Electrek: Dems propose new $12,500 electric car rebate, Tesla left with $4,500 disadvantage

[Cybertruckee]

Anti BEV bill
Ford gm Chrysler want to kill all BEV companies until they can transition to BEV companies (20 year s from today)
It is just that simple this is a anti BEV bill and a pro ICE bill. It gives ICE the time (20 years) to become BEV companies.
There is no short cut to a BEV company,
No today ICE Tomorrow BEV
You have to gut the entire ICE factory. That is what Tesla has done, that is what Ford gm Chrysler have to do and that takes 20 years.
Ford gm Chrysler have tried to jump to BEV they can not do it. It is not possible to go from ICE to BEV.

Ford seems to use their ICE F150 platform for their F150 Lightning.

Can't they just retool to smoothly transition? Appears to be doing that on the same manufacturing/assembly lines and facilities.

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[Cybertruckee]

Well
No Ford can not do it.
GM can not do it.
You have to buy or build a Battery first then BEV and gm tried to buy BEV batteries and now are in $10 Billion trouble.
Ford will have the same problem. Tesla name to fame is a Panasonic battery in house BEV batteries.
Ford gm Chrysler are ICE and can not build batteries in house and that is what it takes to be a BEV company.

Dang, and I thought it's just like buying flashlight off Lowes counter. You buy the flashlight case first, then buy the batteries to make it work!

 

[Sirfun]

Dang, and I thought it's just like buying flashlight off Lowes counter. You buy the flashlight case first, then buy the batteries to make it work!

What a novel thought. What's also funny/strange to me is how there's this argument that EV's are simple to build and take less labor. Yet, these OEMs can't do it.

 

[firsttruck]

Dang, and I thought it's just like buying flashlight off Lowes counter. You buy the flashlight case first, then buy the batteries to make it work!

Sure they could make a EV like Lowes flashlight case first, then buy the batteries and get an EV of same quality. Poor to mediocre.

 

[Ogre]

What a novel thought. What's also funny/strange to me is how there's this argument that EV's are simple to build and take less labor. Yet, these OEMs can't do it.

It's easy to build an EV. Just buy a truckload of batteries a few electric motors and away you go.

It's difficult to make an EV that performs well, has decent range, charges quickly, has good cargo capacity, and doesn't cost a mint.

GM is going the flashlight route, that's why the Hummer weighs 9,000+ pounds and only goes 300 miles or so.

 

[Ogre]

Sure they could make a EV like Lowes flashlight case first, then buy the batteries and get an EV of same quality. Poor to mediocre.

This reminds me of when Sandy Munro was reviewing the Kia Niro and opened up the frunk only to see there was an engine in there. He was genuinely confused at first. Apparently Kia's first EVs shared a platform with their non-EVs so they even put the electric engine in the engine compartment... aka-the frunk.

 

[Crissa]

Note: I am absolutely not a republican either.

Math says you don't have a choice. Take Democrats down, and you get Republicans rushing in to fill the gap.

That's why supporting things is better than tearing things down.

-Crissa

 

[Crissa]

Err... wot?

It gifts people $7500 - 12,500 to buy an EV.

Not sure how you can say this.

The bill may give $4500 to $9500 to plugin hybrids as written, for a battery smaller than the one in my bike.

-Crissa

 

[Ogre]

The bill may give $4500 to $9500 to plugin hybrids as written, for a battery smaller than the one in my bike.

-Crissa

It's a good point. So Ford can keep crank out PHEV cars and trucks and claim more than Tesla gets for pure BEV.

A buddy of mine bought that PHEV Rubicon Jeep, he goes most of the week without burning a drop of gas. Then gets 5 miles out of town and is suddenly he's getting an "impressive" 20 Miles Per Gallon!

The idea that that would get more subsidies than the Model Y is just infuriatingly broken. That hole needs to be closed. This is just a shitty way to allow big auto to rake in profits for building compliance cars.

 

[ÆCIII]

Corruption - pure, simple, and in our faces.

Of course Tesla doesn't need such corrupt help because they are Better than all those degenerate tactics - but regardless it is still pure corruption.

A smart astute car buyer would realize that even with legacy EV offerings having a $4500 additional discount, a Tesla is still far superior for the money. Over a five to ten year cost-of-ownership experience, the stealership service department scam skim gouging tactics will take that $4500 and much more from owners in 'maintenance' costs, while giving the legacy EV owner a sub-par quality car in return.

But UAW infested ICE car companies are counting on buyers who will not be smart, and instead are hoping there will be enough uninformed naïve short-sighted sheep out there to sustain them for a little longer. Joey is helping them on that degenerate path because that's how he thinks. Unions and 'stealership' associations believe they are smarter than car owners; and car owners are to be manipulated and controlled - in much the same way as a corrupt politician thinks of the people.

The corrupt unions and car 'stealership' associations have long infested and entangled the legacy ICE car companies like a massive fibrous cyst - squeezing and choking them from logical substantive paths for integrity and long term growth. The degenerate heavy overhead costs of dealerships and unions have also compromised the resulting car that gets delivered to owners. This has been a major cause of their downfalls putting them where they are today.

This is the very reason that Tesla should Never Ever be part of a union, because it would mean being part of a political fibrous cyst of corruption that resorts to subverting tax-payer money in proposed bills such as this, to steal handouts - instead of building a culture of integrity to strategically grow and strengthen for being prepared when market conditions get tough.

I don't think these corrupt tactics by the unions or politicians will age well at all. I also think it shows the wider public what unions are (really) all about.

 

[Cybertruckee]

What a novel thought. What's also funny/strange to me is how there's this argument that EV's are simple to build and take less labor. Yet, these OEMs can't do it.

Industry experts are saying the Tesla/Panasonic partnership is decades away in the battery technology.

I wonder how Toyota missed this. They are just neighbors in Japan and Toyota pioneered EV.

 

[SwampNut]

Math says you don't have a choice.

Untrue.

That's why supporting things is better than tearing things down.

Both groups should be torn down and neither deserve support. Like in this case, the democrats supporting government enforcement of business principles by basically fining the buyers of unapproved companies. Tesla is the only successful free-market and liberty-driven car maker right now, and the statists want to tear that down. Tear them down instead. I'm supporting Tesla.

 

[Cybertruckee]

That's why supporting things is better than tearing things down.

-Crissa

The American psyche.

Even in team sports. They are not just for the home team. They need to hate the other team from across the pond (Dodgers fan had to hate the Giants).

No wonder we had to be in some foreign war. Otherwise, we will be in each other's throat.

 

[SwampNut]

Sports are a huge part of the problem. This is what creates jingoism in children, and wires them to be this way. I was hoping the kneeling idiocy would finally kill off a large amount of the sportsball crap. Not to mention the ridiculous waste of it all and the environmental impact.

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