Accident damage -- plastic bumper replacement / repair cost

[mprimo]

LOL, my wife refuses to drive it.

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[ÆCIII]

I am also in the camp with those believing Ultrasonic Sensors (USS) would still be very useful, for parking or parking lot situations like this, even if they're mostly never used otherwise or for FSD.

I don't mind eliminating something if the replacement/alternative solution functions fully the same making something unnecessary. However apparently, the software builds and/or Tesla vision perception for the Cybertruck is not yet refined for parking (maybe they'll include such refinements with the FSD capable build).

But, before I start to get critical or judgmental of Tesla's CT software build however (even though it obviously will be getting more updates), I think we would also need to see the sentry video and/or data indicating what warnings were sounded or displayed, because there might've been warnings given similar to what USS would've given.

Tesla usually is pretty thorough, so if they are confident in Tesla Vision or cameras to perform adequately without additional USS, then hopefully we'll see some comprehensive testing/demonstrations either by Tesla or those constantly testing FSD on social media.

But, if investigation proves no warning beeps were sounded when she approached to impact, in my opinion Tesla should likely pay for the damage or offer some kind of credit, pending a software update that would provide such warnings. I would hope that such feature is either active or planned in a near-future software update.

I think influencers with CTs should go ahead and perform a slow approach test to show us what if any sounds are indicated, when backing up about to hit something. The back of the Cybertruck has reduced visibility with the tailgate being up fairly high. Like others have mentioned, I also think the Cybertruck should have audible beep warnings for backup perception, as a standard feature without question.

- ÆCIII

 

[CTSoFL]

So I let my better half drive the CT for the first time. I explicitly told her to "not crash my baby". Less than 1 hour later I get a call that she crashed into another car. I love my wife to death and we all make mistakes so I am not mad. I feel horrible for the other person. We left a note and the other partly already reached out and we are working to make them whole again. Unfortunately they couldn't even open the door after this.

I am only posting this to show what to expect with a low speed accident for a "normal car" vs the CT.

UPDATE: Total cost to fix the CT at a Tesla owned repair shop was:
Parts (new plastic bumper and clips): $510
Labor (5.86 hours): $468.80
Discount on parts: -$255
Total: $744.84

Good to hear no one was hurt.

End of the day, its all just stuff.

A 6,000lb+ truck is gonna do that to a car. Your bumper looked barely more than loved scratched tbh.

 

[Ward L]

I think it is total BS our CT doesn’t have alarms to indicate you are getting close to something. Particularly with such limited vision. The rear camera helps but it is not substitute for an alarm. My old 14 year old F-150 I just sold has backup alarms! Sure, someday when “Tesla Vision” works….

 

[Pops]

I am also in the camp with those believing Ultrasonic Sensors (USS) would still be very useful, for parking or parking lot situations like this, even if they're mostly never used otherwise or for FSD.

I don't mind eliminating something if the replacement/alternative solution functions fully the same making something unnecessary. However apparently, the software builds and/or Tesla vision perception for the Cybertruck is not yet refined for parking (maybe they'll include such refinements with the FSD capable build).

But, before I start to get critical or judgmental of Tesla's CT software build however (even though it obviously will be getting more updates), I think we would also need to see the sentry video and/or data indicating what warnings were sounded or displayed, because there might've been warnings given similar to what USS would've given.
...

- ÆCIII

I agree with everything you said, but have already paid the $5000 deductible to fix both vehicles. I will not persue Tesla for this cost, as I feel it would be a fruitless effort.

Before anyone criticizes me for a 5k deductible, I have never been at fault for an accident in 25+ years, and this is my wife's first at fault. With the premium difference as long as I do not cause another accident in 3 years, I am still saving money over a lower deductible.

There is no visual or audio warning as you get close to a wall or stationary object. I know this because I back into my parking spot everyday and get as close as possible.

I am sure it will be added one day, but its not there today. Hopefully its accurate. Our Model Y has the new vision system that displays "STOP" in bright red letters on the display, but I do not recall an audio warning.

