Model Y Refresh (Juniper) Revealed

[dalton108]

True, and I would argue that using a pickup truck in the countryside or the boondocks should not really be considered an "edge case".

?

Sponsored

 

[pricedm]

I wish and can't wait for this to be true: "...99.999% of all car trips go between places served by electricity."

I can't stand driving non-Tesla due to how amazing FSD is but unfortunately due to my recreation taking me to rural places, I am stuck with ICE truck for the foreseeable future.

My easy "edge case:" My truck was shuttled from Lee's Ferry-Marble Canyon, AZ to Flagstaff. Truck sat in Flagstaff for 16 days while I rafted 225 miles down the Colorado river thru the Grand Canyon. My truck was driven by a shuttle driver 130 miles from Flagstaff to Diamond Creek Beach, Peach Springs, AZ 86434, towing a small UHall box trailer. The route includes a very rough dirt road (some of the "road" is a creek bed) with 3,500 FT elevation change in 20 miles. From the river, I drove my truck and trailer fully loaded 3,500 FT up the 20 mile dirt road on the 130 miles back one-way to Flagstaff. There are ZERO charging opportunities now. (Hopefully soon to change: https://azdot.gov/sites/default/files/2024-08/NEVI-Deployment-Program-Phase-1.pdf).

I had to refuel my ICEmobile on this trip due to 3,500 FT elevation climb combined with trailer and distance 260 miles R/T. No Level 2 or DC fast charging on my route. Idaho is even worse!!!

We need more charging stations!!!

 

[dalton108]

I wish!!! "...99.999% of all car trips go between places served by electricity."

I can't stand driving non-Tesla due to how amazing FSD is but unfortunately due to my recreation taking me to rural places, I am stuck with ICE truck for the foreseeable future.

My easy "edge case:" My truck was shuttled from Lee's Ferry-Marble Canyon, AZ to Flagstaff. Truck sat in Flagstaff for 16 days while I rafted 225 miles down the Colorado river thru the Grand Canyon. My truck was driven by a shuttle driver 130 miles from Flagstaff to Diamond Creek Beach, Peach Springs, AZ 86434, towing a small UHall box trailer. The route includes a very rough dirt road (some of the "road" is a creek bed) with 3,500 FT elevation change in 20 miles. From the river, I drove my truck and trailer fully loaded 3,500 FT up the 20 mile dirt road on the 130 miles back one-way to Flagstaff. There are ZERO charging opportunities now. (Hopefully soon to change: https://azdot.gov/sites/default/files/2024-08/NEVI-Deployment-Program-Phase-1.pdf).

I had to refuel my ICEmobile on this trip due to 3,500 FT elevation climb combined with trailer and distance 260 miles R/T. No Level 2 or DC fast charging on my route. Idaho is even worse!!!

We need more charging stations!!!

I finally found my tribe on this forum! I’m tired of arguing with these old dudes from the east talking about how they never supercharge and that my assertion that 400 miles is the absolute minimum necessary range for an EV to be useful is crazy talk!

I mean they’re literally screaming that what I’m talking about is an edge case and nobody needs it. It’s ducking futz!!!

I literally cannot take my cyber truck to Ely Nevada and back because there’s nowhere to charge once I get there other than finding a private residence or property that will allow me to plug into a 120 V charger (where I would need to sit for 25 hours) or rely on some crappy electrify America that everybody in the area who owns an EV is going to be in line at!

This is not an edge case, even outside of recreation an annual legal conferences take place here and I cannot get there in my cyber truck! PERIOD. End of story!

I get so tired of the apologists here not understanding that and ganging up like their worldview represents even a majority of people let alone anyone who happens to live in the west that’s not living in the Golden State where there’s a charger every 5 miles! At least until you get into the boondocks!

As a result, I cannot let go of my FJ cruiser my intent was to give it to my daughter. She merely has custody right now until anytime I need it because I want to go somewhere I can’t get with any of my EV‘s and most importantly my CB.

