[CLOSED DUE TO POLITICS] "White House considers vehicle mileage tax to fund infrastructure"

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BillyGee

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That person would justify their salary on about 1 week of labor per year.
Which according to the CA DMV is going to have a few extra zeroes on the end of it.





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Crissa

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In east coast, we have to pay toll on many roads. so, we have to double pay?
Well, tolls don't pay for anything but that specific stretch, and they rarely actually cover even that. Tolls are super-inefficient.

But even with that inefficiency can be useful: Like reducing or optimizing use in places there can not be as many lanes as could be consumed: Bridges, urban cores, etc. And we're getting more efficient at collecting them; see also plate readers and bills that go to the registration.

It would be nice if these were standardized across the interstate system.

-Crissa
 

wkeithhill

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"...It has been estimated that just one of these container ships, the length of around six football pitches, can produce the same amount of pollution as 50 million cars. The emissions from 15 of these mega-ships match those from all the cars in the world...."

...because you read it on the Internet it must be true...
 

Challeco

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It’s an easy solution. When you renew your plates, they check your odometer. Pay for the miles driven. I drive a lot more miles than the average person, which unfortunately means I should pay more. It’s only fair.
No. It sounds fair. But it works out to be a regressive tax again. Miles driven does not equate to wealth, as a matter of observation it is an inverse relationship. The wealthier a person is the less they have to commute. Pay per use is a trap. Those who require the use of the transportation system are not the one's driving the miles. For example Amazon contracts out some of their deliveries, most of their employees commute to their jobs, and yet not all of those miles are charged to Amazon's account. I use Amazon as an example, not as the sole example.
 

Challeco

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I don't recognize your authority to tell me how much money I "need"
The statement wasn't how much money you need. It was about the necessity of additional tax breaks for the wealthy.
 

Challeco

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In Ohio, I know I will have to pay a $200 EV fee for my vehicle renewal. It's been explained to me that's about the same as tax on 10 gallons of gas a week.

If I understand the proposal of you get taxed for every mile you drive. I easily but 13,000 miles a year on a car. Probably more. One year I put on over 18,000 miles on a Buick.

my average year
0.018 X 13,000 = $234.00

Oregon’s tax rate of 1.8 cents per mile is equivalent to the 36-cent gas tax paid by a vehicle that gets 20 miles per gallon. Someone driving about 11,500 miles a year would pay about $207. That leaves owners of hybrids paying more than they otherwise would. It would be a good deal for drivers of large SUVs or pickup trucks, but in 2019, the legislature limited enrollment of new vehicles to those that get at least 20 miles per gallon.

In this case, $200 a year renewal is a deal.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/transportation/interactive/2021/electric-mileage-tax/
It isn't though. It almost mandates that ONLY those who are wealthy will afford electric vehicles. As an Oregonian, a rural Oregonian in a county that is full of subsistence level citizens, electric vehicles are a LUXURY. There is no way we are going to usher in an electric infrastructure if we keep offering the carrot on a stick. We need to amortize the tax burden across all citizens, corporations, and other entities in order to entice those who log the miles with an actual benefit of lower cost of use. If we keep moving the goal posts with raising regressive taxes when we still do not have electric vehicles that are affordable to MOST people, we are going to stall our move away from carbon based fuels. To be honest here, I financed a Model 3 with $3500 down and a good 2.9% interest rate and I am still paying almost $600/mo. This is not a monthly payment that possible for most of the people where I live. My anecdotal evidence is the professionals that I work with hear that I pay $564/mo and they think I am ridiculous. Add on special extra taxation and it sours the deal even more, regardless of the "equality" of the initial taxation.
 

Revoltlution

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Actually, I’m with the government on this. Most states pay for their roads with a gas tax.... Miles driven just makes more sense.
I'm ok with this, IF, there is a carbon tax to move the needle from ICE to EV. After we're all in EVs, we're back to an even playing field.
It will have to change again when the world is primarily robotaxis :unsure:
 

datechboss101

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I'm ok with this, IF, there is a carbon tax to move the needle from ICE to EV. After we're all in EVs, we're back to an even playing field.
It will have to change again when the world is primarily robotaxis :unsure:
There's a ton of taxes for ICE already! And barely any tax for EV. There should be some taxes on EVs too.
 
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  • Thread starter
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I'm ok with this, IF, there is a carbon tax to move the needle from ICE to EV. After we're all in EVs, we're back to an even playing field.
It will have to change again when the world is primarily robotaxis :unsure:
Ice cars/trucks/vans/jeeps... add insignificant amounts of pollution/CO2 to the environment relative to the following:

Bulk carrier ships, one of these monstrosities pollute as much as 50 million cars. 16 (sixteen) release as much pollution as ALL cars in the world do. Now, depends where you look there are anywhere from minimallly 5222 and up to 90,000 of these things beboppin around at various times.

So, picture if you will, how much pollution is released.

By the way it is estimated that 60,000 deaths per year can be attibuted to these. I do believe cars should be pollution free but they are scapegoats/distractions /a red herring ( look over there NOT here) to the real polluters.

The field should be levelled.
 
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Luke42

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It isn't though. It almost mandates that ONLY those who are wealthy will afford electric vehicles. As an Oregonian, a rural Oregonian in a county that is full of subsistence level citizens, electric vehicles are a LUXURY.
As someone who grew up in the Appalachian part of Virginia, I would say the same about new vehicles of any kind -- regardless of the powertrain.

Like Terry Pratchett's boots, this yet is another reason it's expensive to be poor.
 

Luke42

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Ice cars/trucks/vans/jeeps... add insignificant amounts of pollution/CO2 to the environment relative to the following:

Bulk carrier ships, one of these monstrosities pollute as much as 50 million cars. 16 (sixteen) release as much pollution as ALL cars in the world do. Now, depends where you look there are anywhere from minimallly 5222 and up to 90,000 of these things beboppin around at various times.

So, picture if you will, how much pollution is released.

By the way it is estimated that 60,000 deaths per year can be attibuted to these. I do believe cars should be pollution free but they are scapegoats/distractions /red herring ( look over there NOT here) to the real polluters.

The field should be levelled.
Yes, there is more than one problem to solve in the world.

There's no shame in harvesting the low-hanging fruit first.

P.S. Ship-based emissions are not an unsolvable problem. Disney Cruise Lines is planning to use less-dirty LNG on their newest ships:
https://www.offshore-energy.biz/disney-cruise-line-orders-three-new-lng-fueled-cruisers/
The business constraints for a cruise ship are clearly different than that of a cargo ship, but technological building blocks are there. Let's use fossil fuels where they provide the most benefit, and conserve when have the option. Those who act to conserves our resources could even call themselves "conservative"!
 
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Crissa

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Ice cars/trucks/vans/jeeps... add insignificant amounts of pollution/CO2 to the environment relative to the following:
This is a useless argument.

Just because something is small, doesn't mean they don't add up. 60% of US transportation carbon emissions are from passenger cars. And the portion is even higher is you look at sources of smog and other air pollution.

-Crissa
 

dtruckman

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...That money is paying for the vaccinations and keeping people from spreading the cases... Are you really saying you shouldn't have taken that Tylenol because your fever went down?

Anyhow, I'm wondering how they'll get mileage without costing us more than we're making off it.

But per mile would get more low-range EVs on the road than big flat fees like we're seeing in some states.

-Crissa
Bravo Crissa the Neanderthals' are out again
 

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