If an M3 can do this!!?

Ryan95738

Well-known member
First Name
Ryan
Joined
Jan 24, 2020
Threads
2
Messages
119
Reaction score
71
Location
Skagit Valley
Vehicles
CyberTruck
Occupation
CNA
Country flag
Yes: The law is you have to pull over if traffic stacks behind you. There are posted pull-outs for this purpose, but any paved shoulder will do. The maximum speed for towing is 55.

-Crissa
That is how the law is written yes, but in actuality most semis will go about 65 mph and it is not uncommon for people to pull their boat or whatever they have at whatever speed the traffic is going. What I am saying is practically people like to go faster than the law allows.

 

android04

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 28, 2020
Threads
2
Messages
253
Reaction score
474
Location
Crete, NE
Vehicles
2018 Tesla Model 3 LR RWD, Tesla Cybertruck Tri-motor (reserved)
Country flag
Here's a newer video with more details about the custom tow hitch installed on the Model 3 AWD that allows it to safely tow a 6000 lb Airstream. The custom weight distribution hitch is shown, and they talk about how rear overhang is more important than wheelbase. I imagine a Tow Mode on Cybertruck would keep it at a low height to help with center of gravity and stiffen up the suspension.
 
OP
OP

Zooman001

Active member
First Name
Marc
Joined
Feb 19, 2020
Threads
6
Messages
25
Reaction score
35
Location
Canada
Vehicles
Cybertruck
Occupation
Air traffic controller
Country flag
Here's a newer video with more details about the custom tow hitch installed on the Model 3 AWD that allows it to safely tow a 6000 lb Airstream. The custom weight distribution hitch is shown, and they talk about how rear overhang is more important than wheelbase. I imagine a Tow Mode on Cybertruck would keep it at a low height to help with center of gravity and stiffen up the suspension.
I have posted pics of this before, this is my RV dealer and they are the best of the best when it comes to towing. People drive from all over North America to have Canam setup their rigs.
 

Oobbeeddoo

Member
First Name
Bryn
Joined
Aug 11, 2020
Threads
1
Messages
15
Reaction score
13
Location
UK
Vehicles
MGTF 160
Occupation
Environmental professional
Country flag
I'm more worried about the tung weight and the trailer brakes. The tung weight on that Airstream is probably to be at least 300lbs, and is probably more like 500lbs.

The 3 can haul that kind of weight in the back seat, but putting that kind of weight several inches a couple of feet aft of the rear axle? Eek!

I'll stay away, thank you very much!!!

P.S. In Europe, there's a lower towing speed limit of around 100km/h, and even light trailers are required to have brakes -- which means you can tow more with a small car than you can in the US. In the US, vehicles towing trailers are expected to travel the same speed as other traffic. My comments are based on my experience towing in the US with American traffic rules.
Yes in the UK trailers / towed machinery over 750kg has to be braked, but vehicles have to be capable. I did a lot of towing using 4x4s & light trucks & found manufacturers figures to be optimistic, especially older Landrover vehicles.

Basically, it was always to keep the trailer & load to less than the vehicle. The figure of 85% comes to mind. Trailer driving tests are mandatory for over 750kg.
 
OP
OP

Zooman001

Active member
First Name
Marc
Joined
Feb 19, 2020
Threads
6
Messages
25
Reaction score
35
Location
Canada
Vehicles
Cybertruck
Occupation
Air traffic controller
Country flag
Yes in the UK trailers / towed machinery over 750kg has to be braked, but vehicles have to be capable. I did a lot of towing using 4x4s & light trucks & found manufacturers figures to be optimistic, especially older Landrover vehicles.

Basically, it was always to keep the trailer & load to less than the vehicle. The figure of 85% comes to mind. Trailer driving tests are mandatory for over 750kg.
Very archaic rules, so how do you tow a 12000lbs trailer, you need a semi?
 


KrodEKid

Well-known member
First Name
Ben
Joined
Jul 1, 2020
Threads
6
Messages
126
Reaction score
313
Location
Ohio
Vehicles
Toyota corolla, Mazda 5
Country flag
Debating starting new post for this... truck king YouTube video shows some details about towing and range M3 for an Airstream. Not heavy on numbers, but informative for towing.
 

