Driving the Cybertruck

[Sirfun]

Folks, there's more to this story. Check out Porsche's take: https://www.greencarreports.com/new...ycan-electric-car-wont-have-one-pedal-driving

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[Crissa]

The amount of range recovered from a given amount of energy recovered has nothing to do with the battery SoC. If I recover 270 Wh I get ...

Your explanation is great up to here. If your SOC is very high or very low, the voltage difference between the motor and the battery makes the charge less or more efficient. And you cannot store energy if the battery is full. So regen doesn't work at all when the battery is at 100%.

A few EVs have resistor banks to level this out, I'd bet that's what the Taycan does, but most don't do anything about it.

-Crissa

There's a hill I take regularly that I get back 5% SoC on my 8.5 kwh battery. That means that in the two miles down I gain about five on the flat. And more weight makes this work better: https://www.greencarreports.com/news/1124478_world-s-largest-ev-never-has-to-be-recharged

 

[ajdelange]

Interesting. I've driven cars with all braking through the friction brake and cars with regen controlled via a single thrust pedal but never one with regen controlled via two pedals so I can't say whether I would prefer that or rather learn to prefer that as I really like the single pedal. I assume they have considered whether it will drive prospective buyers away. I guess they can always claim in their advertising that it is superior in some way.

 

[Crissa]

I guess they can always claim in their advertising that it is superior in some way.

Yeah, but part of this is... Do you drive like someone who drives an automatic, or someone who drives a stick?

If you're used to an automatic - a car that just goes until you say stop - you'll like the one-pedal. If you've never driven, you'll like the one-pedal with full regen. If you know how to drive a stick, then you're more likely to want a large sweet spot of null accel / decel.

Taycan drivers, motorcycle riders, they're more likely to be the latter. And they'll want to decelerate more smoothly, hence the coasting ability.

-Crissa

 

[ldjessee]

Yeah, but part of this is... Do you drive like someone who drives an automatic, or someone who drives a stick?

If you're used to an automatic - a car that just goes until you say stop - you'll like the one-pedal. If you've never driven, you'll like the one-pedal with full regen. If you know how to drive a stick, then you're more likely to want a large sweet spot of null accel / decel.

Taycan drivers, motorcycle riders, they're more likely to be the latter. And they'll want to decelerate more smoothly, hence the coasting ability.

-Crissa

Maybe the Leaf has changed me, as I used to drive stick and still ride my motorcycle, but I want one pedal driving (and the automatic adjusting cruise control)...

 

[Kamin]

Has anyone compared how much regen a Tesla on autopilot uses with manual control of the one pedal driving?

 

[ajdelange]

Yes, but only qualitatively. Don't be offended but the autopilot is actually better at driving than you are in that it holds speed better than you can. Regen recovers much of the inertial load but not all of it. In the small accelerations and decelerations you constantly make to maintain speed you impose a larger inertial load. Your consumption will be slightly better with autopilot.

 

[Jhodgesatmb]

Maybe the Leaf has changed me, as I used to drive stick and still ride my motorcycle, but I want one pedal driving (and the automatic adjusting cruise control)...

Maybe more likely but not ubiquitous. I learned to drive a Jeep and most of my vehicles have been SUVs or trucks, most of them 4x4s. I owned 6 motorcycles. So I am well versed in using a clutch and a transfer case, but my last 2 vehicles have been automatic AWDs and my wife's cars have all been automatics, and I enjoy the one-pedal control on the M3. Go figure

 

[Sirfun]

Wow, I ran out of fingers trying to count all the motorcycles, manual and automatic transmission vehicles I've owned. But the one thing I HATE with automatics is having to use the brakes on a freeway going downhill! One thing I love with automatics is letting off the throttle way ahead of time and coasting to a stop light, (free mileage). One thing I enjoy with manual trans. is engine braking, the instant you let off the throttle. Then I don't have to use my brakes on the freeway and when I'm play racing and going into turns. Think about it, play racing uphill is way safer and saner, then downhill. So what I'd really like is strong re-gen, with maybe a button on the steering wheel (or yoke) for coasting. But if someone can prove to me that I can get more miles without coasting and always using re-gen I guess I could live without my coast button. ? (yep, I don't have a Tesla yet) so feel free to clue me in!

 

[Mini2nut]

I had a Model S for a long weekend and test drove the Y and 3. The regenerative braking is one of the coolest features of a Tesla. I like Tesla's when driving down a steep grade as well. You get spoiled pretty quickly after the experience. Going back to a regular ICE vehicle definitely feels a bit strange.

