Tesla's First Dud: State of Charge x Kyle Conner (Out of spec) talks Cybertruck vs. Lightning & Rivian R1T

[Woodrick]

Wow, ease off the fanboy pedal a bit buddy. There are cool things about the CT for sure but let's just break that down.
1. Charging network: my nearest Supercharger is almost 40 miles away. That network is useless to me and road trips in the CT even if NOT towing are going to be terrible. Towing on a road trip will be the stuff of nightmares.

The nearest Supercharger to me is the one that I lease expect to use. That's what home charging is good for.
Teh Cybertruck is going to be awesome for road trips.

Towing on a road trip is something that 1/2 ton pick-ups don't do great with either. Road trippers have much bigger trucks to haul with.

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[Mattsplat]

The nearest Supercharger to me is the one that I lease expect to use. That's what home charging is good for.
Teh Cybertruck is going to be awesome for road trips.

Towing on a road trip is something that 1/2 ton pick-ups don't do great with either. Road trippers have much bigger trucks to haul with.

I might be talking out of my area of experience but towing long distance in CT or any other EV truck seems like it would be an absolute nightmare. A quick fuel stop every few hundred miles getting poor gas mileage on a big tank in a truck seems like a financial burden and a convenient time efficient dream. With an EV? Endless stops with 45min-1hour charging and HAVING TO UNHOOK A TRAILER EACH TIME. Are you kidding? I worked construction to pay for flying lessons and become a pilot. Unhooking a trailer isn't the end of the world and only takes 5 minutes or so (getting everything parked straight, chocking wheels, undoing chains, unplugging power, cranking the trailer off the hitch (pain in the a$$ and the worst part of the process). Ok, done, now let's just head over to the charger for an hour. Ok done charging, let's head back and hook back up and reverse the whole process.
Ok, now repeat this process 5 times for a 375 mile trip out to the Nevada desert to spend a weekend dirtbiking and camping.
Someday Tesla might have lots of pull through chargers so trailers won't have to un-hitch, but that day is not today. Speaking of which...
I mostly charge at home so I haven't been to a lot of superchargers. For the ones I have been to, some of them didn't have any where at all to park a trailer. You would be driving down the road and leaving your trailer in some random parking lot, out of view for an hour while you charge. So add a few more minutes to the process for connecting a trailer hitch lock so your trailer full of expensive toys doesn't get stolen.
IF the $16k battery extender ever comes out, it will be required for making towing reasonable. But do you trust Tesla? I could totally see Tesla never making it and after seeing the failure of the CT as a useable truck, they decide to put a bigger battery in CT 2.0.

 

[Woodrick]

I might be talking out of my area of experience but towing long distance in CT or any other EV truck seems like it would be an absolute nightmare. A quick fuel stop every few hundred miles getting poor gas mileage on a big tank in a truck seems like a financial burden and a convenient time efficient dream. With an EV? Endless stops with 45min-1hour charging and HAVING TO UNHOOK A TRAILER EACH TIME. Are you kidding? I worked construction to pay for flying lessons and become a pilot. Unhooking a trailer isn't the end of the world and only takes 5 minutes or so (getting everything parked straight, chocking wheels, undoing chains, unplugging power, cranking the trailer off the hitch (pain in the a$$ and the worst part of the process). Ok, done, now let's just head over to the charger for an hour. Ok done charging, let's head back and hook back up and reverse the whole process.
Ok, now repeat this process 5 times for a 375 mile trip out to the Nevada desert to spend a weekend dirtbiking and camping.
Someday Tesla might have lots of pull through chargers so trailers won't have to un-hitch, but that day is not today. Speaking of which...
I mostly charge at home so I haven't been to a lot of superchargers. For the ones I have been to, some of them didn't have any where at all to park a trailer. You would be driving down the road and leaving your trailer in some random parking lot, out of view for an hour while you charge. So add a few more minutes to the process for connecting a trailer hitch lock so your trailer full of expensive toys doesn't get stolen.
IF the $16k battery extender ever comes out, it will be required for making towing reasonable. But do you trust Tesla? I could totally see Tesla never making it and after seeing the failure of the CT as a useable truck, they decide to put a bigger battery in CT 2.0.