 

[pricedm]

@dalton108 yes, exactly.

I am considering buying a 2024 Tacoma TRD from EV-denial Toyota for my daughter so I can borrow it for rural trips where my vehicle will be driven to remote/ rural locations, parked for 5-15 days and shuttled by a hired driver.

Ironically the $56k cost of an ICEtruck plus liquid fuel aka gas for 5 years is more expensive than a AWD Cybertruck, factoring in $7,500 federal tax credit plus Colorado tax credit.

look now at Ely, NV!!!

 

[dalton108]

I finally found my tribe on this forum! I’m tired of arguing with these old dudes from the east talking about how they never supercharge and that my assertion that 400 miles is the absolute minimum necessary range for an EV to be useful is crazy talk!

I mean they’re literally screaming that what I’m talking about is an edge case and nobody needs it. It’s ducking futz!!!

I literally cannot take my cyber truck to Ely Nevada and back because there’s nowhere to charge once I get there other than finding a private residence or property that will allow me to plug into a 120 V charger (where I would need to sit for 25 hours) or rely on some crappy electrify America that everybody in the area who owns an EV is going to be in line at!

This is not an edge case, even outside of recreation an annual legal conferences take place here and I cannot get there in my cyber truck! PERIOD. End of story!

I get so tired of the apologists here not understanding that and ganging up like their worldview represents even a majority of people let alone anyone who happens to live in the west that’s not living in the Golden State where there’s a charger every 5 miles! At least until you get into the boondocks!

As a result, I cannot let go of my FJ cruiser my intent was to give it to my daughter. She merely has custody right now until anytime I need it because I want to go somewhere I can’t get with any of my EV‘s and most importantly my CB.

@dalton108 yes, exactly.

I am considering buying a 2024 Tacoma TRD from EV-denial Toyota for my daughter so I can borrow it for rural trips where my vehicle will be driven to remote/ rural locations, parked for 5-15 days and shuttled by a hired driver.

Ironically the $56k cost of an ICEtruck plus liquid fuel aka gas for 5 years is more expensive than a AWD Cybertruck, factoring in $7,500 federal tax credit plus Colorado tax credit.

look now at Ely, NV!!!

I knew they were on the list and the last time I checked about a month ago it wasn’t there! This is life-changing! That’s where the golden eagles are in Nevada! I’ll be heading out within the month, I guarantee it!!

And there it is! As you said, and as I’ve been saying - there’s two ways to solve this problem: more chargers, or more range! I’ll take either, but I can’t have neither!

 

[TruckDaddy]

TeslaDashCam X channel reported over 50,000 Tesla Y orders in China for the new model in a single day.

 

[GuyV]

I used Model 3 numbers. EPA rating is 224Wh/mi so a 400 mile pack would be 90kWh. Pack density is 166Wh/kg so an extra 10kWh = 60kg or 132lbs.

I suppose you used a Model 3 which already can get to 344 miles when we have been talking about Y and Cybertruck to try to make a point, but why not just go with the S that already has 405 miles? ?

When mixing in various models, your mileage may vary. The complaint here though has been that people wanted generally 400 miles rated range and have still only been given 300 on the Y and Cybertruck. That would mean a one-third increase so 389lbs of the 1168lb Y pack and 533lbs of the 1600lb Cybertruck.

 

[GuyV]

I think ICE doesn't need the 48V as much as a EV does. Air Conditioners, hydraulics, pumps and alternators all run happily from a fan belt, they also don't need heating circuits etc.

The point is that on a EV 48V makes more sense, and is within reason of the power requirements of large onboard consumers that only can be powered from the onboard high voltage pack.

But as for the wiring mess, it's actually Cybertrucks bus system with local nodes that got rid of the number of cables and not 48V by itself with i2r cable losses.

Of course, it's more important on an EV where weight and efficiency are crucial, but ICE vehicles have steadily gone more electric with pumps, motors and accessories, and everything is becoming computer dependent. The 48V weight, cost of materials and production line advantages would benefit everyone.

