AHH, SPECULATION ONCE AGAIN. Extended battery

[Woodrick]

But maybe someone on here has some info, so here it goes. Extended battery time. With Toyota's solid state battery getting a lot of attention. How likely would you all guess it is we might, maybe , hopefully be able to have the extended range battery as a solid state option. And, or possible aftermarket extended battery option?

Do a little research on Toyota's battery technology (for electric vehicles in which they don't believe in).
A number of years ago, they promised the 1,000 mile battery, then a few years later it dropped to 745 miles. And a few years after that it got down to 621.

Toyota has proven one thing with their battery technology announcements.

"Toyota knows nothing about batteries and EVs!!!!!"

They just have a marketing/BS department.

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[REM]

But maybe someone on here has some info, so here it goes. Extended battery time. With Toyota's solid state battery getting a lot of attention. How likely would you all guess it is we might, maybe , hopefully be able to have the extended range battery as a solid state option. And, or possible aftermarket extended battery option?

If/when solid state batteries become market scalable, it will radically change electricity for this entire planet virtually overnight.

So this is a bit of a loaded question lol

 

[mongo]

But maybe someone on here has some info, so here it goes. Extended battery time. With Toyota's solid state battery getting a lot of attention. How likely would you all guess it is we might, maybe , hopefully be able to have the extended range battery as a solid state option. And, or possible aftermarket extended battery option?

A range extender needs to be the same cell type as the main pack to keep everything balanced. (If going with the simplest direct parallel setup).

 

[REM]

A range extender needs to be the same cell type as the main pack to keep everything balanced. (If going with the simplest direct parallel setup).

Only a few places like Munro know the definitive answer to this. The BMS for the Cybertruck is probably years ahead of the game to be honest.

I'm also curious how they can enable the ability to draw in AC and allow the outlets to function through a firmware update.

 

[mongo]

Only a few places like Munro know the definitive answer to this. The BMS for the Cybertruck is probably years ahead of the game to be honest.

...
You don't need to be Munro to know that if SOC doesn't track voltage on your two packs (main and extender) then your capacity will be limited by the one that goes flat (or full) first.
Unless someone decides to install a multi tens of kW bidirectional DC-DC charger between the two and incur the efficency hit on two way conversion along with cost and mass hit of the unit.

Much simpler to use the same cells in both.

I'm also curious how they can enable the ability to draw in AC and allow the outlets to function through a firmware update.

The existing hardware is already set up to partition the PCS into charging and sourcing AC blocks. The software update will handle the split and resulting oddities.

 

[REM]

...
You don't need to be Munro to know that if SOC doesn't track voltage on your two packs (main and extender) then your capacity will be limited by the one that goes flat (or full) first.
Unless someone decides to install a multi tens of kW bidirectional DC-DC charger between the two and incur the efficency hit on two way conversion along with cost and mass hit of the unit.

Much simpler to use the same cells in both.



The existing hardware is already set up to partition the PCS into charging and sourcing AC blocks. The software update will handle the split and resulting oddities.

Sounds like you do this for a living ? lol. What kind of oddity do you think will result?

 

[mongo]

Sounds like you do this for a living ? lol. What kind of oddity do you think will result?

I have been known to make a BMS...
After sleeping on it, and drinking coffee, it also works if the range extender has an equal or greater max voltage and a lower or equal minimum voltage. The downside being the full capacity doesn't get utilized. Upside being that, even with degradation, it shouldn't limit the combined energy/ range.

However, achieving both those criteria is challenging from a cell chemistry point of view. More cells in series raises min and max voltage, fewer lowers both. So linking a fresh set of cells with the same series count is the easy option. Normal degradation shouldn't have additional cross impact.

It would be nice if Tesla made a 46120 cell to get us an extended range pack that didn't take up bed space and also improved weight distribution. At $16k ($87/ kWh ignoring pack core) it's not unreasonable for them costs wise. Does reduce pack bottom damage tolerance though...

 

[REM]

I have been known to make a BMS...
After sleeping on it, and drinking coffee, it also works if the range extender has an equal or greater max voltage and a lower or equal minimum voltage. The downside being the full capacity doesn't get utilized. Upside being that, even with degradation, it shouldn't limit the combined energy/ range.

However, achieving both those criteria is challenging from a cell chemistry point of view. More cells in series raises min and max voltage, fewer lowers both. So linking a fresh set of cells with the same series count is the easy option. Normal degradation shouldn't have additional cross impact.

It would be nice if Tesla made a 46120 cell to get us an extended range pack that didn't take up bed space and also improved weight distribution. At $16k ($87/ kWh ignoring pack core) it's not unreasonable for them costs wise. Does reduce pack bottom damage tolerance though...

Excellent info, thanks!

 

[mcm4ss]

Excellent info, thanks!

no kidding. These guys are WAY over my pay grade. I just want 400+ miles per charge. not a huge request lol. Thought about just grabbing a ANKER solar generator and charging it. That would help.

 

[GuyV]

almost all the battery factories are in Republican States-wanna shoot yourself in the foot?

LOL, the shooting in foot stuff has already begun.

 

[GuyV]

And I want a car that runs off of of the air. But then cars would use all the air up?

Tesla batteries, nor do I really think anyone's have added 50% capacity in the same space.

They are beginning, but they are expensive and focused on aircraft where the cost can be justified.

 

[VAF84]

no kidding. These guys are WAY over my pay grade. I just want 400+ miles per charge. not a huge request lol. Thought about just grabbing a ANKER solar generator and charging it. That would help.

No kidding. Over 50% of the reason I was swayed to the Sierra EV over the CT was range. I'm not going back to "320" range, and now that I actually own and experience 440 range, I'm convinced that I'm never going back until charging speeds double the current fastest speeds AND the infrastructure is everywhere including rural areas to support the more frequent stops and high charging speeds for the full 80% charge, not just the first 20%.

 

[mcm4ss]

No kidding. Over 50% of the reason I was swayed to the Sierra EV over the CT was range. I'm not going back to "320" range, and now that I actually own and experience 440 range, I'm convinced that I'm never going back until charging speeds double the current fastest speeds AND the infrastructure is everywhere including rural areas to support the more frequent stops and high charging speeds for the full 80% charge, not just the first 20%.

I thought of that too. But honest question here. I am sure you love your truck. I drove one and it is nice. BUT all things equal, if the CT got same range as Sierra would you have gone still with a GM product, or would the CT have gone for the win? I found after driving both I really like the drive of the CT vs the Sierra.

 

[jerhenderson]

The incentive will be wiped out for all battery vehicles. That's more harmful to Tesla than anyone. Especially with the amount of BEV credits they get from other manufacturers in the US.

Lol no. That'll hamstring hybrids.

 

[SCTesla]

Lol no. That'll hamstring hybrids.

That's the point.

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