Spit! What should I do? File a report or not?

[dalton108]

vandalism & tampering with a vehicle, both crimes. Possibly also assault, given intent of action.

Your legal analysis needs work. And by that I mean it needs actual analysis and maybe some competence sprinkled on top. If you had even a cursory understanding of the legal meaning of the word “assault,” you would know how ridiculous this post is. Stop.

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[CyberGus]

You seem to think the perpetrator is a reasonable person.

Even reasonable people make mistakes. I’ve had great success at conversing with (not confronting) my neighbors over disputes.

I can’t remember the last time I called the cops to come and fix my problems.

I feel ridiculous even imagining this conversation:

ME: “Neighbor did [thing I don’t like]”
COP: “What did they say when you spoke to them?”
ME: “Speak to them??? That’s your job”
COP: “FFS”

 

[PungoteagueDave]

Your legal analysis needs work. And by that I mean it needs actual analysis and maybe some competence sprinkled on top. If you had even a cursory understanding of the meaning of the word “assault,” you would know how ridiculous this post is. Stop.

I do know the legal meaning and it can be considered assault in many places - the implied threat. Look it up counselor. Your demeaning attitude shows you out.

"Because saliva can carry disease and is inherently degrading, this is universally classified as battery or simple assault. Furthermore, intentionally threatening to spit on someone, or spitting on their property, or even causing them to fear it may happen, can constitute an "intent-to-frighten" assault."

 

[dalton108]

Even reasonable people make mistakes. I’ve had great success at conversing with (not confronting) my neighbors over disputes.

I can’t remember the last time I called the cops to come and fix my problems.

I feel ridiculous even imagining this conversation:

ME: “Neighbor did [thing I don’t like]”
COP: “What did they say when you spoke to them?”
ME: “Speak to them??? That’s your job”
COP: “FFS”

I have no idea why all of these “tough guys” can’t comprehend this. Setting aside the basic principle of actually asserting yourself directly and forcefully without crossing the line is a basic core competency that any fucking man worth his salt should have. Period! Use your words, ya babies!!!

If you can’t manage that, because you’re emotionally disabled and incapable of controlling yourself. Leave a note or one of the other self-help options folks have proposed here. Too many fucking phony ass Christians here who don’t know how to follow Christ and turn the other cheek for my liking. Less thumping, more reading and living it!

In my circle, of actual real men, you would get annihilated for being this big of a pussy as to be unable to cope with somebody spitting on your pweshus twuk (not even in your presence, where there’s colorably some vague argument of a threat to you personally) without involving the law or committing a violent act of vigilantism. Annihilated!

 

[CallsignVega]

"Because saliva can carry disease and is inherently degrading, this is universally classified as battery or simple assault.

Well said.

 

[mrcyber]

Forcing her to apologize under threat of filing a report sounds like a power trip to me. And it's exactly what her original action represented, a power trip. It's a petty response. This shouldn't be about making you, the victim, "feel better", it should be about holding the person accountable (which an insecure apology doesn't do), it just makes her more likely to escalate. Filing a police report, with the videos attached, is the best way to protect yourself. It's a very basic thing to do. Even if they decide not to press charges, you will have documented the harassment in case her irrational behavior escalates.

Forcing her to apologize under threat of filing a report sounds like a power trip to me. And it's exactly what her original action represented, a power trip. It's a petty response. This shouldn't be about making you, the victim, "feel better", it should be about holding the person accountable (which an insecure apology doesn't do), it just makes her more likely to escalate. Filing a police report, with the videos attached, is the best way to protect yourself. It's a very basic thing to do. Even if they decide not to press charges, you will have documented the harassment in case her irrational behavior escalates.

Nah, she needs to come clean for the sake of both parties and if she needs an incentive, so be it.

 

[HaulingAss]

Even reasonable people make mistakes. I’ve had great success at conversing with (not confronting) my neighbors over disputes.

I guess I don't view this as a dispute, it's harassment.

I can’t remember the last time I called the cops to come and fix my problems.

I don't view harassment as my problem, it's the perpetrators problem.

I feel ridiculous even imagining this conversation:

ME: “Neighbor did [thing I don’t like]”
COP: “What did they say when you spoke to them?”
ME: “Speak to them??? That’s your job”
COP: “FFS”

I don't call the cops simply because a neighbor does something I don't like, I only call them to report a crime. In this case it's a minor crime but, because it's been repeated on three separate occasions I recommend reporting it before it escalates into something more.