 

[GuyV]

True, and I would argue that using a pickup truck in the countryside or the boondocks should not really be considered an "edge case".

You only need enough driving-back range to get to the handiest DC charger, or even just a Level 2 for enough boost to get to that DC charger.

 

[devdrone6]

I finally found my tribe on this forum! I’m tired of arguing with these old dudes from the east talking about how they never supercharge and that my assertion that 400 miles is the absolute minimum necessary range for an EV to be useful is crazy talk!

I mean they’re literally screaming that what I’m talking about is an edge case and nobody needs it. It’s ducking futz!!!

I literally cannot take my cyber truck to Ely Nevada and back because there’s nowhere to charge once I get there other than finding a private residence or property that will allow me to plug into a 120 V charger (where I would need to sit for 25 hours) or rely on some crappy electrify America that everybody in the area who owns an EV is going to be in line at!

This is not an edge case, even outside of recreation an annual legal conferences take place here and I cannot get there in my cyber truck! PERIOD. End of story!

I get so tired of the apologists here not understanding that and ganging up like their worldview represents even a majority of people let alone anyone who happens to live in the west that’s not living in the Golden State where there’s a charger every 5 miles! At least until you get into the boondocks!

As a result, I cannot let go of my FJ cruiser my intent was to give it to my daughter. She merely has custody right now until anytime I need it because I want to go somewhere I can’t get with any of my EV‘s and most importantly my CB.

So keep the FJ and give the truck to her - ?

 

[dalton108]

So keep the FJ and give the truck to her - ?

She can take them both from my cold dead hands. Hopefully, she’ll wait for me to go naturally. ?

 

[BannedByTMC]

The complaint here though has been that people wanted generally 400 miles rated range and have still only been given 300 on the Y and Cybertruck.

The long range Y is rated at 335 mi range and the CT at 325

 

[Cybertruck2024]

You can always bring up rare edge cases, I'm speaking to mainstream motorists. Most of them never go anywhere electricity is not available. Currently, only 10% of motorists drive electric so we still have a lot of growth to do before we have to cover every edge case. 99.99% of all structures in America are served by electricity and the DCFC networks keep growing to increasingly remote locations.

99.999% of all car trips go between places served by electricity. Edge cases are endlessly amplified by anti-EV forces who want gullible people to think that an electric car couldn't possibly be a better solution than a gasoline powered car.

I make a regular trip that's an hour and fifteen minutes away to the city next to mine. Once there, I drive locally around half an hour, then I drive home. Now that it is cold out, this trip requires a 10 minute supercharger stop. I normally make the trip alone, but I had 3 passengers with me the last time I did it. The amount of ridicule I received that I had to stop on the trip home actually got to me... and you know what, the ridicule was justified.

Driving from Buffalo, NY to Rochester and back in one day when it's cold out is not an edge case. I am sure hundreds of people do this every day and it is cold 4-6 months a year. People in ICE vehicles don't need to stop in Batavia for 10 minutes. If you want to convert the large number of people who say they will never buy an EV, like my 3 passengers, you need to make it so you don't need to make stops like this. Two weeks later, my friends are still making fun of having to stop.

 

[GuyV]

The long range Y is rated at 335 mi range and the CT at 325

And they've promised a range extender for the Cybertruck, so buy an S or range extender, problem solved. All the folks are complaining then only about "up to" 65 miles difference, right? ?

 

[HaulingAss]

I make a regular trip that's an hour and fifteen minutes away to the city next to mine. Once there, I drive locally around half an hour, then I drive home.

You can easily do that in any Tesla with over 300 miles of range, even when it's 10F outside.

But i see a lot of people put inefficient tires and wheels on, run the tires two to four PSI too low, and drive poorly and inefficiently and blame the car.

Keep in mind that what you describe is longer than 99% of all trips in a private car. It can still do that, but it's not a typical trip for most people.

Sponsored