.

[jerhenderson]

...Let's stick with statistics not 'gosh, I saw an expensive one.'

-Crissa

I can't give you stats but they're common enough to not get a 'gosh' response.

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[FutureBoy]

So let's assume that in order to easily afford the CT4, someone will need to be at least a millionaire.
<snip>

So in the process of getting data for the post I did, I came across this article. With the media fear-mongering it would not surprise me if a similar trend were to develop in the US over time.

Bulletproof on a budget: forget the limo, Brazil’s bestselling armoured car is a Corolla
The market for low-cost and second-hand bulletproof cars is booming

In this file photo taken on December 15, 2017, an employee works on the installation of bulletproof para-aramid synthetic fibre inside an armoured car in Maua, Sao Paulo. Photo: Agence France-Presse

Brazilians are as worried as ever about getting shot while driving, but have less money in a stagnant economy to spend on protecting themselves.

Enter the second-hand bulletproof car.

Whether to provide genuinely-needed protection or just to show off, the bulletproofed personal vehicle has usually been associated with the rich, but in Brazil, armoured cars are far more common than in most countries.

Industry experts consider Brazil’s US$245 million bulletproofing industry the largest in the world. But with an economy only just crawling out of recession – one per cent growth in 2017 came on the heels of a steep two year-recession – worried drivers are searching for budget options.

“I like cars, but I don’t feel comfortable spending a lot of money on one,” said lawyer Mauricio Paulo, who drives a second-hand bulletproof Volvo XZ 60. This is the 40-year-old Paulo’s fourth armoured vehicle. He got his first armoured car after being robbed while he stopped at a traffic light. The birth of his daughter 18 months ago convinced him he still needs one – while staying frugal. “I need a bulletproof car because of lack of safety,” he said. “I went for a used car because I’m going to spend less money to move around safely.”

To modify a car costs around US$13,000, pretty much like buying an additional vehicle. Going for an already used and already armoured vehicle gets the price tag down by between 10 and 40 per cent, according to varying estimates from dealers and owners.

Another big market, Mexico, bulletproofed 2,986 cars in 2017, one of the best years the industry there has had. But even in a tough climate last year, Brazil’s armouring industry still put out over 15,000.

Armoured private vehicles are especially common among the middle class in the economic hub of Sao Paulo, regardless of the fact that the mega-city is one of the safest parts in an often extremely violent country. Almost three quarters of bulletproofing work is done in Sao Paulo state, and most of the country’s 150,000 armoured vehicles are also in the state, according to the bulletproofing association Abrablin. Neither Abrablin nor the used car sellers’ body Fenauto keeps track of second-hand armoured sales. But industry experts say it is a real trend here.

“This year, the used car market is hot,” said Fabio Rovedo de Mello, director of a Sao Paulo-based bulletproofing company. “Because of the situation the country is going through, the demand for used cars has gone up.”

Sales of new cars in general plummeted to a 10-year low in 2016 in Brazil. The niche market in new armoured cars mirrored the trend, dropping 20 per cent last year, compared to 2016. “When the new market doesn’t sell, there’s higher demand for used cars, because a person can’t afford to buy a new one,” said Abrablin president Marcelo Christiansen, who also heads up a bulletproofing firm.

“Armoured cars are a lot more expensive, so the option was to go for a used car that fell within my budget,” said Eliane Wakatsuki, 39, a manager at a hydroelectric firm, who was test-driving a used Mercedes-Benz GLA 200 at a luxury bulletproofing outfit.

Even those drivers who still buy new cars and get the armouring added are looking for deals. Last year, the bestselling new car for bulletproofing was the Toyota Corolla, the cheapest and smallest that can handle armour, which can add up to 12 per cent to the vehicle’s body weight.

Owners say high crime rates drive them to seek extra security. Some international companies based in Brazil compel their expat employees to drive armoured vehicles. But whether the cars are needed is another question. Sao Paulo, Brazil’s richest state, had the lowest murder rate in the country in 2016, the last year for which comparative figures are available. There were 10.9 murders per 100,000 people against a national average of 30.3, while Sergipe state in the northeast had 64.7.

“Having a bulletproof car in Brazil is about status. People are more worried about status than they are about their own safety,” Christiansen said. “The wife gets angry, because the neighbour has one and she doesn’t, so she tells her husband: ‘I need a bulletproof car.’”

For Paulo, the armoured vehicle may bring security, but also a troubled conscience. “Those who have a bit more resources can protect themselves better,” he said. “Those who don’t can even lose their lives over something small.” “You feel bad, because people are separated by their economic power in third-world countries and that’s sad.”

 

[Firetruck41]

Anecdotally, I can't drive 10 blocks without seeing a handful of $70-90k full size SUvs and/or pickups... and a couple Tesla's. IMHO, that price point won't be too much of a hurdle out here in Suburbia.

 

[charliemagpie]

A 'truck' implies many applications

Elon doesn't give away business.
Observing everything he does, most average humans flail at various junctures, but not Elon.. HE IS a machine.

Unbelievable stamina to just keep plugging away… as if he is just innovating in his first business. Most humans stop right there, but not Elon.

He just starts the next day afresh, as if he has yet to accomplish anything. This is not normal.

Pls read this as a humble comment : reread what I just said. We are talking about an exception on Earth.

CT will be made for the majority of truck uses at the most affordable price, it will evolve.

It will be the truck to end all other trucks. It makes sense to do that, and it shall be so.

Amen or , Yiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiihaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!?

 

[Eye of Elon]

And wtf is trolling for comments?

I believe it's a very negative way of saying, "That's a reasonable question and thank you for keeping the forums on life support the next 9 months, while we wait for actual Cybertruck news to start coming out."

