Why we here need to pretend to be excited about the Ford F-150 Lightning

VolklKatana

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There is a pretty good reason the F-150 has been the best selling P/U in the U.S. for years so your opinion of Ford trucks doesn't seem to matter much, does it?
Youre right! My opinion doesnt matter one bit! It does matter, though, in gauging my enthusiasm for the vehicle they roll out. I dont like their vehicles compared to other options in the market, and dont care what they roll out, as i would never buy one!
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TruckElectric

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I dont like their vehicles compared to other options in the market, and dont care what they roll out, as i would never buy one!
To each their own. I would buy a Ford F-250, F-350 Heavy-Duty electric P/U if I liked the spec's and options.

Sandy Munro seemed to like the Ford Mustang Mach-E, so Ford can make a pretty good EV.
 

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To each their own. I would buy a Ford F-250, F-350 Heavy-Duty electric P/U if I liked the spec's and options.

Sandy Munro seemed to like the Ford Mustang Mach-E, so Ford can make a pretty good EV.
Actual Sandy was very surprised. He said the Mach-E was engineered different from past Fords he has seen. This was first Ford he would compare to a BMW.

So yes, despite Ford selling lots of vehicles, Ford design & quality could be questioned.
Nissan sells a lot too & Nissan quality is not too good.


Mach-E looks promising but there are two key question that need answers
1. Is Ford making a profit on Mach-E?
2. Can Ford delivery in quantity (400K year) instead of 40K?
 

Crissa

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A Model 3 can power the average house for three days.

And that's a wasteful average American home.

If you cut it to the furnace, tv, and fridge, you'd last much, much longer.

And I seriously doubt Ford is thinking V2G as much as 'you can plug a fridge into the outlets in the back'. I would love to be wrong here.

-Crissa
 
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I'll be watching on May 19th, i hope they hire the same marketing team that did the Ford Bronco reveal.

I suspect though, if Ford wants to make a profit, it will cost as much as a cybertruck and a powerwall combined.

I feel sad that Ford is saddled with the dealership system. Even if they came up with a slightly better product i still wouldn't want to put up with a dealership to buy it.
 

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The Ford Mustang Mach-E is a competent competitor (unlike the VW ID.4) but is comes nowhere close to knocking the Tesla Model Y out of the water.

So far all the cries from Tesla critics & competition that the competition "IS COMING" to wipe the floor with Tesla has been completely wrong.

My bet that in one week when F-150 EV is revealed we will see it's price to value is not as good as the Cybertruck.
 

ÆCIII

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A Model 3 can power the average house for three days.

And that's a wasteful average American home.

If you cut it to the furnace, tv, and fridge, you'd last much, much longer.

And I seriously doubt Ford is thinking V2G as much as 'you can plug a fridge into the outlets in the back'. I would love to be wrong here.

-Crissa
Three days powered by a Model 3? ... Possibly if you live in a small house in a place like California, where there is ideal climate more of the time and average monthly electricity usage per household is lowest in the country (even though California residents still pay the highest electricity rates in the country as well).

But for realistic consumption in states using more heat or air conditioning many hours of the day, you can easily expect a small 30 amps of consumption (only 15% of a 200 amp family house electrical service). That usage can easily happen with the air conditioning system, water heater, stove/microwave or laundry washing and drying, along with all the other incidental devices such as lights, computer, television.

So if you take only 30 amps of current (15% of a 200 amp house electrical service rating) at 220v you get 6600 watts (6.6 kW) of power consumption. Allowing for health of the battery avoiding full discharge to zero one could estimate 60 kWh reasonably available from a nearly full charged 75 kWh battery. Divide that 60 kWh by the 6.6 kW and you would get 9 hours of use - that's it.

Think 6.6 kW is not realistic? Generac's smallest Home Backup Generator solution starts at a 7.5 kW rating, and their capacity ranges go upwards to around 22 kW from there. That should tell you something...

Even if you cut that consumption in half (maybe only using your furnace, TV, fridge, and water heater), that still gets you only 18 hours of use, and this is if the car happens to be fully charged whenever one decides to power a house with V2G.

