Cybertruck was the 5th bestselling EV in 2024

[YDR37]

It would really surprise me if the Cybertruck doesn't just walk away from the competition (even more so than they have already done).

I'm not aware of any new entrants to the EV pickup market in 2025. Should still be Tesla, Ford, Rivian, and GM, as in 2024. Tesla was out in front of those others in 2024, and most likely will stay ahead in 2025.

Manufacturers like Honda, Toyota, Nissan, Hyundai, and Kia all make EV SUVs, and also ICE pickups. So they seem like logical candidates to make EV pickups, but as far as I know, they have no plans to do so, at least for now. They are probably looking at the disappointing EV pickup sales figures and saying "Nah, let's stick to SUVs".

The one new model that could maybe take some sales away from the CT is the second-generation Rivian R1T Quad. All else being equal, four motors are going to outperform three, and the claimed specs on the new Quad are impressive. The pre-production reviews suggest that the R1T Quad would beat a tri-motor Cyberbeast in a drag race (Rivian has probably tuned it specifically to do that), and it will likely be better off-road as well. The R1T Quad is not going to sell a lot, at an estimated price around $110,000, but there are always some people who will pay top dollar for top performance, plus there may be a halo effect on lower-priced Rivians.

In theory, Tesla could offer a quad-motor Cybertruck, and they have actually talked about this in the past. But Rivian has an advantage here: the plafform for their R1T pickup is shared with the R1S SUV , which sells much better (in fact, the R1S has apparently surpassed the Model X as the top-selling large EV SUV). Rivian probably expects most of their Quad sales to be R1S SUVs, challenging the Model X Plaid. If they can get some additional Quad sales from the R1T pickup, that's a bonus. In contrast, the CT platform is unique; there is no matching SUV to share the development and manufacturing costs.

Sponsored

 

[HaulingAss]

Manufacturers like Honda, Toyota, Hyundai, and Kia make EV SUVs, and also ICE pickups. So they seem like logical candidates to make EV pickups, but as far as I know, they have no plans to do so, at least for now. They are probably looking at the disappointing EV pickup sales figures and saying "Nah, let's stick to SUVs".

A decade ago Honda and Toyota looked at the tiny volume of EV sales and said, "Nah, let's stick to ICE". Dumb move to ignore a rapidly growing market simply because sales volume was currently low. It takes them 7 years to bring a new model to market, they need enough vision to see where things will be in 7 years. 2024 was a record-breaking year for EV pickups, EV pickup sales growth was massive while ICE pickup sales continue their long-term sales decline.

The one new model that could maybe take some sales away from the CT is the second-generation Rivian R1T Quad. All else being equal, four motors are going to outperform three, and the claimed specs on the new Quad are impressive. The pre-production reviews suggest that the R1T Quad would beat a tri-motor Cyberbeast in a drag race (Rivian has probably tuned it specifically to do that), and it will likely be better off-road as well.

Ha-ha. Tesla is not worried about competition from a pickup that costs more to produce than it can sell for. Electric pickups are not where Cybertruck's competition lies, that would be in the massive ICE pickup market that the Cybertruck is already eating into. Cybertruck sales growth potential is massive, and it isn't threatened by the R1T Quad, even if the R1T could sell in large numbers.

In theory, Tesla could offer a quad-motor Cybertruck, and they have actually talked about this in the past. But Rivian has an advantage here: the plafform for their R1T pickup is shared with the R1S SUV , which sells much better (in fact, the R1S has apparently surpassed the Model X as the top-selling large EV SUV). Rivian probably expects most of their Quad sales to be R1S SUVs, challenging the Model X Plaid. If they can get some additional Quad sales from the R1T pickup, that's a bonus. In contrast, the CT platform is unique; there is no matching SUV to share the development and manufacturing costs.

Cybertruck doesn't need to share development costs with an SUV because the pickup market it competes in is so huge. In Cybertrucks first year of production, 2024, it had almost as much volume as all three Rivian vehicles (including their delivery van) combined. It's easier/more efficient to develop and manufacture one model than three.

 

[YDR37]

Ha-ha. Tesla is not worried about competition from a pickup that costs more to produce than it can sell for.

Rivian was targeting profitability in 4Q 2024. We'll have to wait until February 20, when Rivian releases their 4Q 2024 financial results, to see if they achieved it.

 

[HaulingAss]

I think Cybertruck just hit the same wall a few months ago.

I’m still on the fence, I will say if I lived in the north still I wouldn’t touch it, the issue with snow is extremely concerning.

Huh? I've been driving in snowstorms my entire adult life and the Cybertruck performs exceptionally well in the snow. Where did you get that from? Some fake narrative, obviously.

Now most are saying the windshield wipers are awful.

The wiper works pretty well, as confirmed by most of the replies in the most recent "awful wiper" thread. It's not perfect, no wiper is, but if you think the minor issues a minority of people have reported is a big deal in terms of vehicle sales, you are barking up the wrong tree.

 

[HaulingAss]

Rivian was targeting profitability in 4Q 2024. We'll have to wait until February to see if they achieved it.

Just so you know, this was a 'hail mary' attempt by RJ to front load Q4 so they could show a gross profit per vehicle (for one quarter), something Tesla always had (with the exception of a couple of isolated quarters perhaps) since Model S production going back to 2012. Rivian even "forgot" to order the correct number of necessary parts, low Q3 deliveries stoked demand in Q4. Even if they manage to show a gross profit for one quarter, it's as fake as fake can be. They have been working on architecting this gross profit at least since the begining of last year.

