeline. How much - no idea.
 
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roadrunner32

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I appreciate all of y'alls comments. You have enlightened my thinking much. I did not think about the rear wheel steering. But I did think about the current level of scrutiny of FSD and even autopilot. Speaking of scrutiny, here is a thing. We can get to a point where FSD is extremely reliable but still have an unaccounted for edge case in which some one is killed, say once a month, but yet we have thousands of traffic fatalities. Does the NHTSA prevent the approval of life saving FSD?
 

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I dont think the Tesla team needs huge amounts of real world data for autopilot only. It should be simple, Just keep the vehicle in between the white lines.
It's not like FSD. So here are some thoughts of why autopilot is not yet functional on the CT :

1. Software programming is complicated because of the variable ratio steering.

2. There is triple redundancy (I've heard it stated) in the steer by wire motors which further complicates the software algorithm.

3. The best redundancy is accomplished by dissimilar control actuators (the SBW motors) which further complicates the programming.

4. The Tesla team is probably running auto pilot in the background on all the CTs on the road now. Testing it out without actually sending the signal to the SBW motors. What a fantastically large test bed.

5. I have a feeling that Tesla will roll out auto-pilot with the FSD package later after auto-pilot software is proven to work...... and with a bigger price tag.

I look forward to ya'lls thoughts.
It is exactly what I'm thinking, too. It just needs a different driver. Real Silicon Valley style I assume the Cybertruck team is relatively small and they just don't have time for everything. It's probably the new software driver that is needed for the new driving mechanism.

i think: waiting for wide release of FSD12 and the need to incorporate it with steer by wire
I don't think the FSD12 release has anything to do with the Autopilot or the lane departure assist not working on the CT.
 


Tony stank

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I appreciate all of y'alls comments. You have enlightened my thinking much. I did not think about the rear wheel steering. But I did think about the current level of scrutiny of FSD and even autopilot. Speaking of scrutiny, here is a thing. We can get to a point where FSD is extremely reliable but still have an unaccounted for edge case in which some one is killed, say once a month, but yet we have thousands of traffic fatalities. Does the NHTSA prevent the approval of life saving FSD?
AP and FSD are a Driver assistance system, aka y you still need to pay attention/hands in wheel. It would at the end still be considered the drivers fault. NHTSA would approve it if it passes some basic test cases.

The issue comes when you want to be a hands off/ eyes off system. As someone that has interacted with the teams that got the only approval for that in some Highways in Cali and NV. You need millions of real driven miles (in house, not customer) to prove ur system to the DMV/DOT/and all the other agencies and yet they only allowed a few thousand users a year. 😞
 

Cybergirl

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I just installed FSD Beta V12.3 on my Model Y, so it seems that V12 is rolling out to a larger population. I agree with the comments that CT requires its own training to build a version of V12. Having Tesla insurance for my CT, I drive as safely as I can to avoid butchering my Safety Score. I'm a good vehicle for gathering driving data.
 

Gene

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It's the differential locks that I am anxiously awaiting.
 

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Does the NHTSA prevent the approval of life saving FSD?
There is not currently a path to approval. It will take tens of millions of miles to even get close to approximating regular driving and encounter enough edge cases to figure its safety vs conventional human driving.

-Crissa
 
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roadrunner32

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AP and FSD are a Driver assistance system, aka y you still need to pay attention/hands in wheel. It would at the end still be considered the drivers fault. NHTSA would approve it if it passes some basic test cases.

The issue comes when you want to be a hands off/ eyes off system. As someone that has interacted with the teams that got the only approval for that in some Highways in Cali and NV. You need millions of real driven miles (in house, not customer) to prove ur system to the DMV/DOT/and all the other agencies and yet they only allowed a few thousand users a year. 😞
Here is a question for FSD beta users, a question I keep coming back to: Does FSD after extensive use, ie when you use it all the time, lull you into paying less attention than if you were not using?

It may seem crazy but I think one pays less attention when not using even auto pilot. It's like one's brain has an auto pilot of its own all the time. After years of driving you get into trusting your brain's "priority interrupt system" that would take your mind off of work or the radio or whatever if there was eminent danger ahead.

IMHO driving on Auto-pilot is definitely safer than driving without it. FSD will be also and soon I think, but can we trust our brain's priority interrupt system to work when it needs to.
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