Of course 9 to 18 hours of backup power is still quite useful, but powering a house for 'three days' on a Model 3 is an extreme stretch. While it may be possible, I would say it could happen only in rare ideal situations (car with full SOC at the time of power outage, Fall or Spring time of year having almost no HVAC usage, no laundry loads to do, no usage of electrical stove, and having a smart or gas water heater, and being very conservative with remaining electricity use still while on vehicle battery). Of course 'tiny' or small houses could get by somewhat longer, but those aren't average 'use cases'.

And remember with your expectations of V2G, you must always take cold showers and never blow-dry your hair (because a blow-dryer can use 1.5 kW all by itself).

Realistic actuation is key when evaluating practicality of a V2G implementation to power a house. Once you consider the larger homes accommodating a family, the electricity consumption is substantially more.
 
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Pappy

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Three days powered by a Model 3? ... Possibly if you live in a small house in a place like California, where there is ideal climate more of the time and average monthly electricity usage per household is lowest in the country (even though California residents still pay the highest electricity rates in the country as well).

But for realistic consumption in states using more heat or air conditioning many hours of the day, you can easily expect a small 30 amps of consumption (only 15% of a 200 amp family house electrical service). That usage can easily happen with the air conditioning system, water heater, stove/microwave or laundry washing and drying, along with all the other incidental devices such as lights, computer, television.

So if you take only 30 amps of current (15% of a 200 amp house electrical service rating) at 220v you get 6600 watts (6.6 kW) of power consumption. Allowing for health of the battery avoiding full discharge to zero one could estimate 60 kWh reasonably available from a nearly full charged 75 kWh battery. Divide that 60 kWh by the 6.6 kW and you would get 9 hours of use - that's it.

Even if you cut that consumption in half (maybe only using your furnace, TV, fridge, and water heater), that still gets you only 18 hours of use, and this is if the car happens to be fully charged whenever one decides to power a house with V2G.

Of course 9 to 18 hours of backup power is still quite useful, but powering a house for 'three days' on a Model 3 is an extreme stretch. While it may be possible, I would say it could happen only in rare ideal situations (car with full SOC at the time of power outage, Fall or Spring time of year having almost no HVAC usage, no laundry loads to do, no usage of electrical stove, and having a smart or gas water heater, and being very conservative with remaining electricity use still while on vehicle battery). Of course 'tiny' or small houses could get by somewhat longer, but those aren't average 'use cases'.

And remember with your expectations of V2G, you must always take cold showers and never blow-dry your hair (because a blow-dryer can use 1.5 kW all by itself).

Realistic actuation is key when evaluating practicality of a V2G implementation to power a house. Once you consider the larger homes accommodating a family, the electricity consumption is substantially more.
Hang on there just a minute young feller’ I’m gonna have to go with Crissa on this one. I got one of them there “Smart Meters” that allows those fellers at the power company to read my meter from a fer piece off. Then the send that info over the inner web to me via a fancy app. Now granted, I never was a person to be wasteful of anything and try to use as much of the resources that God us to survive. So, I heat with wood, open a window when it’s hot, cook and hot water via propane, wife had cancer so she’s always left her hair short no need for hair dryers. I wish I knew how to upload a screen shot of the graph but
my power runs nearly 12.5KWh per day, so if take the 60 you mentioned in your post and divide that by 12.5 my calculator on this fancy phone says 4.8 days not 3 days, not 9-18 hours. I think I may have found the problem with our energy issues, you young folks waste to much of it away.
 

