CT Companion vehicle - model 2, Aptera or other

SwampNut

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So the question is what will be your companion vehicles if any?
We have an M3. I predict that I will drive the CT nearly 100% of the time. Before the M3 we had a BMW Z4 but I greatly preferred to drive my truck, a 2020 Gladiator. It's just advantageous in many ways. Now I mostly drive the M3 because of its tech advantages, but with a CT matching those, I'd drive it primarily.

I personally think we only need ONE vehicle in the home, but the wife has an emotional need for two. I hate it. She drives maybe 3x per month, at most. It's a total waste. But we have needs for something that can tow and go off road, so the M3 can't be the only one.
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JeffnReno

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Well, different vehicles go different places. I don't want to carry the truck up to the city; there's not room for it and it'll cost at least twice as much to get there.

Just like why I have a motorcycle and a bicycle. Some places are just easier to get to with the right vehicle.

-Crissa
I have 2 Aptera and a Tri-Motor CT reservations plus currently drive a LR Rwd Model 3. My wife doesn't drive and we don't really need a truck but I sure miss my Ram 4x4 quad-cab I sold my daughter. I'm really hoping the Aptera will be able to charge on the Tesla SC network. If so, I will probably sell the Model 3 and get the CT and the Aptera plus one for my grandson to replace our old Leaf he currently drives.
 

Crissa

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The point is, the cost of the power is completely irrelevant, it's the fact that your car has power at all in these places.
Not completely, but in a different way... While standard Supercharging is not too expensive, taking up a powered (even L1) parking space is just super-expensive. I've paid $1.50 a kWh plus $30/night parking. It's insane.

-Crissa
 

Riptide

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If you really want to be environmentally friendly or economical then you won't be driving your CT by yourself for commuting long distances without a load or need for a truck. While relatively efficient and potentially clean, the energy used by the CT on a per single passenger mile basis is much higher than a model 3 and probably triple that of an Aptera. This energy could be better used elsewhere. The CT also won't be cheap to drive, tires and insurance being major ticket items. The price of electricity should also be going up. Utah is currently $.10/kWhr. I could also see us paying for roads on metric ton/1000kM basis at some time and abandoning the road tax system. That would be the right way to do it anyway.

Personally I think the guys driving the big fancy trucks to the office are tools. I got rid of my truck for that very reason and use trailers and our Toyota Sienna for occasional camping and heavy work type stuff.

Now in my perfect world we would have a CT and small BEV. The ecobox would be used as much as possible and either my wife or I would drive it depending on who had the longest drive with out the need for the CT. But I am married to a strong willed gal. She hates swapping vehicles because she always is missing something. She has made if very clear she will be choosing her next vehicle by herself. I am pretty sure it won't be an Aptera. Most likely a small to mid sized SUV ice (plug in hybrid if I am lucky or if very lucky maybe the model y will come way down in price and she might spring for that.) So I guess I will be that guy driving a truck everywhere when he really doesn't need to or I will need 3 vehicles for 2 drivers. (assuming my young adult children actually leave the house we currently have 6 vehicles around)

So the question is what will be your companion vehicles if any?
If I am getting my energy from sunlight, which I already am, it literally does not matter how much of it I use, as the marginal dollar cost of producing that energy is ridiculously close to zero and marginal environmental cost of producing that energy is also ridiculously close to zero.

Does the Cybertruck require more energy than an Aptera to build? Yes. Does the Cybertruck require more energy to build than a Cybertruck+Aptera? No. I only need one vehicle, and it's got to be a truck.

The one concession I'll make here is that, yes, I will be using more rubber than a small sedan. And so I guess I'll just have to live with that choice. Insurance costs? Well, there is zero environmental impact here, and if you can't afford the insurance for a Cybertruck I suggest you don't buy one.

I really could not care less who you think is a "tool". Really, what prompted you to just share this kind of opinion here? I am truly curious why anyone thinks anyone else will care about their subjective opinions.
 

Crissa

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I really could not care less who you think is a "tool". Really, what prompted you to just share this kind of opinion here? I am truly curious why anyone thinks anyone else will care about their subjective opinions.
He seems to be pointing put that looking at just environmental impact, at certain average level of driving, one vehicle is lower impact than two. Which you agree with.

