Foundation Series Remorse

[we7313]

Is anyone else having serious concerns/remorse on the foundation series range? I completed my down payment Christmas eve, and since have been seeing range tests maxing out around 250 miles on the freeway.

I currently have a 2022 Model S long range (405 mile range) and have done the trip Milwaukee to New Orleans. All went well and I felt 400 miles was enough to comfortably stop and recharge every 3-4 hours.

I was planning to use the CyberTruck to travel to Florida frequently. Having to stop every 2 hours kind of changes the dynamic of the trip.

Do you think we have anyway of getting out the 1k down payment considering the range seems to not be what was advertised?

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[Saygmo]

Was hoping I wouldn’t get the invite. Got it before Christmas, went all the way through but didn’t commit, saw some range numbers and decided I need to wait. $80k for the awd seems reasonable if the lockers work well and it’s real world 0-60 numbers are good, for less $ than a fs you could have the awd plus the range extender. But if you’ve got the cash, the truck will be sweet no matter what version. I just don’t NEED a vehicle right now, decided my model 3 will hold me over and I can withstand the fomo.
IF they had included the range extender with the fs, (real added value) or the fs cyberbeast had the 500 mile range originally promised, I’d have 100% pulled the trigger already.

 

[Tanquen]

I don't need the 320 MILES but it would be nice to know what the vehicle can do before you buy it. It looks like the Cybertruck did not get the 6%-ish lower adjustment in listed rage that some of the other Teslas just had.

So how do you get the listed range? Seems like its difficult for them to get 250 miles. The last one I saw was flat freeway with no traffic but it was cold. It cost you 70 miles to have the heat on?

 

[CyberGus]

Is anyone else having serious concerns/remorse on the foundation series range? I completed my down payment Christmas eve, and since have been seeing range tests maxing out around 250 miles on the freeway.

I currently have a 2022 Model S long range (405 mile range) and have done the trip Milwaukee to New Orleans. All went well and I felt 400 miles was enough to comfortably stop and recharge every 3-4 hours.

I was planning to use the CyberTruck to travel to Florida frequently. Having to stop every 2 hours kind of changes the dynamic of the trip.

Do you think we have anyway of getting out the 1k down payment considering the range seems to not be what was advertised?

You should have no trouble getting the EPA range if you follow the EPA conditions.

 

[Wraven]

You should have no trouble getting the EPA range if you follow the EPA conditions.

Agreed - I think people need to be educated on the actual EPA formula.

On a different perspective this level of consistent confusion speaks to the fact the EPA needs to provide a different approach/formula so the average consumer understands what they are reading.

 

[Carlos Thomas]

I think if they can some how figure out how to change the supercharging situation (charge curve) it would not be as bad. These batteries are the largest ones produced by Tesla (for non-commercial use) and I would think they can push out a software update to allow the batteries to “fast charge” for a longer time.

If they don’t, I 100% agree with you. From various videos people are having 40 to 50 minute stops, which makes any sort of multi-day trek 28% longer…based on the 25 hour trip from Austin back to California, which would have been 18 hours in a ICE.

My hope is they are holding back on the software side until they gather more data. Even if the V4 charger at 350 is not going to perform that well if the charging speeds get cut down so quickly.

 

[CyberGus]

I'd like faster supercharging, but not at the expense of my pack health.

Long road trips are always going to require more stops and more time in an EV than an ICE.

 

[dougn0782]

I doubt you will get any sympathy from Tesla and IMO you shouldn't. The EPA estimated range is determined by the EPA and not Tesla. So your beef is actually with the EPA.

The EPA range tests are garbage IMO. They run them on a dynamo in a lab until the battery is dead and average out the cycle results. Average highway speed tests are around 50mph and peak around 60mph. They then apply a 0.7 factor to the results to simulate a "real world" result. Its a crap system that is not accurate.

With that being said "real world" highway numbers are more like 70MPH for most people. At 70MPH an EV will never meet the EPA rated range results because the EPA "real world" results are not real world.

 

[Rusty Shackleford]

I don't need the 320 MILES but it would be nice to know what the vehicle can do before you buy it. It looks like the Cybertruck did not get the 6%-ish lower adjustment in listed rage that some of the other Teslas just had.

