Unless a new class of buyer joins, there will not be many takers at $85k+ for a pickup

JBee

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I learnt in my early thirties never to invest your own money in your own business if someone else will do so for less cost. 😎

Most billionaires borrowed more than they ever earnt and invested privately. If used properly it is just a time compressor, so you have funds to expand faster now, rather than wait for profits and then expand, potentially only after the opportunity reached its peak. Also loans are critical for taking money out of your investments for other things, without it turning into income. Loans are nothing but a financial tool, but like every tool you need to know how to use them, and how not too.

I suppose that is the difference between millionaires and billionaires these days? The fastest way to make money is to use someone else's, because money itself makes money, if you manage it right. All you need to do is manage it better than your lender. 🧐

My two cents for money, is to first understand the nature of money and what it exactly is, before you use it. Like many other things, we think we know, but the only thing we can be certain of is that we don't know enough.

And once realizing that the only true currency is time, then:
  • Reduce costs whilst improving capability.
  • Rather spend half, than earn double.
  • Buy tools not toys.
  • Leverage everything to what it can do in the worst of times
  • and never invest everything into one thing no matter how good it is.
  • Diversify, distribute and decentralize and grow everywhere.
You can only spend your time once, so spend it on things that matter most.

lol looks like it's time to get off the forum again.. 🤣
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greggertruck

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This may not land with many people, but.. Surprise: your cost is about the same with your 40k F150 and a 70k Cybertruck. BONUS, you OWN it, not putting single use dinosaur smoothies in it.

You. Own. The. Vehicle. The depreciation is bigger, better tax benefit there if you're into that, and the recoup is better. You do not get your gas spend back when you resale.

I feel like most won't read this, I won't even go about it from a oil changes / maintainence end, just purely cost of gas and the vehicle payment.

WITH 5K TRADE VALUES ATTACHED/ NO CASH DOWN!

Standard F150, 40k... 5 year loan.
Payment: $645
Gas: (1/ wkly tanke) $350
Total month: 995

Cybertruck, figurative 70k sticker... 5 year loan
Payment: $1197
"gas": $50
Total month: $1247

I personally, WILL, pay another $250 to have it if it is a sensible tool for what I do. I need the large bed, 300+miles in range would be ideal. I will offset my cost with a substantial down, and my Tacoma will trade in pretty nicely. All in, I'd be around half that payment and again, own it. Dollars and sense.
 

Throwcomputer

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That's why none of us live there anymore. Not that we wouldn't want to live there, but because the latter.

-Crissa
Exactly. I would much rather live in Ireland, Maine or Alaska. I actually had a job lined up working the conservation corps in Alaska and an application for grad school in NYC pending response at the same time at age 25. I would have preferred to move to Alaska and live a more relaxed life. The same week I was offered the job in Alaska, I found out I got into grad school in NYC. I chose NYC, despite not liking cities, because I told myself this was the better career and life choice... a terminal degree and a city with tons of job opportunities with higher pay.

17 years later, on hindsight, I would probably have chosen differently, cause what they don't tell you when they say "think of your career" is that to live where you can get a job and make decent money, you have to live in a place that is unaffordable and take on ever increasing debt for that terminal degree.
 

SpaceYooper

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WITH 5K TRADE VALUES ATTACHED/ NO CASH DOWN!

Standard F150, 40k... 5 year loan.
Payment: $645
Gas: (1/ wkly tanke) $350
Total month: 995

Cybertruck, figurative 70k sticker... 5 year loan
Payment: $1197
"gas": $50
Total month: $1247
If only we knew insurance costs.
 

greggertruck

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If only we knew insurance costs.
Lovely question, and I think that the Cybertruck is honestly PROBABLY... the single most benefited vehicle of Tesla Insurance.

On my Tacoma, full coverage is like $80 a month? I have a quote for an exotic luxury vehicle as well, it's $140. Less than I THOUGHT on a $165k car.
 


