Foundation Series Remorse

[CyberTW]

wat

He claimed to have the education, I'm asking if he's confident - why is he so confused?

Seemed like a weird reply from Dapiya person

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[anionic1]

So you drive 70mph non stop in your MS?

That's what that range test was. Zero regen at all. 47 degrees. 70mph.

I'd imagine the actual mixed range would be 280-290 - which we were told 300+. But, regardless.... You claim to have an FS order in. Nothing has changed since the beginning of customer deliveries.

You own a Model S. You know how EV range works at some level.

I dont get why people think regen is the difference. I studied a lot of physics in the process of getting an engineering degree and there is no way you get more energy out of regen than is put in. it would be like saying you should have braked from 70 to 40 on the freeway every few miles to get some regen. That doesnt make any sense. Just for numbers sake. If that breaking generated 200 watts you will use at lease 200+ watts to recover from 40 to 70 if the systems were 100% efficient which they definitely are not. So lets say you need 250 watts to recover. You would loose energy not gain it.

Drag is exponentially related to speed. Driving 70 mph for a long period is the issue because the drag. ICE vehicles don't have this issue as much because combustion engines really suffer in stop and go city conditions due to RMP ramping and idling. Electric vehicles are much more efficient at stop and go. Studies have shown that electric vehicles see an almost 1% energy consumption increase for every mph they travel over 50 mph.

 

[anionic1]

The recent hwy range test from 100% was 265 miles at 70 in cold temps. Say from 80%, that is 203 miles. In this example, that is 2.9 hours of driving between charges.

Now take a more normal case where there is regen, and maybe some slower speeds, higher ambient temp, maybe some more economic wheels and tires, i think one could expect maybe 270 miles and 4 hours of driving between charges, which seems fine to me. With the exception of myself, I don't know many people who drive more than 4 hours without a break

But my grandparents drove 5 hours in a blizzard uphill both ways to get to school! without heated seats!

 

[anionic1]

Can someone please explain what they mean by “real world” range?

I mean, in terms that are meaningful to anyone


Because “real world” range around town is clearly infinite.

“Real world” for even ‘near town’ is effectively infinite.

“real world” is eg 318mi (AWD) if the trip is at an overall average of conditions of EPA combined testing (eg 55% city at avg 18mo, and 45% Hwy at avg 48mph), which represents a statistical mid-case for ‘real world’ conditions/speeds


separately, there appears to be instead a forum on the “real world” where someone hood on a hey and does an average of eg 68mph for 200mi straight

admittedly, that is a “real world” scenario - but, statistically, not a frequent one for the majority of drivers

But there is something to be said about a company advertising "estimated" ranges and almost zero percent of their vehicles ever actually get that range. I am an estimator by profession. I have to get within 2-3 percent of my estimates or I basically fail. Tesla has a vast pool of data and really should be more realistic or maybe say, this is the EPA range and this is the user data set range.

 

[Pops]

around 250 miles on the freeway.
...
Having to stop every 2 hours kind of changes the dynamic of the trip.

You drive at 125mph? Nice!

The test Out of Spec did to drain the battery was over 4 hours of driving.

 

[anionic1]

https://bollingermotors.com/b1-b2/

You can sign up here. They are taking hopium deposits. Yet one will likely get the dust from that fairy as well.

Sad that the B2 truck was my first choice. Would have paid up to $150k for it. Fits every need I could ever have.

That B2 is IMO probably the coolest truck ever if they can actually get it to production.

 

[Deleted member 8371]

The car was not in production. Therefore, it was a prototype.

I believe that truck was even a few feet longer and wouldn't fit in the average American garage.

Can you show me a Detroit early release/prototype vehicle that was 100% the production vehicle?

They tried to get what they indicated; they are still trying. I feel that what they got was a great compromise.

If it isn't for you, then move along. Complaining isn't going to get what you want.

So you say, we or those that disagree with YOU are complaining, this is whats wrong with this world anymore. I made a statement about what I felt, even going as far as saying not sure what I will do, NOT A COMPLAINT!! They said they would lower the SIZE but never said anything about lowering the mileage FROM 500 TO 250 and NEVER said a word about the ramp being taken away. AND I STILL DO NOT KNOW WHAT I WILL DO.

The car was not in production. Therefore, it was a prototype.

I believe that truck was even a few feet longer and wouldn't fit in the average American garage.

Can you show me a Detroit early release/prototype vehicle that was 100% the production vehicle?

They tried to get what they indicated; they are still trying. I feel that what they got was a great compromise.

If it isn't for you, then move along. Complaining isn't going to get what you want.

So you say, we or those that disagree with YOU are complaining, this is whats wrong with this world anymore. I made a statement about what I felt, even going as far as saying not sure what I will do, NOT A COMPLAINT!! They said they would lower the SIZE but never said anything about lowering the mileage FROM 500 TO 250 and NEVER said a word about the ramp being taken away. AND I STILL DO NOT KNOW WHAT I WILL DO. There YA GO woodrick...

 

[Outdoors]

So you say, we or those that disagree with YOU are complaining, this is whats wrong with this world anymore. I made a statement about what I felt, even going as far as saying not sure what I will do, NOT A COMPLAINT!! They said they would lower the SIZE but never said anything about lowering the mileage FROM 500 TO 250 and NEVER said a word about the ramp being taken away. AND I STILL DO NOT KNOW WHAT I WILL DO.

