Snow and Rear Wheel Drive

[CyberKeggy]

So, after seeing the revel prices, it looks like I might only be able to afford the rear wheel drive version.

Some background:
- I live in an apartment but can charge at work.
- I live in western NY, and we get snow and cold.

My question is, how do rear wheel drive Tesla's do in the snow? Is it able to get me going from a stop, or am I going to be spinning my wheels? For those that have a Tesla in a colder climate, will 250mi be enough or am I going to be losing serious range daily?

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[WormtownKris]

So, after seeing the revel prices, it looks like I might only be able to afford the rear wheel drive version.

Some background:
- I live in an apartment but can charge at work.
- I live in western NY, and we get snow and cold.

My question is, how do rear wheel drive Tesla's do in the snow? Is it able to get me going from a stop, or am I going to be spinning my wheels? For those that have a Tesla in a colder climate, will 250mi be enough or am I going to be losing serious range daily?

Model 3 RWD is great in the snow. I have aggressive All Seasons on it and have never gotten stuck (although it has low ground clearance so have to mainly stay on ~plowed roads. It's nothing like an old RWD gasser with a big engine in the front and no weight in back. The Model 3 has a 48%/52% weight split, and the heavy battery gives a low center of gravity.
The CT will have much higher clearance and all the advantages a large truck has over a compact sedan. I think it will do quite well in the snow.

 

[Regenshire]

I have a 2018 LR RWD Model 3 and it does very well in the snow. The biggest thing I notice is some occasional slight slip in the rear if you accelerate too much on a turn in icy conditions. Its very capable.

I expect a RWD Cybertruck will be better in the snow due to ride height and other truck things going for it.

 

[SSonnentag]

RWD should do fine in the snow using light throttle, NO LOCKER activated and regen set to low. A locker will only cause the vehicle to slip sideways on snow and ice.

 

[davelloydbrown]

I got an early M3 in 2018 and AWD wasn't available and that is my only regret in this car.

I live in central Ontario Canada in the snow belt and we get lots of snow here (still not as much as the 90's and before). I grew up driving RWD cars and my dad always had a RWD pick up which was particularily useless in snow and ice. I knew that the weight was well distributed in the M3 because of the battery and I wasn't concerned.

The first couple of years it was fine, but now the snow tires have some wear, I have a slight incline where I back into my garage and if there is wet, heavy snow I have gotten stuck a couple of times and had to use salt or ash.

IMO, having grown up in the 60's and 70's with my father's RWD pick-up, they are completely useless in snow and ice.

 

[TheLastStarfighter]

I live in Eastern Canada, very similar climate to yours. We have two rear wheel drive cars, including a Model 3. No big deal, good tires are the most important thing. The Model 3 RWD is great for driving in winter.

Big warning though: All EV's lose significant range in the cold. If you can't plug it in at home, and will be starting it cold, be prepared for 40% range loss, maybe even more on bad days. If you plug in over night and preheat before driving, you can get that loss to under 20%. If you have a heated parking garage at your apartment, that might be even better than plugging it in, however.

 

[Crissa]

Big warning though: All EV's lose significant range in the cold.

All vehicles do, though.

If you can't plug it in at home, and will be starting it cold, be prepared for 40% range loss, maybe even more on bad days. If you plug in over night and preheat before driving, you can get that loss to under 20%. If you have a heated parking garage at your apartment, that might be even better than plugging it in, however.

This is something an ICE car can't do.

-Crissa

 

[JBee]

All vehicles do, though.


This is something an ICE car can't do.

-Crissa

That's a silly argument.

ICE vehicle are furnaces That also happen to drive. They produce as much power in their cooling system and again in their exhaust as propells them.

Heat is seldom an issue in the winter, unless they don't have the appropriate radiator controls. So letting it run for nothing in a garage is not something anyone would do anyway. You get all the heat you need when you drive, and if you want to have it preheated, a little 5kW $150 fuel heater has got you covered for quarter of a gallon an hour at full blast.

 

[CyberGus]

That's a silly argument.

ICE vehicle are furnaces That also happen to drive. They produce as much power in their cooling system and again in their exhaust as propells them.

Heat is seldom an issue in the winter, unless they don't have the appropriate radiator controls. So letting it run for nothing in a garage is not something anyone would do anyway. You get all the heat you need when you drive, and if you want to have it preheated, a little 5kW $150 fuel heater has got you covered for quarter of a gallon an hour at full blast.

“Cold weather and winter driving conditions can significantly reduce fuel economy. Fuel economy tests show that, in city driving, a conventional gasoline car's gas mileage is roughly 15% lower at 20°F than it would be at 77°F. It can drop as much as 24% for short (3- to 4-mile) trips.”

https://www.energy.gov/energysaver/fuel-economy-cold-weather

 

[JBee]

“Cold weather and winter driving conditions can significantly reduce fuel economy. Fuel economy tests show that, in city driving, a conventional gasoline car's gas mileage is roughly 15% lower at 20°F than it would be at 77°F. It can drop as much as 24% for short (3- to 4-mile) trips.”

https://www.energy.gov/energysaver/fuel-economy-cold-weather

Maybe I should of described the statement first?

Running your ICE car in the garage to keep it warm, or parking it in a heated garage, is a "silly" argument to make, as neither of these will increase fuel consumption efficiency.

These things apply to a EV, but no argument can be made that ICE "don't have that ability" as if it was a negative ICE only problem, that EV had a solution for, whilst in reality they don't need it in the first place.

The point is that ICE have no material loss in efficiency from cab heating whilst being driven.

Sure they have less range in cold conditions, from other factors like rolling resistance, road surface conditions, lower calorific fuel etc. But they don't loose range from "cabin heat" like EVs do, because they have up to 2x as much heat they can recover from the ICE than they use for forward propulsion.

Even hybrids make use of this, with my Prius not only having a thermos tank to store heat temporarily to provide cabin heat whilst the motor is off, but also a exhaust mounted heat exchanger that actually collects heat on startup for a fast warm-up, before the radiator cooling circuit can even get to temperature. This is all part of the thermal management required to achieve emission control, but the side effect is better cabin heat as well. You can also prestart cabin heat with the Fob. Fuel powered stationery heaters have been around for decades as well and achieve the similar convenience and beneficial emission reduction.

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