 

[ÆCIII]

I agree with everything you said, but have already paid the $5000 deductible to fix both vehicles. I will not peruse Tesla for this cost, as I feel it would be a fruitless effort.

Before anyone criticizes me for a 5k deductible, I have never been at fault for an accident in 25+ years, and this is my wife's first at fault. With the premium difference as long as I do not cause another accident in 3 years, I am still saving money over a lower deductible.

There is no visual or audio warning as you get close to a wall or stationary object. I know this because I back into my parking spot everyday and get as close as possible.

I am sure it will be added one day, but its not there today. Hopefully its accurate. Our Model Y has the new vision system that displays "STOP" in bright red letters on the display, but I do not recall an audio warning.

I get them in my Model 3 - but that may be because it is an earlier one with USS. I think Audible Warnings are needed and sometimes crucial.

- ÆCIII

 

[Cyberman]

So I let my better half drive the CT for the first time. I explicitly told her to "not crash my baby". Less than 1 hour later I get a call that she crashed into another car. I love my wife to death and we all make mistakes so I am not mad. I feel horrible for the other person. We left a note and the other partly already reached out and we are working to make them whole again. Unfortunately they couldn't even open the door after this.

I am only posting this to show what to expect with a low speed accident for a "normal car" vs the CT.

UPDATE: Total cost to fix the CT at a Tesla owned repair shop was:
Parts (new plastic bumper and clips): $510
Labor (5.86 hours): $468.80
Discount on parts: -$255
Total: $744.84

So I let my better half drive the CT for the first time. I explicitly told her to "not crash my baby". Less than 1 hour later I get a call that she crashed into another car. I love my wife to death and we all make mistakes so I am not mad. I feel horrible for the other person. We left a note and the other partly already reached out and we are working to make them whole again. Unfortunately they couldn't even open the door after this.

I am only posting this to show what to expect with a low speed accident for a "normal car" vs the CT.

UPDATE: Total cost to fix the CT at a Tesla owned repair shop was:
Parts (new plastic bumper and clips): $510
Labor (5.86 hours): $468.80
Discount on parts: -$255
Total: $744.84

b rf

Other car: 0
Cybertruck: I'ma walk this shit orf.

 

[HaulingAss]

Unfortunately Tesla learned from Apple. They asked themselves, "how many features can we remove and still charge the same price or more?".

Some of the hardware victims are:

• Ultrasonic sensors
• Instrument panels
• Steering column stalks
• Rain sensors

They have tried to replace some of those things with software solutions, but I think for the most part they have failed in every case to even match the functionality, let alone improve it.

Still charge the same price or more?

Tesla has been making their cars dramatically better and selling them for the lowest prices ever. The AWD Model 3, Model 3 Performance, Model Y, Model Y Performance, Model S, Model S Plaid, Model X, etc, all dramatically lower than they were years ago, when they were introduced and for the most part, at any time since.

Let that sink in, better cars, for less money, and that's not accounting for inflation that has the dollars worth less than ever!

No, Tesla is not charging the same price or more, they are charging a lot less for a better car.

 

[FlipSixThreeHole]

I think we'll get the park assist visualization when FSD comes. Probably even autopark. Works well on the Y.

For now I always use the button to pull up the camera screen....even when I nose in to parking. It displays guide lines like a backup camera.

At first, when I nose in parked, I would stop about 4 feet away from the curb!!! Such an oddity and visual illusion. With the front up camera I can go right up to the curb, but feel like I'm going way past it.

Same! Getting used to the “longness” now but on day one my park jobs were hilarious!

I remember once I left the back hanging way out, walking back to the truck about a city block away my friend said, “I can see your giant square ass from here!”

After she said that I’ve made a dedicated effort to park better ??

 

[Cyberfan123]

So I let my better half drive the CT for the first time. I explicitly told her to "not crash my baby". Less than 1 hour later I get a call that she crashed into another car. I love my wife to death and we all make mistakes so I am not mad. I feel horrible for the other person. We left a note and the other partly already reached out and we are working to make them whole again. Unfortunately they couldn't even open the door after this.