But that's not the only consideration. Most of us live in pairings. Nearly all of those pairings have two drivers. With two lives, which may want or need to be in different places and times. So two cars are very common.

I just lived with my spouse for fifteen years with a single car between us. It meant I really couldn't take long road trips without her (and vice versa), especially once we moved into a cabin instead of an apartment.

And also, if you take certain trips, it may be more efficient, based upon the miles driven, to do so in a smaller vehicle. Or take up a smaller footprint, or different feeling of enjoyment, like our motorcycles.

So once you get away from that average - no other considerations - yes, there are lots of ways it could be more or less environmentally efficient.

And so it's reasonable to point out these inflection points. Humans want, and sometimes we forget our footprints crushing the environment underneath.

-Crissa
 


madquadbiker

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If that happens I will have to sell everything I own to fund my purchase and rotorcraft ticket. You can be sure a Tesla aircraft of whatever design will be almost too easy to fly. And probably their own in-house avionics to help keep some costs down.
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Tinker71

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I really could not care less who you think is a "tool". Really, what prompted you to just share this kind of opinion here? I am truly curious why anyone thinks anyone else will care about their subjective opinions.
[/QUOTE]

Well I don't think I am alone in calling mostly men that drive jacked up trucks that cost $80,000 tools. Many women will also say they are compensating for...... you know.

Some people might legitimately need high clearance for a work vehicle. I can even respect the rock crawler guys. But driving a shinny jacked up truck to the office with nothing in the back as a commuter vehicle for no real need except to impress someone is being a tool when it is harder on the environment.
 
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Tinker71

Tinker71

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I would love to go solar, but with my electricity at 8.5 cents/KwH it doesn't make sense financially. For regions with cheap electricity and not as many sunny days (parts of the Pacific Northwest), until solar becomes cheaper there is no financial case for refitting a house with it. The financial case if incorporating into a major renovation or new construction is probably better, especially with the improvements on solar roof tile. There is an argument from a resiliency standpoint, especially with EVs and a solar roof.
Your prudence is precisely why we need a carbon tax. Make carbon just expensive enough so it flips the math.

Washington has great hydo power so your electricity is cheap and low carbon. That said the US tax payer funded most of Grand Coulee and the big dams. The cheap power should be spread out a little to the rest of us. The power could be efficiently moved with a HV DC power line or better yet raise your rates and subsidize carbon reducing projects for the poor so they aren't pinched as bad. (FYI I am a former and potential future Washingtonian)
 


jhogan2424

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Your prudence is precisely why we need a carbon tax. Make carbon just expensive enough so it flips the math.

Washington has great hydo power so your electricity is cheap and low carbon. That said the US tax payer funded most of Grand Coulee and the big dams. The cheap power should be spread out a little to the rest of us. The power could be efficiently moved with a HV DC power line or better yet raise your rates and subsidize carbon reducing projects for the poor so they aren't pinched as bad. (FYI I am a former and potential future Washingtonian)
Tax people to the point they do things your way? Total BS.
 
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Tinker71

Tinker71

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Yes, absoutely! And to take Sunday drives, which, strictly speaking I don't need to do. I've got the car anyway. Driving it has no marginal impact. Why not do it?

My solar panels don't work on nights or cloudy days so I don't charge then but what has that got to do with it?

Sorry the math was too advanced for you. When you learn to add and subtract you'll be OK.
You assumptions are juvenile. There are things like albedo, all the impact of manufacturing and road construction that you are completely ignoring. I know you are smarter than this. I have seen it. By your math if we cover the world with solar panels we will be ok and we don't have to take any responsibility for anything else.
 

Crissa

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Tax people to the point they do things your way? Total BS.
Tax externalities.

The atmosphere is a common. Not taxing the effects of blowing CO2 into the atmosphere is a demonstration of a tragedy of the commons.

You wouldn't want people to just park their car on your local playground - you'd want to discourage that. You can put up a fence, you can use a tax, etc. This is no different.

^-^

-Crissa

PS: The point of using the tax is so we don't have to put up a fence. That way blowing carbon dioxide into the atmosphere costs more than the alternative.
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