Throwcomputer

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This may not land with many people, but.. Surprise: your cost is about the same with your 40k F150 and a 70k Cybertruck. BONUS, you OWN it, not putting single use dinosaur smoothies in it.

You. Own. The. Vehicle. The depreciation is bigger, better tax benefit there if you're into that, and the recoup is better. You do not get your gas spend back when you resale.

I feel like most won't read this, I won't even go about it from a oil changes / maintainence end, just purely cost of gas and the vehicle payment.

WITH 5K TRADE VALUES ATTACHED/ NO CASH DOWN!

Standard F150, 40k... 5 year loan.
Payment: $645
Gas: (1/ wkly tanke) $350
Total month: 995

Cybertruck, figurative 70k sticker... 5 year loan
Payment: $1197
"gas": $50
Total month: $1247

I personally, WILL, pay another $250 to have it if it is a sensible tool for what I do. I need the large bed, 300+miles in range would be ideal. I will offset my cost with a substantial down, and my Tacoma will trade in pretty nicely. All in, I'd be around half that payment and again, own it. Dollars and sense.

I think most won't read this argument or hear this argument is because everyone else is comparing F150 LIGHTNING (electric version) at the mythical $40k price tag... not the F150 gas vehicle.
 

greggertruck

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I think most won't read this argument or hear this argument is because everyone else is comparing F150 LIGHTNING (electric version) at the mythical $40k price tag... not the F150 gas vehicle.
Entirely agreed. I look forward to seeing a 40k price tag'd EV truck around 3am in my bed this evening, on the back of my eye lids! ;)

I am CERTAIN with Tesla saying it went up, we will see Ford drop the basic 40k lightning. I have a feeling Tesla is playing chess and is going to still tease a cheap single motor truck for like 52-55k that'll come out in 2025 or something. But for now, dual and quad out the gate 65k and 87k.
 

charliemagpie

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I feel like most won't read this,
I hope they do because it was an excellent post.

------------

I have a limit of course, but my mindset focuses on monthly repayment amount more that whether the price is increased $10,000 one way or the other.

But that's my situation. But the math, as you say, can work for more people than we think.

As a side note…. I am not sure if I will do this or not… But the other day I thought since I will spend half my time living in another country… maybe I can use the 6 months away to add my CT to the Robotaxi network.

The software will ensure it stays on road, and according to Elon, there 'may be' like a Sheppard looking after a flock.
SO if I have software controlling, and a Sheppard overseeing… I could make say $!5,000 in a half year… which would totally cover repayments. !!

One could say:
'WHatif its damaged ?',
A. Tesla would fix it
B. What have I lost ? I have it for free lol.
 

windydrew

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You are probably right. There are some people that will buy a quad and not care about the price. Think of Plaid Model S buyers…tiny number. Then there will be some tri-motor people willing to get the quad to be first in line. Depending on the price I may be in that group even though I cannot foresee a need for all-wheel independent drive. The vast majority of truck buyers buy for functionality and a certain degree of comfort. That is why the Silverado is a tough sell. To get a reasonable range you have to pay over $100K. On an inefficient platform with no charging infrastructure. Unlikely. So I think that Elon will hold off until he can sell the CT at a price people will find hard to pass up. Just my opinion.
Where do you get that? They claim 400 miles on the base model, probably $50k.
 

Jhodgesatmb

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Where do you get that? They claim 400 miles on the base model, probably $50k.
At first I thought that you possibly fell for typical marketing hype, but on reading it further they do say that the WT will have a 400-mile option. I do not know what that option will cost but it might be $50K as you say, maybe more, not less. I wanted the version with 4WS, midgate, and other CT features and that is the RST. The price they quoted me when I made the reservation was $106K:

https://www.motor1.com/news/558979/chevrolet-silverado-ev-trail-boss/
 


windydrew

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Yes, RST is top trim like the plaid. Seems in line. We don't know what options the WT won't get but I feel like the Midgate and 4WS will be reasonable options on the WT as those are functional features.
 