My boat brought the range of my Model Y down to 75 miles. I was headed from Atlanta to Tampa (~440 miles) with it. Even my wife had the process down to a minute or two. But we didn't have to do it at every stop, we could charge while attached at about 1/4 of the stops. And I haven't seen a single Supercharger site where there wasn't a place to drop the trailer. I've probably been to over 50 Supercharger sites.

It's seeming as if the Cybertruck may do even better, just waiting to see.

 

[Mattsplat]

My boat brought the range of my Model Y down to 75 miles. I was headed from Atlanta to Tampa (~440 miles) with it. Even my wife had the process down to a minute or two. But we didn't have to do it at every stop, we could charge while attached at about 1/4 of the stops. And I haven't seen a single Supercharger site where there wasn't a place to drop the trailer. I've probably been to over 50 Supercharger sites.

It's seeming as if the Cybertruck may do even better, just waiting to see.

That is excellent info. Thanks for posting that. Two of the Superchargers I have been to are at Tesla sales center and the service center. Both of them would absolutely not have a spot and the service center is not exactly an area I would want to leave a trailer blocks away with expensive toys in it. You might be missing a motorcycle when you get back. Haha. I make sure I am packing when I take my car for service at Tesla SLC.

 

[Trimotor]

Give me this "dud" please !

 

[Crissa]

How can you say something meets or beats what is claimed, if you have not witnessed it?

Because it wasn't supposed to exist yet. Therefore it meets the promise.

-Crissa

 

[Crissa]

If Tesla had switched to non-metal curvy body with 12V architecture and regular wire-driving mode, they would have beaten Lightning and Rivian from get-go.

...No, they'd have been delayed by the pandemic, had different structural engineering delays, still had a disappointing battery, and couldn't meet the weight targets, and would" e missed all the durability targets they set?

No amount of changing the stainless steel could change the battery, pandemic, casting, and weight problems they had to be better.

-Crissa

 

[Woodrick]

That is excellent info. Thanks for posting that. Two of the Superchargers I have been to are at Tesla sales center and the service center. Both of them would absolutely not have a spot and the service center is not exactly an area I would want to leave a trailer blocks away with expensive toys in it. You might be missing a motorcycle when you get back. Haha. I make sure I am packing when I take my car for service at Tesla SLC.

I understand the issue at those locations. The amazing thing is that the Superchargers are open for public access there.
Many of them have removed public access to store/delivery/service centers, at least all mine have.

 

[Woodrick]

Give me this "dud" please !

I had convinced myself that I wasn't going to wrap my Cybertruck. These may change it.

 

[Woodrick]

If Tesla had switched to non-metal curvy body with 12V architecture and regular wire-driving mode, they would have beaten Lightning and Rivian from get-go.

If Tesla wanted to create "another F-150" that would have been easy.

But that's not a Tesla.

Yall just don't get what a Tesla really is. Complaining about the range capacity is like, well, telling Einstein that his hair is messed up.

Lots of little things make a Tesla. I got reminded of one today, when I turned on the turn signal to change lanes, it turned off after I changed lanes. What you say? Your vehicle does it also? You didn't hear what I said. Tesla turned off the turn signal after it realized that I was in a different lane. It didn't turn it off after 5 clicks. It looked for me to be in a different lane!

There are hundreds of these types of things that make a Tesla, a Tesla.


The Cybertruck wouldn't be what it is if Tesla didn't do the hard stuff.

 

[Trimotor]

He calls it a dud because the #1 thing Kyle wants is the 500+ mile range battery for towing and I bet by the end of the year there will be a Cybertruck with a much larger battery after the Giga Texas cathode plant and Corpus Christi Texas lithium refinery is done.

 

[Gurule92]

He calls it a dud because the #1 thing Kyle wants is the 500+ mile range battery for towing and I bet by the end of the year there will be a Cybertruck with a much larger battery after the Giga Texas cathode plant and Corpus Christi Texas lithium refinery is done.