I don't say this because I want Rivian to fail, on the contrary, but I don't like to see them misleading investors either. They should have had a gross profit per vehicle as soon as the Gen 1 R1T ramped to reasonable volumes. But they were nowhere near what Tesla had all along.

Gross profit is not net profit because it doesn't include the cost of executive salaries, offices, delivery centers, service facilities, charging networks, advertising and marketing departments, cost of debt, and a whole host of other necessary expenditures. The media never pointed out that Tesla had gross profit per vehicle all along. In 2019 they hit their first in a long string of quarters that were actually net profitable. Big difference between the two. Don't let RJ fool you into thinking Tesla didn't have this from just about the beginning of production.

 

[TyPope]

Tesla VINs on 3s and Ys were never sequential either. i.e a later VIN didn't mean it was produced after an early VIN.

If you were a Tesla 3/Y buyer back in 21/22 when they had 14 month waits (that how long it took for my first Y order). I've owned 4 different Ys so I've been through the process enough times.

We ordered our first Y on April 20th, 2020 and got it early June... Got lucky with just a 2 month wait. It was VIN 5YJYGDEE8LF0112xx so it was still a pretty early version. Surprised us as we ordered after they started deliveries.

Seems odd that a manufacturer would skip around with VINs. Recalls would be nuts... "This recall affects VIN 1, 2, 5, 7, and 9 but not 3,4,6, or 8" Usually they say "Vehicles manufactured between April 1 and June 10th with VINs 1 - 10"

 

[SCTesla]

We ordered our first Y on April 20th, 2020 and got it early June... Got lucky with just a 2 month wait. It was VIN 5YJYGDEE8LF0112xx so it was still a pretty early version. Surprised us as we ordered after they started deliveries.

Seems odd that a manufacturer would skip around with VINs. Recalls would be nuts... "This recall affects VIN 1, 2, 5, 7, and 9 but not 3,4,6, or 8" Usually they say "Vehicles manufactured between April 1 and June 10th with VINs 1 - 10"

They have been skipping vins, most believe discarding those due to QC issues or testing.

It doesn't change a recall VINS 1-X still work as those vehicles would still be impacted, but they no longer exist. When the recall came out in June, they were about 8k off from delivered VINs, that has widened as production went on.

 

[HaulingAss]

Seems odd that a manufacturer would skip around with VINs.

I'm guessing you've never managed auto production before? They batch the VIN numbers and leave some wiggle room at the end of each batch, to give them more flexibility in terms of how many of each variant are produced.

One consideration is that the VIN numbers need to be registered with the government before they can be sold, and those VIN numbers have encoded the variant within them (for example Dual or Tri-Motor). Because demand between variants can fluctuate, they want some flexibility to deal with such variations (as to exactly when they switch back and forth between variants).

In a world without governments, they could could just build them with perfectly sequential serial numbers, like companies producing less regulated, less complex products like power tools probably do. Autos are subject to many more hoops to jump through.

 

[TyPope]

I'm guessing you've never managed auto production before? They batch the VIN numbers and leave some wiggle room at the end of each batch, to give them more flexibility in terms of how many of each variant are produced.

One consideration is that the VIN numbers need to be registered with the government before they can be sold, and those VIN numbers have encoded the variant within them (for example Dual or Tri-Motor). Because demand between variants can fluctuate, they want some flexibility to deal with such variations (as to exactly when they switch back and forth between variants).

In a world without governments, they could could just build them with perfectly sequential serial numbers, like companies producing less regulated, less complex products like power tools probably do. Autos are subject to many more hoops to jump through.

Nope. Never managed production. I did work as an industrial engineer at GM's truck plant in Shreveport, LA but I was there to make the line run more efficiently and didn't track VINs.

 

[mcannock]

Huh? I've been driving in snowstorms my entire adult life and the Cybertruck performs exceptionally well in the snow. Where did you get that from? Some fake narrative, obviously.



The wiper works pretty well, as confirmed by most of the replies in the most recent "awful wiper" thread. It's not perfect, no wiper is, but if you think the minor issues a minority of people have reported is a big deal in terms of vehicle sales, you are barking up the wrong tree.

I am in Canada and although wipers work well with rain and snow, they really suck when trying to clean the windshield using the jets, it actually makes it worse.
It does drives/perform really well on snow! Went through a snowstorm the other day and it was a smooth drive, I did put on winter tires though.

 

[Bhcyber]

The hard part is, will this continue after all of the die-hard Tesla fans like us got our CT in the 1st year

 

[jimbobb23]

Tesla needs more car options ASAP. They are so good but just 3 cars is too few. Model S and X hardly sell. Huge market for cars in the that mid range.

 

[dalton108]

Tesla needs more car options ASAP. They are so good but just 3 cars is too few. Model S and X hardly sell. Huge market for cars in the that mid range.

What’s you’re suggesting is inconsistent with the brand mission. They don’t want to sell you cars; they want to change mobility.

 

[HaulingAss]

Tesla needs more car options ASAP. They are so good but just 3 cars is too few. Model S and X hardly sell. Huge market for cars in the that mid range.

Tesla is scheduled to release two new models to the market early this summer. I think they will be positioned on the least expensive side of their lineup.

 

[Tecyber1]

Pretty freaking good stat considering it unlike those that beat it is a $100k+ EV!

Sponsored