Here's a perfect example of why the best course of action is to file an online police report with the evidence attached:

18 years ago we moved into a house in a small city next to a neighbor that had a chainlink fence to contain their dog. Their mixed breed bulldog would stand behind that fence and bark incessantly at our house, even though we were inside and there was no reason why a dog would be barking. As summer came around the dog would be barking incessantly after 10 pm. My wife goes to bed at 10 pm. and the window was open to maintain a comfortable temperature (our house didn't need air conditioning).

My wife couldn't sleep with all the racket so I went to their front door to politely ask the neigbors (who we hadn't yet met) if they could put their dog inside. I pushed the doorbell and heard another smaller dog inside start barking in a shill manner. When she finally came to the door I was shocked to see a fat unkempt 45-year-old woman holding a yapping dog and looking perturbed that anyone had dared to bother her. Thinking I could turn this around, I introduced myself politely, explained my wife was having trouble sleeping, and asking if she could bring the dog inside or get it to stop barking. She was very defensive and non-friendly. I remained polite and she reluctantly agreed to "take care of it". I thanked her and went back home.

The next morning a cop rung our doorbell. He said he had been called to the neighbors house who had reported a scary, large tall man had intimidated and threatened her on her front porch. I explained the situation and that I had remained polite and neighborly with no threats. He immediately relaxed and said he suspected as much but was required to investigate. He said her dog barking at all hours violated the City noise ordinance and that he had recommended she buy a bark collar for her dog or face fines. I didn't ask if he was going to press charges for filing a false police report because there was no evidence, it was her word against mine. He was very personable, understanding and respectful, we had a pleasant conversation before he left, instructing me to call if I had any further problems.

The reason I went to my neighbors house first, was because I thought this problem could be easily resolved simply by politely conversing with my neighbor. Instead, it resulting in her filing a false police report against me in a case with zero evidence either way. Fortunately, the cops were already suspecting her story was fake before they spoke with me.

But the case at hand is different, it's not about neglecting to take care of your dog that keeps your neighbors awake at night, it's about willful and repeated harassment by spitting on your vehicle on multiple occasions. That mentally ill woman is going to hate you no matter what you say and how politely you say it. The best thing to do is file a police report.

 

[HaulingAss]

that would be an ACTUAL crime. And likely documented by ubiquitous cameras.

I agree, it's confounding to me why people keep recommending such unwise responses to this behavior, responses that can only serve to escalate the situation into something more serious. It's almost like they are still in 1st grade.

 

[CyberGus]

asserting yourself directly and forcefully without crossing the line is a basic core competency that any fucking man worth his salt should have

Agreed, but… couldn’t you have made your point without resorting to vulgarity?

 

[JIMMYFABULOUS]

File the report and let her know you did it. Let her know it will be more than a report next time.
Firm de-escalation.
Psychos!

 

[Gigahorse]

Imagine the scene: you have your fog machine running full tilt inside your enclosed bed, you inside with a small tube for fresh air, patiently waiting (like 50 Cent). You see her approach on Sentry Mode, hit the tonneau open on your phone, theatrical red strobes turn on to illuminate the smoke:

But also

In my experience opening the door and them realizing their actions have consequences has about the same result

 

[WacoChemist]

at least saliva has a pH of 6.5-7.5 (unlike bird crap which is 3.5-4.5) and likely won't leave a stain! but i did ask chat what you should do. here's what it said:


Spitting on your Tesla Cybertruck can be a crime in Philadelphia. Depending on the situation, it may count as criminal mischief (defacing/damaging property), harassment if it’s targeted and repeated, or disorderly conduct.


What to do:

• Record it (dash cam / Tesla Sentry Mode / cameras)
• Don’t confront the person
• Report repeated incidents to the Philadelphia Police Department with evidence

Repeated, documented incidents are much more likely to be taken seriously than a one-off event.

 

[HaulingAss]

What to do:

• Record it (dash cam / Tesla Sentry Mode / cameras)
• Don’t confront the person
• Report repeated incidents to the Philadelphia Police Department with evidence

Repeated, documented incidents are much more likely to be taken seriously than a one-off event.

Damn! Consumer AI tools just keep getting smarter!

Based on this response, I would say it's up to the wisdom level of a healthy, happy, responsible adult who lacks anger issues/power trips. AI has a bright future if it can continue to provide such logical and effective answers to problems of increasing complexity.

ps I'm thinking her pH might fall outside the typical range, probably closer to pH 6 than pH 7! She is one sour apple! Oh, wait... according to the Journal of Dairy Science, a pH of 8.5 is more typical of cow saliva! Who knows, maybe it all averages out?