 

[Throwcomputer]

Not only does it save the most common kind of damage from happening, it also saves the owners time in not having to schedule the dent removal and re-painting.

Spoken like a true non-truck owner!

I've never seen a truck owner repair dents and paint scratches. In fact I see more trucks with massive dents, scrapes and bruises than not. A guy down the street "repaired" his destroyed truck bed by swapping it out for a slightly less destroyed truck bed in the wrong paint color! Slow clap.

Joking aside, my point is that truck owners who repair dents and scratches exist.. but they are most certainly not the majority of truck owners... hence not a great example of cost savings in a common ownership lifetime of a truck.

 

[John Forde]

I would like to know where that demand cliff is because I am willing to pay just a little bit more to get my CT earlier.

 

[Tinker71]

I was reading about the F150 Limited and it's history. It is basically an F150 configured with the most expensive available options for the truck and some options only available to this top trim.
It tops out at about $84k and has alway been close to 3x the price of the base model.

The Limited has never accounted for more than 1% of overall F150 sales. So very few people are willing to step up to that price point.

I know at $70k, CT3 has a good percentage of the reservations but as Elon alluded, there is a price cliff beyond which willing buyers drop off drastically.

This being a pickup, i dont see a big market for a $85k CT4 or plaid. As unique as it may be, most couldn't afford it and many who can couldn't stomach it. What are your thoughts.

I agree. Tesla needs to keep their top trim below $80k for mass market penetration. The problem is the CT3 is too good. It exceeds the range of all Tesla's, with seating for 6, AWD and wicked acceleration plus off-road and towing capabilities. Why would you buy any other Tesla that cost more. Unless your really want a sedan/small SUV.

Tesla will be battery constrained for the next several years. This is a major problem for CT3 reservation holders.

 

[CyberGus]

I can't give you stats but they're common enough to not get a 'gosh' response.

"Selection bias is the bias introduced by the selection of individuals, groups, or data for analysis in such a way that proper randomization is not achieved."
- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selection_bias

In Austin I can't go anywhere without seeing multiple Teslas, leading me to the belief they are quite popular. However, I recently spent some time in upstate NY, where a Tesla sighting was a notable event, making them very rare.

While the act of gazing out your window can provide interesting information, it is only 1 data point that cannot logically be extrapolated to everything else.

 

[CyberGus]

You're the hardcore enthusiast with funds. Not everyone is that.

I don't have funds, I just don't care about my credit score

 

[jerhenderson]

"Selection bias is the bias introduced by the selection of individuals, groups, or data for analysis in such a way that proper randomization is not achieved."
- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selection_bias

In Austin I can't go anywhere without seeing multiple Teslas, leading me to the belief they are quite popular. However, I recently spent some time in upstate NY, where a Tesla sighting was a notable event, making them very rare.

While the act of gazing out your window can provide interesting information, it is only 1 data point that cannot logically be extrapolated to everything else.

I get your point, but trucks are very common here and contractors tend not to get cheap work trucks here... they want comfort and features = $$$$

 

[jerhenderson]

I don't have funds, I just don't care about my credit score

that'll upset banks haha

 

[Crissa]

I get your point, but trucks are very common here and contractors tend not to get cheap work trucks here... they want comfort and features = $$$$

Not arguing that trucks haven't gotten frilly lately.

But it's been well demonstrated that a 10k increase in price can drop the potential market by 90%.

Even with the expectation of inflation raising what buyers are willing to pay (not what they can pay), there are a bunch of trucks all available at a high price, but less buyers willing to jump for them. If someone could buy an $80+k truck, they probably will more easily go for the Rivian, Ford, or Silverado.

How many stay for Cybertruck features? Probably an equal amount, honestly.

But it's still not the same mass market appeal.

-Crissa

 

[rr6013]

Just like Cybergus said, the Plaid will eventually be the top option, of the many options available, once Tesla goes into full production. Nobody knows how many Plaids, Tesla will produce. Very few people need a truck with that much power. But as the first Cybertruck out of the gate while production gets ironed out, Tesla will sell as many as they can make for a while

Money is mute…later, read on.

A startification occurred since Cybertruck was announced. The pickup has gone from 4x4, RWD,AWD,4WD to 4AD. Cybertruck is the later 4 axel drive variant meaning 4 motors-4 drive axels.
Rivian 4WD; 4 motors-4 wheel drive hasn’t won the BEV 4x4 technology 4X gambit yet. BUT did tip the worlds #1 EV maker’s Tri-motor over for the 4X bragging rights at stake.

The pickup long ago separated man from its rational thinking side of its brain. Whether $40k, 85k, 100k…2000k a hyper pickup wouldn’t stop the motivated aficionado.
Body Matt Rimac mods i.e. rear wheel arch scoop treatment, Porsche aero vented spoiler flip up and front Air Grille louvers to channel flow around sides and out the rear would “advance” Cybertruck into the statusphere (sp)intentional.

Tesla innovates a new adaptive track axel technology for wheels and tyres that will squeeze inward and outward ‘cuz AI keeping balanced Qd Performance and Whr Efficiency ”hyper” Cybertruck attracting upgraders and providing maximum Tesla Safety.

#1 reason d’être that Cybertruck hooked me, was cyber. There isn’t a limit to which cyber can enbrace. Fixtures in contemporary automotive stamped design dissolve under cyber treatment. The whole truck is open.

 

[Cybertruckee]

I have a reservation for F150 Lightning Lariat that will hit $70K for the 300-mile range I want.

But at that price, I'm still hesitating and told my dealer to put me at the end of the queue.

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