Cybertruck Engineering Innovations - Great Summary

[CyberGus]

I want to know which 2 production vehicles beat it to the market

Sponsored

 

[RVAC]

Can we just buy a Gateway and not a Power Wall? I don't have solar, and dont want solar. But I'd like to have the powershare from CT for outages.

Yes, apparently Powerwall is not required. I'm surprised they didn't, both from a commercial perspective and EM's vision for a distributed energy network.

 

[Gurule92]

.
I spent decades in the defense industry trying to estimate the final product cost of large scale systems - development and product contracts with costs at hundreds of millions to over a billion dollars each - when those systems were in the concept phase with a large degree of innovation or new/un-tried technology. Our estimation errors were almost always in the "too low" direction compared to the actual costs, especially for competitive contracts for a fixed price. That situation may be where Tesla is today with the Cybertruck, and the impact is very likely magnified by inflation over expected levels.

Well that's just agreeing with my statement lol. When I said they made egregious math errors.

The big difference between a defense contract proposal bid being wrong and Tesla being wrong is, unless you are in a cost plus contract you are eating into your profits by going over.

Tesla doesn't have to worry about that because they can just pass it off on us. Which is what my complaint is

 

[wtibbit]

Well that's just agreeing with my statement lol. When I said they made egregious math errors.

The big difference between a defense contract proposal bid being wrong and Tesla being wrong is, unless you are in a cost plus contract you are eating into your profits by going over.

Tesla doesn't have to worry about that because they can just pass it off on us. Which is what my complaint is

Well, probably not math errors, those are too easy to check. Under-estimating the total length of the development schedule is almost always a high risk with significant cost impacts. That risk was realized here.

I’m certain of this; Tesla's finance folks made a considered decision to reach those pricing decisions, trying to model the controlling factors and functions to meet multiple targets. Meeting the original price estimates was not a consideration except for the effect they predicted it would have on (probably near term) sales.

We’re paying a chunk. Even so, Tesla is making less profit over time, also, but that won’t stop our complaining.

 

[Conor Knoxx]

I could have lived without the rear steering. Save the price and complexity. Or make it an optional model.

 

[Crissa]

I could have lived without the rear steering. Save the price and complexity. Or make it an optional model.

Ahh, but making multiple versions means additional development cost. Especially drive train options.

Could someone DM me the info on who determined the steel thickness was lowered? I'm falling behind on the forum, lotsa stuff posted, but I have even more limited time lately.

-Crissa

 

[CyberGus]

I could have lived without the rear steering. Save the price and complexity. Or make it an optional model.

RWS probably adds less than $1000 cost, but provides significant handling benefit

 

[CyberGus]

Ahh, but making multiple versions means additional development cost. Especially drive train options.

Could someone DM me the info on who determined the steel thickness was lowered? I'm falling behind on the forum, lotsa stuff posted, but I have even more limited time lately.

-Crissa

Video directly from Tesla



I’m only like 1000 messages behind lol

 

[wtibbit]

RWS probably adds less than $1000 cost, but provides significant handling benefit

Yes and for me, if it's available, I definitely want RWS on such a long wheelbase vehicle.

If it would have been made an option as was suggested, the buyer's purchase price for the RWS option (or as part of a package) would have beenmuch higher than CyberGus's estimated $1,000 cost.

That's old-car-think, like Porsche, setting a low price for a base vehicle of some given version as a come-on, then selling all of the gotta-have-them features as extra cost options or packages. But that was never an *option* for Tesla.

 

[HaulingAss]

The Cybertruck is the 3rd production vehicle to offer steer-by-wire.

I believe the other two implementations of steer-by-wire had a physical connection between the steering rack and the steering wheel, so not 100% steer by wire. This was implemented with a clutch to disconnect the wheel from the rack when actually steering by wire and engaging the clutch to steer directly, if needed. So it's more like a bunch of add-on components to a traditional steering system that increases part count and manufacturing cost above what Tesla has done by eliminating the physical connection (and the disengagement clutch that required on earlier systems).

In short, this is the first fully steer by wire system ever implemented on a high-volume production vehicle.

 

[HaulingAss]

Can we just buy a Gateway and not a Power Wall? I don't have solar, and dont want solar. But I'd like to have the powershare from CT for outages.

Yes, you can do that, but the additional equipment required to seamlessly provide power outage support is not cheap, at least it is not cheap in Ford Lightning implementations (Ford partnered with another company for the interface electronics and it is not the best implementation according to most of those who tried to implement it). We will have to wait and see what kind of pricing Tesla offers on their implementation. I imagine they will leverage their Powerwall design to bring the cost down somewhat less than Ford's partner can offer. Vertical integration is cheaper than farming things out to third-parties. You avoid all the contracts and supplier uncertainties and most of the management overhead and related expenses by being vertically integrated.

I would probably just buy one Powerwall to gain a bit more storage that is not dependent upon the vehicle. That way the house can remain powered if you need to go on a charging run to a Supercharger that is outside of the power outage and you can also reduce cycling on the vehicle battery.

 

[SlightlySinged]

Not sure why people in this thread are treating the lack of 3mm steel as a negative. If they are able to get all the strength they need from their 1.8mm SS alloy, then why would they add the extra weight for no extra benefit? Is being able to stop a 9mm round not strong enough for you guys? WTH?

 

[HaulingAss]

I could have lived without the rear steering. Save the price and complexity. Or make it an optional model.

I think rear steering transforms the useage of the truck. I know one major disadvantage of our F-150 is the way it's not nimble in tight parking spots. I'm very good at "threading the needle" with only a couple inches of clearance on either side, but it's still awkward and the F-150 feels out of place in many situations.

I'm super pleased that Tesla realized how much value this adds in a world where real estate is increasingly valuable and everything is getting smaller/tighter, including residential driveways, condos, worksites, lumber yards, etc. A traditional pickup is often brought to its knees if you happen to show up during a congested period so the added value is significant.

I value nimbleness to the point that I almost always adjust the steering stops on my motorcycles and cars to the minimum clearance required for the tires I actually have on the car. The Cybertruck's rear wheel steering takes these tweaks to the next level.

 

[Balthezor]

Yes, you can do that, but the additional equipment required to seamlessly provide power outage support is not cheap, at least it is not cheap in Ford Lightning implementations (Ford partnered with another company for the interface electronics and it is not the best implementation according to most of those who tried to implement it). We will have to wait and see what kind of pricing Tesla offers on their implementation. I imagine they will leverage their Powerwall design to bring the cost down somewhat less than Ford's partner can offer. Vertical integration is cheaper than farming things out to third-parties. You avoid all the contracts and supplier uncertainties and most of the management overhead and related expenses by being vertically integrated.

I would probably just buy one Powerwall to gain a bit more storage that is not dependent upon the vehicle. That way the house can remain powered if you need to go on a charging run to a Supercharger that is outside of the power outage and you can also reduce cycling on the vehicle battery.

I might just do that. Is it worth it to wait for Power wall 3? No plans for solar.

 

[HaulingAss]

Video directly from Tesla



I’m only like 1000 messages behind lol

Look at that, right from the mouth of the lead engineer. The body panels are so strong they are actually carrying structural load! How is that possible? What about the load paths?

Who would have thunk? ?

Sponsored