So you say, we or those that disagree with YOU are complaining, this is whats wrong with this world anymore. I made a statement about what I felt, even going as far as saying not sure what I will do, NOT A COMPLAINT!! They said they would lower the SIZE but never said anything about lowering the mileage FROM 500 TO 250 and NEVER said a word about the ramp being taken away. AND I STILL DO NOT KNOW WHAT I WILL DO. There YA GO woodrick...

ALL CAPS here and there. Yelling as you complain. Just saying.

Ramp. When is the last time you saw a ramp? Not at delivery to select few. Everybody knew there was no ramp then. Yet some just couldn't help themselves the credit card magically appeared and the numbers were entered.

 

[anionic1]

They gave everyone an EPA estimate. Why can't everyone understand that.

Enough already. You all act like your buying your first car and crying about it.

Y'all have money and are being cranky.

range anxiety. its a diagnosable illness now.

 

[anionic1]

For the majority, you drive 30 minutes to work, you run some errands, you charge at home and don’t think about it. In my industry, there are thousands of us that drive 150-250 mile round trips weekly with no charging at work. That’s just California and one workgroup. I realize that’s not a significant number in the grand scheme, but to me those highway numbers are important.

I know a lot of people in CA that are not happy with range. Our main office is 80 miles from many of our jobsites and often with meetings at multiple sites the range is quickly depleted. One friend lives in oceanside and drives up near LA for windshield repairs and he is constantly charging but it just part of his routine now and he is greatly benefitting from the gas savings, but power companies seem to be quickly working to benefit from the solar and EV scene in CA so lets see how long that holds.

 

[Deleted member 8371]

ALL CAPS here and there. Yelling as you complain. Just saying.

Ramp. When is the last time you saw a ramp? Not at delivery to select few. Everybody knew there was no ramp then. Yet some just couldn't help themselves the credit card magically appeared and the numbers were entere

What is the compliant? Becuse I made a ststment about certin thi

ALL CAPS here and there. Yelling as you complain. Just saying.

Ramp. When is the last time you saw a ramp? Not at delivery to select few. Everybody knew there was no ramp then. Yet some just couldn't help themselves the credit card magically appeared and the numbers were entered.

How would I know there was no ramp, just because they didn't talk about it lately? I have a right to say something about something I might be getting ready to spend 100 grand on, 500-mile range down to 250-miles, no matter what you say or think. PS - I do love Tesla, I have an S, doesn't mean It's complaint when you talk about differences. Plus there is no way to see what is available in it until your invited

 

[Woodrick]

I dont get why people think regen is the difference. I studied a lot of physics in the process of getting an engineering degree and there is no way you get more energy out of regen than is put in. it would be like saying you should have braked from 70 to 40 on the freeway every few miles to get some regen. That doesnt make any sense. Just for numbers sake. If that breaking generated 200 watts you will use at lease 200+ watts to recover from 40 to 70 if the systems were 100% efficient which they definitely are not. So lets say you need 250 watts to recover. You would loose energy not gain it.

Drag is exponentially related to speed. Driving 70 mph for a long period is the issue because the drag. ICE vehicles don't have this issue as much because combustion engines really suffer in stop and go city conditions due to RMP ramping and idling. Electric vehicles are much more efficient at stop and go. Studies have shown that electric vehicles see an almost 1% energy consumption increase for every mph they travel over 50 mph.

I believe that you are missing the power going to the brakes in an ICE. When braking in an ICE significant amount of power goes to the brakes and is wasted as heat. The "hyper-milers" know that and when they drive, it seems like they start stopping for a stop sign 2 miles before it.
Some EV studies have indicated that about 30% of their energy comes from regen.

You also have to remember for an ICE, you use power going up a hill and you waste it in idle going down a hill. An EV uses it similarly going up, but then nullifies the altitude by putting it back in.

I regularly go over the Smokies, a 4,000+ ft climb. On the way up, I'm using well over 999 watts/mi. And my range starts decreasing quickly. But then I start going down the hill, and regen starts putting more than 999 watts/mi back into the battery and the range goes up.
In an ICE, well, on older vehicles the brakes tend to overheat.

So it's not a conservation of energy thing, it's a recovery of lost energy thing.

And yes, once I cross the Smokies, my range comes back to what it would have been if the road had been flat (it's 3o+ miles of road to cross)

 

[Outdoors]

How would I know there was no ramp, just because they didn't talk about it lately? I have a right to say something about something I might be getting ready to spend 100 grand on, 500-mile range down to 250-miles, no matter what you say or think. PS - I do love Tesla, I have an S, doesn't mean It's complaint when you talk about differences. Plus there is no way to see what is available in it until your invited

Not invited yet. Then you have no remorse. You haven't made a deposit. Please excuse yourself from this thread until that time. You can get your deposit back. Go get it! CHEERS!

 

[Deleted member 8371]

Not invited yet. Then you have no remorse. You haven't made a deposit. Please excuse yourself from this thread until that time. CHEERS!

100 down 4 years ago, what are you talking about? So, all of us who have not gotten the e-mail yet should just shut up? Just asking, sure sounds like that is what you are saying. CHEERS!

 

[Outdoors]

100 down 4 years ago, what are you talking about? So, all of us who have not gotten the e-mail yet should just shut up? Just asking, sure sounds like that is what you are saying. CHEERS!

You got the email. Yet you can get your hundred bucks back. You didn't configure. Which depending on when you did it cost a non refundable deposit of either another $250, then later $1000.

People are coming here to say they put the deposit of $1000 down and now they wish they didn't.

You aren't in that camp. Please go camp someplace else.

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