 

[VolklKatana]

Wow, I ran out of fingers trying to count all the motorcycles, manual and automatic transmission vehicles I've owned. But the one thing I HATE with automatics is having to use the brakes on a freeway going downhill! One thing I love with automatics is letting off the throttle way ahead of time and coasting to a stop light, (free mileage). One thing I enjoy with manual trans. is engine braking, the instant you let off the throttle. Then I don't have to use my brakes on the freeway and when I'm play racing and going into turns. Think about it, play racing uphill is way safer and saner, then downhill. So what I'd really like is strong re-gen, with maybe a button on the steering wheel (or yoke) for coasting. But if someone can prove to me that I can get more miles without coasting and always using re-gen I guess I could live without my coast button. ? (yep, I don't have a Tesla yet) so feel free to clue me in!

20-30% savings using regen enough to make you consider?

https://www.drivezero.com.au/charging/charging-guides/regenerative-braking-guide/#caption-attachment-321:~:text=Over the years there have been,service your brake pads as often.


Real life 15% per this research paper:
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/267305961_Energy_Saving_Estimates_for_Regenerative_Braking_and_Downhill_Driving_of_Battery_Electric_Vehicles#pf2:~:text=Assuming input-to-output efficiency of the drive,patterns it can be as high

 

[Sirfun]

20-30% savings using regen enough to make you consider?

https://www.drivezero.com.au/charging/charging-guides/regenerative-braking-guide/#caption-attachment-321:~:text=Over the years there have been,service your brake pads as often.


Real life 15% per this research paper:
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/267305961_Energy_Saving_Estimates_for_Regenerative_Braking_and_Downhill_Driving_of_Battery_Electric_Vehicles#pf2:~:text=Assuming input-to-output efficiency of the drive,patterns it can be as high

Thanks, I could totally understand the first article. The second article looked too complicated. BUT, this statement in the second paragraph stopped me in my tracks.

"Many researches show that from one third to one half of the
energy required for the vehicle operation is lost during braking
and downhill driving"

That makes no sense to me.

 

[kpett]

Not sure if the right category, but I want to ask about driving the truck. My current habits might seem strange to some. I try to not use the brake, ever. I am only partly successful. Using the brake is a sign of defeat. All that energy to gain momentum and you just put it into waste heat in a conventional truck. So I lag in traffic (I am sure some hate me) so I do not have to brake often, if at all. A good trip is where I use a brake only once. So my question is do i have to change these habits with the CT? It does have regenerative braking, so am I saving nothing by forgoing the brake petal? Will other drivers like me more now?

While regenerative breaking is better than two pieces of metal generating waste heat, it does not "make" energy it just doesn't lose as much of it. No regenerative system recovers 100% of the energy.

I drive a Leaf and find I get better MPW by not using regenerative braking, but rather coasting as you are currently doing.

 

[MUSK007]

Driving around the city streets in a Tesla with the Regen set to Standard Mode is a fun way to drive. It’s mostly one pedal driving, and feels like a manual trans. I find that I drive slower And safer because I slow down or get off the accelerator pedal sooner and let the car coast to a stop. I ride with friends that brake hard at the last minute and it’s uncomfortable now. I don’t think is saves or builds any battery energy really, just a fun and relaxing way to drive. On the freeway however, I switch to Normal Mode to have a better feel at freeway speeds. I don’t like the excess braking feel at speed. The car slows down to quickly and the potential for a car following to close to rear end me is reduced. On the freeway I also switch to Chill Mode if I’m going to engage the cruise control, because the car will self accelerate way to fast on Ludicrous Mode. Of course I also use Creep Mode and use the break pedal to come to a full and complete stop. Also the car won’t roll backwards or forwards on a hill.

 

[ldjessee]

While regenerative breaking is better than two pieces of metal generating waste heat, it does not "make" energy it just doesn't lose as much of it. No regenerative system recovers 100% of the energy.

I drive a Leaf and find I get better MPW by not using regenerative braking, but rather coasting as you are currently doing.

Interesting that your experience is different than mine. I guess it could be the terrain and driving routes. I live in a part of Indiana that has small hills (100 ft elevation change is about the most I usually cover) and lots of curves. I am also driving short distances (7 mile one way commute; most other trips are less than 30 miles).

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