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FSD (Unsupervised) price?

cciv

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The order page says $8000 for "Full Self-Driving (Supervised)". I understand that that is a legal/liability requirement, but do we know for sure that "unsupervised" FSD is a free upgrade? I'd hate to spend $8000 for something that will be "obsolete" when the "unsupervised" version is released to the public.
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If you are waiting for “unsupervised FSD”, the cost might be 10K or more when released or only subscription plan 🤣
 
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cciv

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I don't care if it's $10K, I'm just concerned that the $8K spent now will be wasted.
 

YDR37

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do we know for sure that "unsupervised" FSD is a free upgrade? I'd hate to spend $8000 for something that will be "obsolete" when the "unsupervised" version is released to the public.
People who buy FSD commonly make two assumptions:

(1) that future versions of the FSD software will be capable of unsupervised operation, and
(2) that their FSD software will be upgraded for free when that happens.

You are asking if assumption (2) is legally guaranteed in the FSD purchase agreement. I am not a lawyer and can't answer that question -- but I do expect that there would be a lot of very unhappy people if unsupervised FSD was not a free upgrade to buyers of FSD (Supervised).

Of course, if assumption (1) doesn't happen, then assumption (2) doesn't matter.

A related question: even if an FSD purchase does guarantee software upgrades, what about the hardware? Suppose, for the sake of argument, that a future version of the FSD software is capable of unsupervised operation -- but only when using newer hardware that current vehicles lack (maybe a more powerful computer, or more cameras, or additional sensors). Even if the FSD purchase agreement does guarantee free software upgrades, that wouldn't necessarily cover any needed hardware upgrades.

It's true that Tesla has upgraded HW2 and HW2.5 hardware for free in the past, and has discussed upgrading HW3 in the future. Just saying that hardware upgrades are another potential issue, it's not only about the FSD software.
 
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Sjohnson20

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No one knows what is going to happen. Lets see if they get those robotaxis driving around without anyone in them first.
 


Jhodgesatmb

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The order page says $8000 for "Full Self-Driving (Supervised)". I understand that that is a legal/liability requirement, but do we know for sure that "unsupervised" FSD is a free upgrade? I'd hate to spend $8000 for something that will be "obsolete" when the "unsupervised" version is released to the public.
When we bought our first FSD package there was no such designation as supervised vs unsupervised. I believe they added that distinction because the MSM folks (and some elected officials) were unable to read the instructions (or just didn’t choose to). Just as Tesla has continued to upgrade hardware for FSD purchasers I am certain that supervised will transition to unsupervised without a new license being required.
 

rovert43

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I don't care if it's $10K, I'm just concerned that the $8K spent now will be wasted.
From what I see unsupervised is inevitable as part of the sub and sold as such. They'd have a huge class action lawsuit for existing purchases. Moving forward you may be right. I wouldn't chance waiting until after the 14th myself.
 

rovert43

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People who buy FSD commonly make two assumptions:

(1) that future versions of the FSD software will be capable of unsupervised operation, and
(2) that their FSD software will be upgraded for free when that happens.

You are asking if assumption (2) is legally guaranteed in the FSD purchase agreement. I am not a lawyer and can't answer that question -- but I do expect that there would be a lot of very unhappy people if unsupervised FSD was not a free upgrade to buyers of FSD (Supervised).

Of course, if assumption (1) doesn't happen, then assumption (2) doesn't matter.

A related question: even if an FSD purchase does guarantee software upgrades, what about the hardware? Suppose, for the sake of argument, that a future version of the FSD software is capable of unsupervised operation -- but only when using newer hardware that current vehicles lack (maybe a more powerful computer, or more cameras, or additional sensors). Even if the FSD purchase agreement does guarantee free software upgrades, that wouldn't necessarily cover any needed hardware upgrades.

It's true that Tesla has upgraded HW2 and HW2.5 hardware for free in the past, and has discussed upgrading HW3 in the future. Just saying that hardware upgrades are another potential issue, it's not only about the FSD software.
Early adopters have been taken care of however I don't know how far you could go back before you're trying to do CGI on a calculator.
 

Jhodgesatmb

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People who buy FSD commonly make two assumptions:

(1) that future versions of the FSD software will be capable of unsupervised operation, and
(2) that their FSD software will be upgraded for free when that happens.

You are asking if assumption (2) is legally guaranteed in the FSD purchase agreement. I am not a lawyer and can't answer that question -- but I do expect that there would be a lot of very unhappy people if unsupervised FSD was not a free upgrade to buyers of FSD (Supervised).