I think they are probably maxed out on number of cells that can be in the pack. Just have to hope for chemistry improvements

 

[Gigahorse]

I think they are probably maxed out on number of cells that can be in the pack. Just have to hope for chemistry improvements

Agree, the batteries have got to get better. Plenty of tests in now to know the range numbers are problematic. Either a big software push is needed for some bug or battery chemistry needs to get way better.

 

[MountainRatMatt]

Wow, ease off the fanboy pedal a bit buddy. There are cool things about the CT for sure but let's just break that down.
1. Charging network: my nearest Supercharger is almost 40 miles away. That network is useless to me and road trips in the CT even if NOT towing are going to be terrible. Towing on a road trip will be the stuff of nightmares.
2. Steer by wire and sound system: according to others, definitely CT wins
3. Secure vault: all of them can be added they just don't roll up like CT and the CT leaks water and blocks rear view.
4. Mileage to pack size ratio: this means little if the useable range destroys useablity. If you take your dirtbike to the desert and can't get back, what good was the efficiency? CT range is to little for most of us plain and simple. I needs a bigger pack not just an efficient system.
5. Steel body: all of them? Maybe I am wrong but I believe the panels are steel on Rivian, Lightening, and Hummer (can anyone confirm this, I am not 100% sure)
CT is just thicker and harder steel and less prone to dent (much less from what I have seen)
6. Fast acceleration: All of them. EVs are fast.
7. Easy to maintain: all of them, all EVs are low maintenance due to the lack of mx needed for an ICE.
8. Bi-directional charging: Ford Lightning has this too

When you talk about "critical" thinking maybe you should try being a little more critical in both directions. There is a LOT to like about CT and a lot to be disappointed about. Can we just be honest though and lose the halo around Tesla. They have real competition in the market now and...hold on.....brace yourself.... perhaps the CT could end up selling a lot and still end up being a bit of a lemon not be a very good truck. We shall see. I will might take a chance because I am not a contractor and it is more of a commuter car that can carry a couch or a new fridge for me. But anyone in this market has some very good options. I lean toward the Cybertruck because I am an idiot and I constantly make bad investments. But damn, am I a sucker for the front view of that Cybertruck. I guess I just want to feel like I am driving a Mars Rover even though CT will be worth garbage in 2 years and be the biggest waste of money I have ever spent in my life.

1) Superchargers spaced 100 miles apart is all you need. Apartment dwellers excepted but the supercharger network is for long distance travel, charge at home for daily use. I never use the superchargers close to my house.
1a) I have used Electrify America and while it does function it will never be as good as the supercharger network.
2) True
3) Leaky = no good but the vault is much larger than a standard tonneau cover on other trucks. Rear view is solved with a camera.
4) See item 1, superchargers within 100 miles will suffice. Also, you'd be amazed at how ubiquitous plugs are, especially on overnight trips.
5) Stainless steel, steel, and aluminum are all different. The Cybertruck is the only one that is stainless steel. This is a big differentiator.
6) True
7) True
8) True

Sincerely,
A Certified Tesla Fanboy

 

[CyberTW]

If Tesla had switched to non-metal curvy body with 12V architecture and regular wire-driving mode, they would have beaten Lightning and Rivian from get-go. Range would have been awesome; price would have been great. They could have afforded to even have a quad motor. Nobody asked them to switch to higher volt or steer by wire or bullet resistant metal body or weird triangle design. They are in for the long haul. It's a bold bet they are taking.

I'm also disappointed with couple of things, but I understand the reasoning behind it. Complaining about promises made 4 years ago without fully understanding the entire picture sounds more like spouse complaining - "you promised me a gift every month before getting married". Sorry honey! Things change or situations change but things don't change.

It's not about what "Powers" the truck already has.. it's about what "Potential" it can unlock. Some see; some don't; some don't care; some complain.

Careful with these rational takes… there are some on here that won’t like to hear that haha

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