Safety - breaking windows after crash -Chao Death

[Nolacyber]

manual door release. I wonder if she tried to use it?

Possibly too inebriated to remember its location. It’s not terrible intuitive. When I first heard of the manual door release I thought “wow I’ve never even noticed it”.
That’s because my vintage Tesla has nothing but manual door handles.

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[Nolacyber]

A lot of good comments on this thread. Some of the comments remind me of the NTSB commentary on small plane crashes. It’s almost always found to be pilot error, but o always though that begged the question, “why do some makes experience more pilot error than others”.
Fact is 1) manufacturers can’t foresee every action a driver may take - being 3x legal limit and making an error is one. 2) design should make critical actions intuitive.
I’ve always wondered why any door mechanisms are electric.

 

[cybercoffee]

It wouldn't do a lot for you honestly. If you have a glass breaker you can pulverize the glass until there's no structure left to it and kick out the window. Eventually you should be able to cause a crack in the outer layer.

exactly. a bullet might punch a hole through and through, let in a bit of water, and cause the laminated glass to fracture, but it'll still be laminated and in one big piece. not to say carrying isn't useful for other purposes...just not the water crash scenario

 

[HaulingAss]

I’ll be taking delivery in next few weeks; and the truck will be used to drive occasionally over a very long (25 miles bridge) with low guardrails. Many death per year occur with normal vehicles.
the recent death of Angela Chao in Texas, who accidentally drove into a pond in her X raises some issues. Apparently she was inebriated (3x legal limit) but she and bystanders couldn’t break the glass.
Our glass is tougher - maybe a lot tougher. What is the best tool to carry inside the Cybertruck? I already carry an emergency device in the S that has a tempered point and a dealt belt cutter), but reading indicates these things may be useless for modern laminated glass.
This may be the best argument for carrying a gun inside the vehicle. Permanent hearing damage perhaps but at least you could get out.
Maybe this should be tested?

Every weekend I accidently drive into the water I'm thankful for the window hammer I carry in the door pocket. It makes it so much easier to break the glass, I will never go back to my old method of holding my breath as the car fills up and forcing the door open. I always used to get so out of breath by the time I was able to swim up to the surface.

/s

 

[HaulingAss]

exactly. a bullet might punch a hole through and through, let in a bit of water, and cause the laminated glass to fracture, but it'll still be laminated and in one big piece. not to say carrying isn't useful for other purposes...just not the water crash scenario

That's why I always carry a semi-automatic 12 guage shotgun. It's my backup plan in case I'm too drunk to use my window hammer effectively. I must be doing something right, because I'm over 60 years old, and I'm still here!

/s

 

[agordon117]

Every weekend I accidently drive into the water I'm thankful for the window hammer I carry in the door pocket. It makes it so much easier to break the glass, I will never go back to my old method of holding my breath as the car fills up and forcing the door open. I always used to get so out of breath by the time I was able to swim up to the surface.

/s

Tesla clearly thought of this. They only want the most important of us to survive (influencers, lol)

 

[CyberGus]

Doors are very difficult to open when a vehicle is even partially submerged:



One cannot swing a heavy object underwater with force, but Tesla windows are broken all the time on the street. The glass is reinforced but quite breakable.

I can't believe in this day and age we still have the pandemic of drunk driving.

Ms. Chao was not "drunk driving" exactly, she was traversing between structures on a large private estate, which is probably why no one thought anything of it.

While her odds would have been better with a clear head, people that crash into the water often fail to extricate themselves in their panic. If your vehicle hits the water, roll down your window while you are still able. Once the LV system fails from immersion, either break the window if you can, or press your feet to the windshield and press hard enough to release the seal.

The last vestige of the desperate is to let the cabin flood fully and then manually open the door, but again panic/adrenaline makes this challenging.

 

[CyberJay]

I’ll be taking delivery in next few weeks; and the truck will be used to drive occasionally over a very long (25 miles bridge) with low guardrails. Many death per year occur with normal vehicles.
the recent death of Angela Chao in Texas, who accidentally drove into a pond in her X raises some issues. Apparently she was inebriated (3x legal limit) but she and bystanders couldn’t break the glass.
Our glass is tougher - maybe a lot tougher. What is the best tool to carry inside the Cybertruck? I already carry an emergency device in the S that has a tempered point and a dealt belt cutter), but reading indicates these things may be useless for modern laminated glass.
This may be the best argument for carrying a gun inside the vehicle. Permanent hearing damage perhaps but at least you could get out.
Maybe this should be tested?

With a .233 blood alcohol level, I know I would be able to punch through the glass or the exoskeleton, then summons local underwater life -- like aquaman.

 

[Nolacyber]

Every weekend I accidently drive into the water I'm thankful for the window hammer I carry in the door pocket. It makes it so much easier to break the glass, I will never go back to my old method of holding my breath as the car fills up and forcing the door open. I always used to get so out of breath by the time I was able to swim up to the surface.

