Zapharus

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Very sad. Can't wait for all of the Tesla chargers to be full of slow as hell charging cars taking up all the V3 and V4 chargers... I understand this helps Tesla's mission. It does not do good things for Tesla cars and owners however. This will be a circus and it will be infuriating. All these 100KW cars will be clogging up each and every stall. Its great news for all the competition though!
Exactly this! The convenience of owning a Tesla is about to be eliminated. I’m not looking forward to it at all. I mean, it’s certainly a good thing for the overall adoption of EVs but it still sucks to lose the advantage of owning a Tesla.

 

SwampNut

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So you view Tesla ownership as having a Member's Only jacket and keeping out the riff-raff? One can only hope for a day when EV ownership is available to most, with no built in advantage. We can still charge way faster than most others, no matter what type of station.
 

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Owning a Tesla and non-Tesla, I see very little reason to take a non-Tesla to a SC. Our experience with EA has been good and I can't think of many routes in WA/OR where SC access would change which car I took. Very curious to see how the tesla to CCS connection is going to be made and how smoothly the charge initialization will go.

I also have to say that there are a lot of non-Teslas that have really good charging curves and aren't "slow as hell." In fact, most, not all, newer EVs have better charge curves than my 15 MS, which tops at ~110 kW below 10% and takes a linear path to ~60 kW by 50%. Definitely don't want to charge into the upper half of the battery unless you are eating lunch or absolutely have to.
 

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It depends on where you go. I previously mentioned that I wanted to rent a Polestar from ROC to Sayre, PA. Not one station is over 16k and that's hard to find, most are 8k. So there, an SC is a game-changer. My area seems to have a few stations in the 30-70 range so it's less important (but still generally better).
 

Ogre

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Owning a Tesla and non-Tesla, I see very little reason to take a non-Tesla to a SC. Our experience with EA has been good and I can't think of many routes in WA/OR where SC access would change which car I took. Very curious to see how the tesla to CCS connection is going to be made and how smoothly the charge initialization will go.

I also have to say that there are a lot of non-Teslas that have really good charging curves and aren't "slow as hell." In fact, most, not all, newer EVs have better charge curves than my 15 MS, which tops at ~110 kW below 10% and takes a linear path to ~60 kW by 50%. Definitely don't want to charge into the upper half of the battery unless you are eating lunch or absolutely have to.
I find this odd. I want access to non-Tesla charging networks in order to fill holes in the Supercharger network. I’d assume the reverse were true as well, particularly in light of the many YouTubers who have gotten towed or screwed over by limited charging networks.

Even if the non-Tesla networks were as flushed out as Teslas, I’d want access to the Supercharger network just to fill in those holes.

This is actually one of the few things that bugs me about Tesla giving non-Tesla’s access. They are giving non-Tesla owners access to more chargers then their own owner’s have access too. Tesla should get us CCS chargers if/ when they open up their network.
 


Popsmeeks

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Owning a Tesla and non-Tesla, I see very little reason to take a non-Tesla to a SC. Our experience with EA has been good and I can't think of many routes in WA/OR where SC access would change which car I took. Very curious to see how the tesla to CCS connection is going to be made and how smoothly the charge initialization will go.

I also have to say that there are a lot of non-Teslas that have really good charging curves and aren't "slow as hell." In fact, most, not all, newer EVs have better charge curves than my 15 MS, which tops at ~110 kW below 10% and takes a linear path to ~60 kW by 50%. Definitely don't want to charge into the upper half of the battery unless you are eating lunch or absolutely have to.
I drive the volvo xc40 recharge as a company car for our EV pilot program. EA network is crap in northern CA.unreliable slow and rarely peaks at 130kwh even when I'm below 20%SOC. And which non teska have a better charging curve? This volvo/polestar 2 pack sure doesn't.
 

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I find this odd. I want access to non-Tesla charging networks in order to fill holes in the Supercharger network. I’d assume the reverse were true as well, particularly in light of the many YouTubers who have gotten towed or screwed over by limited charging networks.

Even if the non-Tesla networks were as flushed out as Teslas, I’d want access to the Supercharger network just to fill in those holes.

This is actually one of the few things that bugs me about Tesla giving non-Tesla’s access. They are giving non-Tesla owners access to more chargers then their own owner’s have access too. Tesla should get us CCS chargers if/ when they open up their network.
You don't want CCS chargers, they are crap. Evgo- garbage chargepoint-more garbage- Electrify america also garbage!
 

Ogre

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You don't want CCS chargers, they are crap. Evgo- garbage chargepoint-more garbage- Electrify america also garbage!
You are quite wrong, I DO want CCS chargers.

