Can Tesla produce an $80k Cybertruck?

[HaulingAss]

The Rivian R1T does.

True, but Rivian nerfed the bed volume by deciding to fit a spare tire under the load bed. This left it with a high bed floor that only has less than 19" of depth up to the tonneau cover. That, combined with the bed only being 4'x4.5' in size, means it can't exactly hold what one would expect a pickup to hold. It's more like a large car trunk, not a pickup truck. I'm accustomed to hauling longer items extending past the tailgate but the short bed length doesn't give you much to work with, even with the tailgate dropped.

It's a nice little electric SUV, but it wouldn't work for the things I need a truck for.

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[drift]

$80k+ truck buyers don't grow on trees. You want volume sales, you better find a way to build an affordable truck. If that tax incentivised CT doesn't materialize, sales will plummet.

Rivian is going down the shitter because not enough people can afford their cars despite selling at a loss.

Remember the exact same thing has been said about Tesla for years.

 

[jerhenderson]

Remember the exact same thing has been said about Tesla for years.

The rivian is very much a niche product, like a jeep wrangler. Niche needs to be profitable to survive.

 

[drift]

The rivian is very much a niche product, like a jeep wrangler. Niche needs to be profitable to survive.

The cyber truck is the very definition of a niche product. One that I waited 4 years for.

 

[txtravwill]

The Rivian R1T does.

Well it is a $1500 add-on/option now so in a way it doesn't at base price by far. Rivian seems to have moved now to keep the base price low, but everything is an option, even the camp speaker, glass shading roof option, tonneau, their "premium" audio, all paint but silver, etc.

 

[drift]

Well it is a $1500 add-on/option now so in a way it doesn't at base price by far. Rivian seems to have moved now to keep the base price low, but everything is an option, even the camp speaker, glass shading roof option, tonneau, their "premium" audio, all paint but silver, etc.

So they have become like every other car manufacturer. Ok nice to know.

 

[txtravwill]

So they have become like every other car manufacturer. Ok nice to know.

Yep, in a way. They are still loosing around $35K per truck/SUV they build so that will help maybe $5K-$7K or so, unless is dampens sales some that negates overall revenue. IMHO the only way Rivian can really survive long-term is to get the R2 platform out ASAP and it needs to be a big hit... BUT, not sure how likely that is since they only have so many service centers, they are at the bottom of the reliability list (almost, with Jeep, etc.), and people tend to stick with brands they know overall in the mass population.

 

[Gurule92]

Yet no other truck on the market comes with one

If the tonneau was optional they would have to change their reported range figures. I don't remember how much it impact it but I'm sure it's not a small amount. I personally don't see it happening.

 

[HaulingAss]

$80k+ truck buyers don't grow on trees. You want volume sales, you better find a way to build an affordable truck. If that tax incentivised CT doesn't materialize, sales will plummet.

Rivian is going down the shitter because not enough people can afford their cars despite selling at a loss.

No, Rivian is struggling because they can't build vehicles efficiently enough (and the refreshed designs are not a large enough step in the right direction). The distinction here is that even if Rivian had unlimited buyers at their MSRPs, they would still lose money. The manufacturing inefficiencies are so pronounced, not even larger sales volumes can fix them.

I've given RJ plenty of time to prove he has what it takes to be a manufacturer of autos, but it's becoming increasing apparent that he's not willing to make the hard decisions to get to where they need to be. I thought the delivery van contracts might be favorable enough to save them, but it's starting to look like that might not be profitable either (or they would be cranking out more of them).

 

[drift]

Yep, in a way. They are still loosing around $35K per truck/SUV they build so that will help maybe $5K-$7K or so, unless is dampens sales some that negates overall revenue. IMHO the only way Rivian can really survive long-term is to get the R2 platform out ASAP and it needs to be a big hit... BUT, not sure how likely that is since they only have so many service centers, they are at the bottom of the reliability list (almost, with Jeep, etc.), and people tend to stick with brands they know overall in the mass population.

Don't forget to point out that Ford lost $135,000.00 on every electric vehicle that they sold last year. Who knows the figure for the other manufacturers.

 

[SteelMyHeart]

That's why teslas have spartan interiors and no buttons. Large interior panels, less interior options, battery options, paint options all are cost saving measures. Most other legacy auto companies are copying tesla for tech and interior styling for EVs out of necessity.

We must remember that tesla almost went bankrupt right before model 3 came out and they very likely would not be here without fleet fuel economy money from ICE legacy companies and a favorable dept of energy loan for over 400 million (they eventually paid it off early). Rivian doesn't have any counter position advantages of being only game in town for EVs like tesla did.

EVs, whether we like it or not, have been subsidized into existence by the government and now tesla is a sustainable business but likely never would have been without the government putting money where the market didn't want to.

 

[GuyV]

That's why teslas have spartan interiors and no buttons. Large interior panels, less interior options, battery options, paint options all are cost saving measures. Most other legacy auto companies are copying tesla for tech and interior styling for EVs out of necessity.

We must remember that tesla almost went bankrupt right before model 3 came out and they very likely would not be here without fleet fuel economy money from ICE legacy companies and a favorable dept of energy loan for over 400 million (they eventually paid it off early). Rivian doesn't have any counter position advantages of being only game in town for EVs like tesla did.

EVs, whether we like it or not, have been subsidized into existence by the government and now tesla is a sustainable business but likely never would have been without the government putting money where the market didn't want to.

They have had the advantage of Amazon and delivery truck sales to support their startup.

 

[GuyV]

Elon talked on the subject of 'Cost Grind' to reduce manufacturing cost by 20% and compared this to a 'Game of Thones' that would be a 'Game of Pennies'
Let's say it takes 18 months or more for the markets outside of North America where the design rules vary and as such changes would happen..... as a Day 1 reservation holder, l would be happy to wait.
They plan for a non FS version end of third quarter or sometime in the last months of the year. Hold on to your Cowboy Hat ?

Yes, he also said they were struggling to get their 4680 production costs down. That they are currently at a cost disadvantage to current purchase prices of batteries, but hopefully will meet them by year end. making them themselves in the U.S. should matter more though once they get to selling in the tax credit range.

 

[Tedacules]

The Real question is can they make one for 60k?

 

[Tedacules]

$80k+ truck buyers don't grow on trees. You want volume sales, you better find a way to build an affordable truck. If that tax incentivised CT doesn't materialize, sales will plummet.

Rivian is going down the shitter because not enough people can afford their cars despite selling at a loss.

I see new R1S's all the time where I live.

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