Oobbeeddoo

Member
First Name
Bryn
Joined
Aug 11, 2020
Threads
1
Messages
15
Reaction score
13
Location
UK
Vehicles
MGTF 160
Occupation
Environmental professional
Country flag
Very archaic rules, so how do you tow a 12000lbs trailer, you need a semi?
Archaic? Just the opposite. Our rules have evolved from similar to what you have.
To tow a 12k lbs trailer (that's about 5.4 metric tonnes) legally you'd need a 16k or 7.5 metric tonne truck or larger I expect. 4x4s simply aren't big enough by our rules. This makes sense in the UK.
 
OP
OP

Zooman001

Active member
First Name
Marc
Joined
Feb 19, 2020
Threads
6
Messages
25
Reaction score
35
Location
Canada
Vehicles
Cybertruck
Occupation
Air traffic controller
Country flag
Archaic? Just the opposite. Our rules have evolved from similar to what you have.
To tow a 12k lbs trailer (that's about 5.4 metric tonnes) legally you'd need a 16k or 7.5 metric tonne truck or larger I expect. 4x4s simply aren't big enough by our rules. This makes sense in the UK.
Trailers are built to be able to stop themselves. They must do this or else they are unsafe to tow.
 


HaulingAss

Well-known member
First Name
Mike
Joined
Oct 3, 2020
Threads
4
Messages
1,716
Reaction score
3,251
Location
Washington State
Vehicles
2010 Ford F-150, 2018 Tesla Model 3 Performance
Country flag
In California, Oregon, Washington, you're expected not to exceed 55mph with any trailer.
I've never heard of that rule in Washington or Oregon.

And isn't the biggest problem with towing the leverage? That a light vehicle can be thrown around by the mass and drag of the trailer? But EVs are heavy and low center of gravity compared to the same ICE car.
True, Tesla's have really excellent towing dynamics. Not that I've ever towed with a Tesla but I've been towing things my entire life with all kinds of vehicles and some are better than others. It's not always the vehicles tow rating that determines how well it will tow (and the specific trailer and tires on both units play a large part too). Some tow vehicles are downright scary well below their rated limits, even with a reasonable tow setup. Beware of flexy frames (both in the trailer and the tow vehicle)!

The strength and flex of the frame is supposed to be accounted for in the tow ratings but I have driven a number of vehicles that, while they worked, were not confidence inspiring even when the trailer was well under the vehicles rated capacity. All were body on frame pick-ups, SUV's or vans. On the other hand, I've towed with a number of unibody vehicles at or near their rated limits and never felt unsafe. Chassis rigidity has a lot to do with it and it seems this is underappreciated when manufacturers rate their vehicles. Because trailer sway and the eventual loss of control this can and does cause is far easier to initiate if the frame is flexy. It can act like a big spring.

Another important factor is how close the hitch is to the rear axle. Some vehicles have too much rear over-hang to make good tow vehicles. Tesla's are very good in this regard. It costs more to make a longer wheelbase vehicle but the benefits are numerous when compared to the same sized vehicle with a shorter wheelbase.

People now days think you need a pick-up to tow a travel trailer (or at least a very large SUV). Guess what? I grew up before there was such a thing as a big SUV - most large travel trailers were towed by a four dour sedan r a station wagon! Cadillacs, Oldsmobiles and Buicks were known to be superior but not everyone could afford that so any large sedan or station wagon would be used. A Model 3 would be superior to ALL of them - better brakes, better suspension, more rigid chassis, less rear overhang, lower center of gravity and with the added benefit of more than enough power.
 
Last edited:

Iacemoe

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 16, 2020
Threads
1
Messages
55
Reaction score
108
Location
Indiana
Vehicles
2016 Ram 1500 <> 1970 Chevy C10 Stepside Custom
Occupation
Drug Dealer
Country flag
I'm just going to leave this here...