 

[dalton108]

at least saliva has a pH of 6.5-7.5 (unlike bird crap which is 3.5-4.5) and likely won't leave a stain! but i did ask chat what you should do. here's what it said:


Spitting on your Tesla Cybertruck can be a crime in Philadelphia. Depending on the situation, it may count as criminal mischief (defacing/damaging property), harassment if it’s targeted and repeated, or disorderly conduct.


What to do:

• Record it (dash cam / Tesla Sentry Mode / cameras)
• Don’t confront the person
• Report repeated incidents to the Philadelphia Police Department with evidence

Repeated, documented incidents are much more likely to be taken seriously than a one-off event.

Yes, kind of exactly where we started. I asked @REM what crime she had committed, already knowing the statute that applies and the code provision for spitting. @REM, who is not a lawyer but has a law enforcement background, found the right code provision. It’s “criminal mischief” or “disorderly conduct,” not vandalism, and certainly not fucking assault. Because I already knew @REM knows how to look up statutes, I knew he would find it (if he chose). But the reason I asked him what law was broken is what your AI is telling you — and what I was waiting to say to him — DEPENDING ON THE CIRCUMSTANCES.

Laws don’t get broken simply because you say someone broke one or declare that what they did constitutes “vandalism.” Some jurisdictions have a vandalism statute. Others do not. It’s all a matter of what the legislature or legislative body in that locale decided to call it and what they decided to define the behavior as.

Irrespective, in order to have a law be violated, you need both an act that breaks the letter of the law (actus reus) and (generally, but not always) a particular criminal mindset (mens rea), all to be proven beyond a reasonable doubt. That takes time, energy, and resources to prove in court. The trial of the century for spitting on a car is not worth it for any PD, prosecutor, or community. It isn’t going to happen. That’s a revenge fantasy!

The other potential code violation in Philadelphia is for public spitting, which expressly talks about sidewalks and other public features and doesn’t really apply to the facts of this *incident. Even if it did, that carries a maximum penalty of $25.

* Also, let’s be clear. I didn’t watch every single angle OP supplied, but since I know how our cameras work, I’m pretty sure there isn’t one that shows spit leaving her mouth and landing on his truck. That leaves plenty of daylight for this person to say I didn’t spit on his car. I spat over it or at least I intended to spit over it and the wind or some such blew it on there. I’m not gonna get into all of the permutations and arguments that can be made on both sides. [No, totally wrong. I watched the second video and it absolutely shows spit leaving her mouth and near certainly landing right on the truck, I believe.]
Still, the video is a piece of evidence. It is not alone dispositive. The trier of fact (that’s what we call the judge or jury who decides a case) Is the only one who gets to decide what evidence actually says/means/proves. You NEVER can be certain how that’s going to turn out. NEVER!

The other avenue for legal vindication is always available at common law — in any jurisdiction — and that is “trespass to chattel,” as I outlined above. You can get a lawyer, you can sue, and you can end up with a nominal verdict in your favor and damages of one dollar. It happens all the time.

“Well, you don’t get it. It’s the principle!”

I fucking get it. I litigate matters of principle for my clients every goddamn day of the week! Principles are expensive if you want resolution through legal action. It’s almost never worth it, even when the fight itself is worth it. Most litigated matters settle, simply because legal remedies are generally not going to make you feel whole; and even if you win, you’re not going to feel like you won. It’s better to reach a negotiated settlement. Even if you don’t reach an with your neighbor by just going over and talking to them (ala @CyberGus’s wise counsel), the state (if they magically got involved ) almost certainly will! And those of you who are screaming about LAR aNd UrDer! are still gonna be just as disgruntled as you were when you started out!

You could be living your life. 30 secs, wipe & move on (as you note, and I already knew, you could leave the saliva there longer than you technically could leave bird poop). OR you could choose to spend hours dealing with the cops, or years and untold dollars dealing with litigation, criminal or civil (though honestly, you’re probably not going to get a lawyer and you’re gonna have to do this in small claims court on your own [after the filing fee, which will be considerably more expensive than a container of Clorox wipes or a car wash] if you go that route).

Guys, if you don’t see that that’s insane for somebody spitting on your car, I can’t reach you, and I won’t try any further.

 

[tingmo13]

but they're good & cute ones, too

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