Not as my primary charging network, Superchargers are in general far better for that. But I’ve absolutely been in positions where I’ve driven miles past a CCS charger to get to a Supercharger. Not something I’d like to repeat.

Until Supercharger density increases significantly, I want a backup plan. Superchargers are great for sticking to main corridors, but there are a lot of side highways where Superchargers are just missing and other networks have a presence.
 

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There are more CCS locations than Superchargers. It makes sense that a Tesla owner would want them to fill out the gaps in their map. And there are holes, once you leave the major interstates.

There are more Supercharger stalls than CCS. If you take busy or long routes, Tesla has reliability and availability in spades. A non-Tesla owner would be looking for that reliability and ability to count on making long trips that CCS doesn't have.

But if you haven't hit those holes - people taking trucks out into the wild will - or haven't hit those reliability issues - people taking trucks popular routes will - you wouldn't have seen the advantages of the other side of the fence yet.

-Crissa
 

Popsmeeks

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You are quite wrong, I DO want CCS chargers.

Not as my primary charging network, Superchargers are in general far better for that. But I’ve absolutely been in positions where I’ve driven miles past a CCS charger to get to a Supercharger. Not something I’d like to repeat.

Until Supercharger density increases significantly, I want a backup plan. Superchargers are great for sticking to main corridors, but there are a lot of side highways where Superchargers are just missing and other networks have a presence.
I understand and I think we can all agree For this EV revolution to work there needs to be as many charging locations as current gas stations . And all DC fast charging not the "fast" level 2 jokes. The problem is the non Tesla charging stations classify themselves as very fast and fast (which is anything but) and even when you get to a "very fast" DC CCS it's unreliable , card readers don't work , speed to 65-85kwh when should be a min of 150 at least at the beginning.
If CCS increases like you want at the same level of incompetence then what good is it? Emergency use only maybe.
 


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I understand and I think we can all agree For this EV revolution to work there needs to be as many charging locations as current gas stations .
I'm going to disagree with that. You don't need to worry about all the cars that would charge at home overnight (they would replace ICE cars that ALWAYS need a gas station to charge).

So you really only need to meet the demand for long distance travelers, which is definitely less than the daily commuters. Yes, there are some that won't have at home charging, but it is still a smaller number.
 

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I understand and I think we can all agree For this EV revolution to work there needs to be as many charging locations as current gas stations . And all DC fast charging not the "fast" level 2 jokes. The problem is the non Tesla charging stations classify themselves as very fast and fast (which is anything but) and even when you get to a "very fast" DC CCS it's unreliable , card readers don't work , speed to 65-85kwh when should be a min of 150 at least at the beginning.
If CCS increases like you want at the same level of incompetence then what good is it? Emergency use only maybe.
I think I mentioned upthread, but I’ve had to drive 30+ miles (15+ each way) out of my way to get to a Supercharger or not get home. Less than half that distance off is an EA charging station. I’ve also had trips where I’ve had to deviate from my planned route to add a Supercharger stop.

I think most people would prefer not driving 30 miles out of the way to charge their car.

It is actually not emergency use I’m concerned with, it’s just going out of the way.
 

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I'm going to disagree with that. You don't need to worry about all the cars that would charge at home overnight (they would replace ICE cars that ALWAYS need a gas station to charge).

So you really only need to meet the demand for long distance travelers, which is definitely less than the daily commuters. Yes, there are some that won't have at home charging, but it is still a smaller number.
We need a lot more of coverage. We don’t need a charging station at the end of the block in a residential area. We need them every 50 miles or so along all highways though (major and minor).

We can certainly get away with L2 chargers in more out-of-the-way places if that’s what it takes to fill the gaps. I‘ve been in situations where an L2 charger giving me enough juice to get to a Supercharger has been a day saver.
 

fritter63

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We need a lot more of coverage. We don’t need a charging station at the end of the block in a residential area. We need them every 50 miles or so along all highways though (major and minor).

We can certainly get away with L2 chargers in more out-of-the-way places if that’s what it takes to fill the gaps. I‘ve been in situations where an L2 charger giving me enough juice to get to a Supercharger has been a day saver.
I am tempted to install a charger at the end of our driveway (I have outlets there) and list it on plugshare, wasn't sure how much L2 demand there would be. We're at the end of a dead end road, 3 miles from town (and the SC installation).
 

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Its just going to get better year on year. At least as many fuel stations along a route... plus McDonals...etc, Shopping Centers... Outside your local Gym. The next 5 years, will be hugely different to now. imo

Pop up solutions for out of the way places... perhaps supported by tourist authority. Autonomous recharge vehicles. These could take a long time.

 

 
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