I am only posting this to show what to expect with a low speed accident for a "normal car" vs the CT.

UPDATE: Total cost to fix the CT at a Tesla owned repair shop was:
Parts (new plastic bumper and clips): $510
Labor (5.86 hours): $468.80
Discount on parts: -$255
Total: $744.84

That can be buffed out easily, unless you want a new wife.

 

[Friday]

I'm hoping the four wheel steering improvements will make parking backouts less stressful. As I have been going to my usual parking lots (pre CT delivery) I've been paying attention to the space and aisle sizes. I currently drive a Y so there's almost never an issue with parking space size. Transitioning back up to a larger vehicle (I had a Pacifica van before) will be a bit of a b*tch for a while.

I've always been a check the mirrors and rear window a million times before and during backing out kind of person. Never goes away even with all the cameras and such.

When I had the free FSD for a month, I found the autopark a fantastic feature and I think that will save a lot of stress for parking the CT in the future. Easier to pull forward then back out 100%.

 

[Pops]

Still charge the same price or more?

Tesla has been making their cars dramatically better and selling them for the lowest prices ever. The AWD Model 3, Model 3 Performance, Model Y, Model Y Performance, Model S, Model S Plaid, Model X, etc, all dramatically lower than they were years ago, when they were introduced and for the most part, at any time since.

Let that sink in, better cars, for less money, and that's not accounting for inflation that has the dollars worth less than ever!

No, Tesla is not charging the same price or more, they are charging a lot less for a better car.

I can prove the removal of some of these features didnt lower prices. Most of Tesla price reductions are due to competition, lack of sales and reduction of their once industry leading margins.

Here you can see for the M3 the prices didnt reduce after the removal of USS and Stalks, in fact they went up for multiple quarters until other market conditions came into play. I do not believe the M3 ever had rain sensors or an instrument panel so its hard to use the data to show its impact.

Most of these features removed cost less than $5 per car. So its easy to see how their removal would not impact price in anyway. I think it was Tesla being penny wise but pound foolish. I bet their development costs in the software solutions cost them as much or more than the hardware, and they are not nearly as effective (both sensors).

 

[HaulingAss]

I can prove the removal of some of these features didnt lower prices. Most of Tesla price reductions are due to competition, lack of sales and reduction of their once industry leading margins.

Here you can see for the M3 the prices didnt reduce after the removal of USS and Stalks, in fact they went up for multiple quarters until other market conditions came into play. I do not believe the M3 ever had rain sensors or an instrument panel so its hard to use the data to show its impact.

Most of these features removed cost less than $5 per car. So its easy to see how their removal would not impact price in anyway. I think it was Tesla being penny wise but pound foolish. I bet their development costs in the software solutions cost them as much or more than the hardware, and they are not nearly as effective (both sensors).

Let's not get caught up in the weeds here. Obviously, the cost to produce a vehicle is only one factor in the selling price.

But lowering the cost to produce does give Tesla the ability to lower prices as much as the market deems necessary to continually increase production and sell every car they make. And that is Tesla's goal, to accelerate the transition from fossil fuels by constantly increasing production of electric cars, and reducing the cost of those cars so they can expand their addressable market.

You need to step back and look at the big picture to see how simplifying production lowers costs over time. Even your chart shows that Tesla's cars cost less now than when they had ultrasonic sensors mounted in the bumpers. Considering how much less a dollar is worth now, the current cost of a Tesla is a LOT less than it was when sensors were removed.

 

[Pops]

Let's not get caught up in the weeds here. Obviously, the cost to produce a vehicle is only one factor in the selling price.

I am critical of Tesla, more so than most. But I own 2 Teslas. I am critical because I want them to do better and continue to convert the world to EVs. Removing effective proven technology and implementing inferior solutions is not going to help with that goal.

These changes had little to no impact on costs, and required additional development time on their less effective alternatives. I know you are a stockholder, but you have to be willing to acknowledge when they make mistakes as does Tesla themselves, how else will they improve?

I enjoy both my Teslas, and I want the company to succeed.

 

[HaulingAss]

These changes had little to no impact on costs, and required additional development time on their less effective alternatives.