/s

I always enjoyed responses like this on aviation forums; “I’m too careful a pilot to ever have this happen” or “I have magic pilot powers and would never make such an error”. Fact is shit happens and sometimes bad design plays a role in enabling bad shit.

 

[Petertsai]

So they were able to break the window. It sounds as if she had called 911 first instead of talking with a friend for 8 minutes they might have been able to save her.

Heard rescuers were under the impression that they will be electrocuted if they touching an EV in water. They should know better. All the urban legends and Hollywood movie stunts with hair dryers electrocuting in tubs are all false. I especially get a kick from the impossibility of sparks from an immersion of hair dryer.

 

[pricedm]

Doors are very difficult to open when a vehicle is even partially submerged:



The last vestige of the desperate is to let the cabin flood fully and then manually open the door, but again panic/adrenaline makes this challenging.

Tester in the video "ran out of air before he could escape" and in the test (1) was not under the influence of anything (2) daylight (3) fully prepared for the upcoming ordeal/test.

So pretty much, if you can't get your face into an air pocket until the water pressure equalizes (very difficult under the best situation) then RIP.

Sad way to go for Ms. Chao.

 

[pricedm]

Heard rescuers were under the impression that they will be electrocuted if they touching an EV in water. They should know better. All the urban legends and Hollywood movie stunts with hair dryers electrocuting in tubs are all false. I especially get a kick from the impossibility of sparks from an immersion of hair dryer.

So much incompetence by those attempting to rescue Ms. Chao, makes me….sad or angry.

Then again, it was what, after 11p when this occurred. No idea about area lighting, etc. So some factors complicated the rescue. But not being able to break the glass, fear of boogiemanEV, etc….too much

 

[HaulingAss]

I always enjoyed responses like this on aviation forums; “I’m too careful a pilot to ever have this happen” or “I have magic pilot powers and would never make such an error”. Fact is shit happens and sometimes bad design plays a role in enabling bad shit.

Oh, no, anyone can have an accident. Yes, some people are more prone to accidents than others, that is a statistical fact. But you have misunderstood my tongue in cheek response.

The fact is, all higher end cars have laminated glass windows which make it impractical to exit by breaking them. The Cybertruck glass may be more difficult to shatter, but you are not going to exit any vehicle having laminated glass by breaking the glass. Because even after it's been shattered, the laminated nature of the glass still will not let you out.

The fallacy is that the Cybertruck is somehow more dangerous because the laminated glass is harder to shatter. That is false because shattering the glass does not enable escape with any window that is laminated.

In fact, the laminated glass prevents occupants from being ejected through the windows in a roll-over accident, which actually increases safety from a statistical standpoint because death by ejection is much more common than death by drowning inside a vehicle.

Zero people prevent death by escaping through laminated glass and very few people, a miniscule number really, prevent death by shattering non-laminated glass to escape. But if you want weaker, less safe glass for that edge case when you might be submerged before you can roll your window down, be my guest. Lot's of cheaper cars still come with non-laminated glass.

I'm a big fan of using statistics and reason, rather than hyperbole, to inform my opinions. If you are in a Cybertruck when you enter the water, you are already safer than in most other vehicles because you have more flotation time. This is the critical time window in whicjh you need to create your escape by either opening a door or rolling down a window. And the better a vehicle floats, the more time you have. You see, in an ICE vehicle the heavy engine up front makes the vehicle immediately assume a nose-down attitude in the water which, combined with all the perforations in the firewall, hastens sinking. The Cybertruck, in contrast, floats in a relatively balanced manner, due to not having a heavy engine mounted forward and the steer by wire, throttle by wire, and minimal firewall perforations make the cabin more water-tight.

Also, immersion in fresh water takes time to incapacitate electric windows, even when fully submerged. It will happen faster in brackish water, because the salt makes the water conductive. But immersion in typical lakes and rivers, with clean fresh water, will generally leave the electrical windows operable for some time. Fresh water does not conduct electricity.

My tongue-in-cheek response was due to the concern people have over drowning in their vehicle. Most people who drown in their vehicle are not capable of breaking even the cheapest automotive glass and exiting the vehicle safely, either because they are too drunk to rescue themselves or because they have been injured in the accident.

 

[HaulingAss]

Ms. Chao was not "drunk driving" exactly, she was traversing between structures on a large private estate, which is probably why no one thought anything of it.

The legality of it is of no consequence. The fact is, Ms. Chao was operating a motor vehicle under the influence of alcohol. Obviously, she was not capable of safely operating the motor vehicle, nor of rescuing herself, once she got herself into trouble.

I would call that "drunk driving", even if it was technically legal because she was not on a public road.

 

[CyberGus]

I would call that "drunk driving", even if it was technically legal because she was not on a public road.

I'm sure pricedm was referring specifically to the illegal act when he referred to it as a "pandemic", thus my rebuttal.

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