Jhodgesatmb

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Yes, RST is top trim like the plaid. Seems in line. We don't know what options the WT won't get but I feel like the Midgate and 4WS will be reasonable options on the WT as those are functional features.
That link I shared with you said that the midgate would be on the RST. I do not know about the 4WS:

"Next comes the RST in the fall of 2023. It serves as the range-topping model, featuring extras such as four-wheel steering, adjustable suspension, and the reborn midgate concept in its Multi-Flex bed. This pass-thru from the bed to the cab allows the 5-foot 11-inch bed to offer a load floor of over 9 feet with the tailgate up, or nearly 11 feet when used with the Multi-Flex tailgate. It also benefits from Super Cruise, standard-issue 400-mile range, and it gets Chevrolet's Wide Open Watts (WOW) mode for 0-60 mph sprints under 4.5 seconds. 664 hp (495 kW) and all-wheel drive help make that happen."
 

windydrew

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Those are standard on the RST but optional on others.
 

Jhodgesatmb

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I might add that going from 300 miles to 500 miles on the CT is a $20K increase. True, they added a motor, but I suspect the lion's share of that is battery. I would expect the same as an option on the Silverado, or maybe more. So likely not $50K but $60K for that option alone. I suspect that if you add the other options to the WT, piecemeal, you would end up paying more than for the RST. That is just based on my experience buying cars from legacy automakers for the last 40 years.
 

Throwcomputer

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I might add that going from 300 miles to 500 miles on the CT is a $20K increase. True, they added a motor, but I suspect the lion's share of that is battery. I would expect the same as an option on the Silverado, or maybe more. So likely not $50K but $60K for that option alone. I suspect that if you add the other options to the WT, piecemeal, you would end up paying more than for the RST. That is just based on my experience buying cars from legacy automakers for the last 40 years.
Silverado EV is rumored priced between 40k and 100k with a top end model range of 400 miles. No info on the 40k model range.. I am guessing here with the info that is public knowledge that the Silverado EV is the same powertrain as the Hummer EV, but in a much lighter build/frame. Hummer EV Top end model has a range of 300+ miles and bottom model range is 250+ miles. Here is my guess... given the Silverado EV top end model is proposed on their website at 400 mile range using the same battery and motors but with a sizeable weight reduction would lead to the additional 50 mi range over the Hummer EV3x. Then the bottom range model of the Silverado EV will have 300 mi range, unless they do what Ford did and have an extra model that is no different than the cheapest model, except that the battery is a full size battery for a sizeable premium bringing it closer to $60-70k. This would mean the cheapest Silverado EV could potentially be 250 mi to match the cheapest hummer EV range.

My point.. it's going to be an interesting race between all these EV trucks coming out how they price their features and battery capacity to steal competition from each other.

Sidenote: For those of us who aren't made of money.. the race to the best of the bottom is going to get interesting. F-150 lightning is basically a non-starter as the price is what $46k for 230 miles of range. Even jumping up to the next model is adding over $10k for no increase in range.. just the pride in knowing you gave Ford that much more money. To even come close to Cybertruck range with the Lightning, you must spend north of $70k. Rivian is also a non-starter for the cash strapped, especially if the CT base model comes out at anywhere around $60-70k given the base model R1T is already at the high end of that range at $67k for only 260 mi range (which the comparable priced CT has that beat already). Hummer EV isn't even in the affordable ballpark. Silverado EV is the only one giving Tesla a run for their money in the race to the bottom tier models but it really depends on so many factors regarding range, price and specs. It may also come down to whether the cash strapped need a longer bed or not, cause all the other competition have shorter beds than the CT. We may see lots of the mid-gate crowd jump ship simply from that when the CT most likely does not have one.

Disclosure: None of this is fact. All of it is W.A.G.
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