Of course, if assumption (1) doesn't happen, then assumption (2) doesn't matter.

A related question: even if an FSD purchase does guarantee software upgrades, what about the hardware? Suppose, for the sake of argument, that a future version of the FSD software is capable of unsupervised operation -- but only when using newer hardware that current vehicles lack (maybe a more powerful computer, or more cameras, or additional sensors). Even if the FSD purchase agreement does guarantee free software upgrades, that wouldn't necessarily cover any needed hardware upgrades.

It's true that Tesla has upgraded HW2 and HW2.5 hardware for free in the past, and has discussed upgrading HW3 in the future. Just saying that hardware upgrades are another potential issue, it's not only about the FSD software.
Tesla has always upgraded hardware for FSD owners in the past, but I suppose that is no guarantee they will in the future. My take on this is that they don’t want to keep adding to the list of owners they will have to upgrade for free so they are stopping the sale now, but I do believe they would be slapped with a class action suit if they tried to abandon owners (and I would join the suit). We bought FSD (3 times) with the promise of eventual unsupervised autonomous driving and that is what we expect. Everything up to that is beta as far as I am concerned.
 

Gigahorse

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Tesla has been selling Full Self Driving for a decade. During that time Elon has promised it will do a bunch of stuff and make the care significantly more valuable.
Myself and others have paid for that dream, which has been delayed many times, but I HIGHLY doubt Tesla and Elon will rug-pull at this point and say "yea FSDU is finally here, sorry it is 8 years late and you have to buy something completely new"

Given the training data that built FSD was done by people paying for FSD and the FSD dream being sold all along the way. My money (literally) is in FSDU being an update that comes through, subscription price may go up but the FSD on your Foundation will be FSDU

Tesla Cybertruck FSD (Unsupervised) price? zimage11970


Tesla Cybertruck FSD (Unsupervised) price? zimage11971
 


turns2stone

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Tesla has been selling Full Self Driving for a decade. During that time Elon has promised it will do a bunch of stuff and make the care significantly more valuable.
Myself and others have paid for that dream, which has been delayed many times, but I HIGHLY doubt Tesla and Elon will rug-pull at this point and say "yea FSDU is finally here, sorry it is 8 years late and you have to buy something completely new"

Given the training data that built FSD was done by people paying for FSD and the FSD dream being sold all along the way. My money (literally) is in FSDU being an update that comes through, subscription price may go up but the FSD on your Foundation will be FSDU

zimage11970.webp


zimage11971.webp
I understand the frustration. But the difference is now, there are literally AI4 Model Ys driving around autonomously in Austin TX, taking passengers for a ride.
 

Gigahorse

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I understand the frustration. But the difference is now, there are literally AI4 Model Ys driving around autonomously in Austin TX, taking passengers for a ride.
Yea, but there have been big jumps along the way. I remember when Autopark first came out, traffic lights not requiring a pedal press to go, autosteer on city streets.

Robotaxis in Austin doing little trips is great, but think we are a good ways out from "ok little 8 year old Billy, go get in the Tesla and it will take you to Soccer practice and bring you home after"
 

turns2stone

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Robotaxis in Austin doing little trips is great, but think we are a good ways out from "ok little 8 year old Billy, go get in the Tesla and it will take you to Soccer practice and bring you home after"
Fundamentally, this isn't different than what the Model Y/Robotaxis are literally doing today.
 

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In for 90K what's another 8K.....FSDS is so good, that alone is worth it. If it goes to FSDU, that's icing on the cake!🧁
 

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Tesla has been selling Full Self Driving for a decade. During that time Elon has promised it will do a bunch of stuff and make the care significantly more valuable.
Myself and others have paid for that dream, which has been delayed many times, but I HIGHLY doubt Tesla and Elon will rug-pull at this point and say "yea FSDU is finally here, sorry it is 8 years late and you have to buy something completely new"

Given the training data that built FSD was done by people paying for FSD and the FSD dream being sold all along the way. My money (literally) is in FSDU being an update that comes through, subscription price may go up but the FSD on your Foundation will be FSDU

zimage11970.webp


zimage11971.webp
Agreed. FSD as it exists now is 98% of the way to unsupervised in my opinion. I'm just a babysitter to a pretty mature kid that needs a little watching not to get into trouble.

Assuming more fixes before unsupervised let's say it's 99% there. It wouldn't make sense to make an upgrade fee to get to that final 1%. If they do then I won't be a buyer. I like being the driver sometimes anyway.
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