You have obviously never run an auto manufacturing business and know little about it. All costs are additive, and the auto business requires extreme attention to detail to succeed. Most new automakers fail. Tesla is the first new American automaker to successfully reach profitability in 100 years. Chrysler was the last one before Tesla. The cost of ultrasonic sensors, and all the supporting hardware and wiring, over the life of the warranty, both to Tesla and to the end consumer, is real. Yet you just claimed it had little to no impact on costs without a shred of evidence.

I know you are a stockholder, but you have to be willing to acknowledge when they make mistakes as does Tesla themselves, how else will they improve?

As a lifelong investor I can tell you that most mistakes of established companies are generally only identifiable in hindsight. The collapse of Kodak, an iconic American company, caught many by complete surprise. And many things that at first appear to be mistakes are actually the correct path forward.

Many people thought it was a mistake in 2012 for Tesla to build the Supercharger Network. It would sink the company they said. Many people thought it was a mistake for Tesla to select a sedan, the Model S, as their first EV design. They said that sedans do not sell well and are falling out of popularity. I could go on and on about all the "mistakes" Tesla has made, according to people outside the company looking in. But what matters is results. Nobody is perfect, but Elon gets it more than most do.

It's not that he's without mistakes, but he makes a lot less than most people because he doesn't follow conventional widom. Dropping USS is another example of that. I can't say with 100% certainty it's not a mistake, but I'm going to go with the guy that has a proven track record of success, before I take the easy way out and conclude that since all other cars use USS, then so should Tesla. Elon goes with convention only when he determines it's the best path forward, not because it's conventional widom.

Who are you or I to say he's wrong? Only time will tell with certainty, so I'm going with the proven winner. Not some keyboard warrior who thinks he knows more than Elon Musk about running a car company. As an investor, I cannot be too cocky, I have to go with what works, with people that have a proven track record. I have to admit I don't know more than Elon Musk because it's my money on the line. Elon is a lot richer than I am for a reason, because he has better vision than I do. And true investing is all about vision, the ability to see further into the future than others. That's why Elon is winning, and RJ Scaringe is losing. People love their Rivian's, but Rivian cannot scale to profitability (and I really doubt the new models will achieve that). What successes does RJ have under his belt to prove he knows what he's doing? None that I'm aware of.

You are free to disagree with Elon, just do it with your own money. Maybe invest in Rivian (their bumpers are peppered with ultrasonics). LOL! And the stock has never been (much) less expensive than now! Are you a Rivian investor? Why doubt the man with the best-selling car in the world?

You ask how Tesla will improve if I don't acknowledge their (supposed) mistakes? Really? Why does their ability to improve hinge on little ol' me acknowleding their (supposed) mistakes? I'll school you on something important:

Tesla is successful because they are very quick to acknowledge their own mistakes. SpaceX is the same way. A company that doesn't do that, fails very quickly. Tesla is famous for quickly reversing course as soon as they realize they made a mistake, and they don't need me to tell them what's a mistake and what is not. They know when they've made a mistake before I know it. I could cite a very long list of mistakes that Tesla quickly reversed course on, but I won't waste the time. Why do you think they need me to tell them when they made a mistake? People like you tell them they are making big mistakes all the time, I'm glad they follow their instinct rather than listening to everybody like you.

People said it was a mistake for Elon to get rid of all the buttons and knobs. Tesla still doesn't have a dashboard full of buttons and knobs. Do you know why? Because it wasn't a mistake! The best-selling car in the world doesn't have a bunch of buttons and knobs either. Do you know why it doesn't? it's because the best-selling car in the world is a Tesla. That didn't just happen from a coincidence. Every automaker with a dashboard full of buttons and knobs would love to have the best-selling car in the world. Instead, it's Tesla.

Got it?

As an investor, I have to caution against thinking I know more than the proven masters of this world. That's how I regularly 10X my money. Do you know who Howard Schultz is? How about Irwin Jacobs? You don't win by following conventional wisdom, those with the best vision win. You can tell who they are because they are the ones with a track record of winning.

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