So how do you get the listed range? Seems like its difficult for them to get 250 miles. The last one I saw was flat freeway with no traffic but it was cold. It cost you 70 miles to have the heat on?

Keep in mind the EPA rating is full to dead. Then toss on that it is split between highway and city (weighted city). And then the weather and speed. And the AT tires.

Does that all add up to 70 miles? I don’t know. More testing probably required.

 

[CyberGus]

The EPA range tests are garbage IMO.

EV range varies wildly with conditions (weather, terrain, speed, etc.). The EPA ratings are meant to provide a baseline between different models and are not to be taken as a literal "you can go this far between charges".

 

[dougn0782]

EV range varies wildly with conditions (weather, terrain, speed, etc.). The EPA ratings are meant to provide a baseline between different models and is not to be taken as a literal "you can go this far between charges".

Totally agree. Far too many people expect their vehicles to get the range that is stated by the EPA. The real problem IMO is consumers not understanding what the rated range really means.

 

[cvalue13]

been seeing range tests maxing out around 250 miles on the freeway.

On your invite materials, it said 301mi-318mi range, which is clearly the EPA combined estimate

A BEV truck’s EPA highway will be at best 85-87% of its combined. So, 262-278mi highway

EPA highway conditions average 48mph. Do instead a sustained “test” at a higher speed, you get less




People should not be getting surprised by these range outcomes. Some will be a bit better others worse, but I do not understand how people see 301-318 on their invite and think that means they should get that under sustained highway speeds

 

[Celiboy]

I doubt you will get any sympathy from Tesla and IMO you shouldn't. The EPA estimated range is determined by the EPA and not Tesla. So your beef is actually with the EPA.

The EPA range tests are garbage IMO. They run them on a dynamo in a lab until the battery is dead and average out the cycle results. Average highway speed tests are around 50mph and peak around 60mph. They then apply a 0.7 factor to the results to simulate a "real world" result. Its a crap system that is not accurate.

With that being said "real world" highway numbers are more like 70MPH for most people. At 70MPH an EV will never meet the EPA rated range results because the EPA "real world" results are not real world.

Neither will ICE cars/trucks get EPA numbers. Too many factors that contribute to reduced range that aren’t faced in EPA range testing. Also consider that when Tesla states 320 miles of range it’s with all season tires not all terrain tires. People are choosing to pass on the FS due to the range and want the 500 miles Elon promised. If the current truck can’t give you 320 miles, what makes you believe you were ever going to get 500 miles? Because he said so? He also said the AWD would get 318 miles with all terrain tires. Comparing it to MY or M3 range is irrelevant because it weighs twice as much AND has all terrain tires, and is a truck. Personally I’m tired of paying $4.50 - $5.00 a gallon for gas in California and welcome being able to charge at home 98%!of the time where the curve doesn’t matter. If you’re primarily driving long distances, then maybe a truck generally isn’t the right choice.

 

[TruckGenio]

Is anyone else having serious concerns/remorse on the foundation series range? I completed my down payment Christmas eve, and since have been seeing range tests maxing out around 250 miles on the freeway.

I currently have a 2022 Model S long range (405 mile range) and have done the trip Milwaukee to New Orleans. All went well and I felt 400 miles was enough to comfortably stop and recharge every 3-4 hours.

I was planning to use the CyberTruck to travel to Florida frequently. Having to stop every 2 hours kind of changes the dynamic of the trip.

Do you think we have anyway of getting out the 1k down payment considering the range seems to not be what was advertised?

I share the same concern there are a couple of strategies.
The range is comparable to other pickups and the demand is very high. So if you are not happy with it after delivery just sell it. I don’t think you end up taking a loss on the vehicle. The other alternative to canceling and switching to cyberbeast and hoping they figure something out if the cybertruck looses traction with consumers.

 

[TruckGenio]

On your invite materials, it said 301mi-318mi range, which is clearly the EPA combined estimate

A BEV truck’s EPA highway will be at best 85-87% of its combined. So, 262-278mi highway

EPA highway conditions average 48mph. Do instead a sustained “test” at a higher speed, you get less




People should not be getting surprised by these range outcomes. Some will be a bit better others worse, but I do not understand how people see 301-318 on their invite and think that means they should get that under sustained highway speeds

Also 301-318 is at a city highway blend in ideal conditions not 70mph on the highway.

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