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Hang on there just a minute young feller’ I’m gonna have to go with Crissa on this one. I got one of them there “Smart Meters” that allows those fellers at the power company to read my meter from a fer piece off. Then the send that info over the inner web to me via a fancy app. Now granted, I never was a person to be wasteful of anything and try to use as much of the resources that God us to survive. So, I heat with wood, open a window when it’s hot, cook and hot water via propane, wife had cancer so she’s always left her hair short no need for hair dryers. I wish I knew how to upload a screen shot of the graph but
my power runs nearly 12.5KWh per day, so if take the 60 you mentioned in your post and divide that by 12.5 my calculator on this fancy phone says 4.8 days not 3 days, not 9-18 hours. I think I may have found the problem with our energy issues, you young folks waste to much of it away.
Think 6.6 kW is not realistic? Generac's smallest Home Backup Generator solution starts at a 7.5 kW rating, and their capacity ranges go upwards to around 22 kW from there. That should tell you something...

But as I mentioned in the beginning of the previous post, it largely depends on where you are, and how the climate puts demand on HVAC requirements as well ...
 
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Pappy

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Think 6.6 kW is not realistic? Generac's smallest Home Backup Generator solution starts at a 7.5 kW rating, and their capacity ranges go upwards to around 22 kW from there. That should tell you something...
Not say you don’t need 6.6Kw, just saying I don’t need 6.6Kw. So stop assuming everyone needs what you or what Generac thinks everyone needs. Besides that I’m not to fond of Generac in General, so called 20amp circuits on their generators only provide 13amps and their pride and joy Powercell ain’t approved for use by all power companies so they ain’t making any friends there. I know cause I’m in the design stages of a solar system on my cabin and was told by the power company they will not approve a design with the Generac inverter in the design. Don’t mean to throw rocks but dang it felle, you threw a rock first.
 

ÆCIII

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Not say you don’t need 6.6Kw, just saying I don’t need 6.6Kw. So stop assuming everyone needs what you or what Generac thinks everyone needs. Besides that I’m not to fond of Generac in General, so called 20amp circuits on their generators only provide 13amps and their pride and joy Powercell ain’t approved for use by all power companies so they ain’t making any friends there. I know cause I’m in the design stages of a solar system on my cabin and was told by the power company they will not approve a design with the Generac inverter in the design. Don’t mean to throw rocks but dang it felle, you threw a rock first.
Well, if you're so convinced you are actuating the this better, then why aren't you working closely with Elon and have convinced him the practical viability of V2G already?? When Tesla evaluates wide scale implementations such as V2G, they have to consider widespread average use cases (not just 'you'). Your posts aren't exactly convincing anyone that you have more expertise or actuation ability than Tesla or Generac - otherwise again, if so wouldn't you be working for them and have already convinced them??
 

Pappy

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Well, if you're so convinced you are actuating the this better, then why aren't you working closely with Elon and have convinced him the practical viability of V2G already?? When Tesla evaluates wide scale implementations such as V2G, they have to consider widespread average use cases (not just 'you'). Your posts aren't exactly convincing anyone that you have more expertise or actuation ability than Tesla or Generac - otherwise again, if so wouldn't you be working for them and have already convinced them??
Like I said at the end of my original post, both Elon and Generac have to consider how wasteful the younger generation is with our resources. But, Crissa, whom by the way is, way more smarter than the two of us put together, so you might want think a little bit longer when replying to one of her post, I can promise you this, Crissa has done her research and knows what she it talking about.
 

ÆCIII

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Like I said at the end of my original post, both Elon and Generac have to consider how wasteful the younger generation is with our resources. But, Crissa, whom by the way is, way more smarter than the two of us put together, so you might want think a little bit longer when replying to one of her post, I can promise you this, Crissa has done her research and knows what she it talking about.
I admire your trying to support Crissa or anyone else's view.

But she hasn't yet backed it up (yet), and neither have you. But she is welcome to, as is anyone else on this forum as well. I too have liked Crissa's posts, but I happen to disagree with her on the specific actuations concerning implementation of V2G, that's all. You don't need to try and present it as anything more than that.

Anyone can reply to a post whether it's Crissa's or anybody else, and by the details I provided, you already know I did 'think about it'.

Fortunately Tesla and Elon are very thorough whenever researching this (V2G) and other implementations, or else they would not be where they are today. Again, actuation is key, and even Elon on occasion has expressed the importance of actuaries in this type of industry.
 
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