Know Your Towing Terms
Gross Vehicle Weight Rating (GVWR)
This is the weight of the vehicle plus the maximum allowable weight for occupants and cargo that the vehicle can safely handle. The GVWR is shown on the vehicle’s certification label on the driver’s doorjamb. Note that trailer weight is not added against the GVWR, but the tongue weight of the trailer is.
Gross Combined Weight Rating (GCWR)
The maximum weight of the vehicle and loaded trailer that can be handled safely, without risking damage. This includes all cargo and occupants. Though the GCWR for your truck is not usually found on the label on the truck’s doorjamb, it can be found in the towing section of each truck manufacturer’s website.
Payload
This is the combined maximum allowable weight of cargo and occupants that the vehicle is designed to carry. Payload is the GVWR minus the truck’s base curb weight, and don’t forget that the trailer’s tongue weight needs to be included here, too.
Trailer Tongue Weight
Also known as tongue load, this is an important number to consider. It’s the amount of the trailer’s weight on the hitch ball—that’s the part that slides into the receiver attached to the truck and holds up the trailer while you drive. Too much tongue weight can cause the truck to sit too low in the rear; that can hurt the front wheels’ ability to provide steering, traction, and braking, and potentially cause suspension damage. Too little tongue weight affects how the trailer will handle behind the pickup, potentially causing the trailer to sway side-to-side, also called fishtailing.
The height of the hitch affects the tongue weight as well as the truck’s braking ability. It’s critical that the trailer sits level when it’s attached to the tow vehicle. A hitch that can be adjusted for height is helpful if you have to tow different trailers.
Tongue load should be 10 to 15 percent of the trailer’s total weight—if you’re towing 5,000 pounds, then the tongue weight would be 500 to 750 pounds. Typically, if your truck is rated high enough to handle the trailer you’re towing, it should also be rated high enough to handle the weight the trailer puts on the hitch. But keep in mind: The trailer’s tongue weight needs to be added to the truck’s payload, so the 500 to 750 pounds in the above example needs to be added to the truck’s GVW.
As Ford F-150 vehicle integration supervisor Scott Leonardi pointed out to us, tongue load sits directly on the vehicle itself and is therefore part of a truck's GVW. But tongue weight is not factored into the GCW of the fully loaded truck and trailer.
It’s important to know your truck’s payload capacity, and to factor the tongue weight into the truck’s payload, because the trailer’s tongue weight may impact how many people can ride in the cab and how much stuff can be carried in the bed.
 

Crissa

Well-known member
First Name
Crissa
Joined
Jul 8, 2020
Threads
100
Messages
11,747
Reaction score
19,403
Location
Santa Cruz
Vehicles
2014 Zero S, 2013 Mazda 3
Country flag

CyberDingo

Well-known member
First Name
John
Joined
Aug 29, 2020
Threads
1
Messages
90
Reaction score
60
Location
Australia
Vehicles
Cybertruck dual engine
Occupation
Farmer
Country flag
In OZ our regs. it states that any vehicle towing a trailer (includes caravans) is limited to MAX 100km. This reg. also states it applies to prime movers and trucks.
I have been passed by MOST in 110km zones.
Go figure!!
 

Ryan95738

Well-known member
First Name
Ryan
Joined
Jan 24, 2020
Threads
2
Messages
119
Reaction score
71
Location
Skagit Valley
Vehicles
CyberTruck
Occupation
CNA
Country flag
I've never heard of that rule in Washington or Oregon.



True, Tesla's have really excellent towing dynamics. Not that I've ever towed with a Tesla but I've been towing things my entire life with all kinds of vehicles and some are better than others. It's not always the vehicles tow rating that determines how well it will tow (and the specific trailer and tires on both units play a large part too). Some tow vehicles are downright scary well below their rated limits, even with a reasonable tow setup. Beware of flexy frames (both in the trailer and the tow vehicle)!

The strength and flex of the frame is supposed to be accounted for in the tow ratings but I have driven a number of vehicles that, while they worked, were not confidence inspiring even when the trailer was well under the vehicles rated capacity. All were body on frame pick-ups, SUV's or vans. On the other hand, I've towed with a number of unibody vehicles at or near their rated limits and never felt unsafe. Chassis rigidity has a lot to do with it and it seems this is underappreciated when manufacturers rate their vehicles. Because trailer sway and the eventual loss of control this can and does cause is far easier to initiate if the frame is flexy. It can act like a big spring.

Another important factor is how close the hitch is to the rear axle. Some vehicles have too much rear over-hang to make good tow vehicles. Tesla's are very good in this regard. It costs more to make a longer wheelbase vehicle but the benefits are numerous when compared to the same sized vehicle with a shorter wheelbase.

People now days think you need a pick-up to tow a travel trailer (or at least a very large SUV). Guess what? I grew up before there was such a thing as a big SUV - most large travel trailers were towed by a four dour sedan r a station wagon! Cadillacs, Oldsmobiles and Buicks were known to be superior but not everyone could afford that so any large sedan or station wagon would be used. A Model 3 would be superior to ALL of them - better brakes, better suspension, more rigid chassis, less rear overhang, lower center of gravity and with the added benefit of more than enough power.
I was watching Tesla already yesterday and he was towing with a model Y at 75 miles an hour and he never had any problems so it definitely is superior.

 

 
CYBERBACKPACK
Top