Cybertruck will be the last Tesla to use stainless steel exoskeleton

[HaulingAss]

Cybertruck I think has done alright so far considering what the competition has done. Seems like the manufacturers may have overestimated the demands for full size all electric pickups. At least for the time being.

Demand is fluid with price. Lower price = higher demand, higher price = lower demand.

At the right price point, demand for EV pickups is huge. Tesla is already close to that price, the rest are not (as evidenced by the fact that the MSRPs are tens of thousands below the cost to produce and they are not selling well even when they are further discounted and incentivized).

Tesla will hit the price that educated consumers will find attractive and Cybertruck demand will exceed current production capacity.

This is one reason (of many) why big batteries (200+ kWh) are a bad idea for a truck that is designed to sell in high volumes. It pushes the price higher and out of reach of the mass market. Even when the manufacturer offers less expensive, lower range variants the high range version hurts sales of lower range versions because buyers don't want to buy the "inferior" version. Especially if those buyers live in regions with lower densities of accessible DCFCers.

The natural solution is better, more ubiquitous DCFC networks and Level II charging wherever vehicles park. This solution makes for safer, lighter, less expensive trucks with higher payload capacities that don't require commercial truck tires, expensive suspensions and chassis (to deal with high battery weights) and that are affordable to the masses.

This is the EV use model Tesla sees as the future, due to correct thinking about the challenges and costs. This is why Tesla opened Superchargers up to all brands (because there is are synergistic benefits when all EVs can use the same charging infrastructure). As EV penetration increases and becomes more ubiquitous, so will charging. Wherever you park there will be an easy to use Level II charger that bills automatically. Batteries over 200 kWh only be found on heavy-duty commercial trucks.

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[HaulingAss]

It's actually the other way around, Ford's packages predate the Cybertruck's unveil in 2019, it's Tesla that modeled their initial figures to meet or exceed the F-150's max figures.

There were no F-150's offering 14,000 lb. tow packages in 2019, when the Cybertruck's anticipated ratings were released. Ford buyers had to step up to the F-250 to get 14,000 lb. tow ratings.

 

[YDR37]

Rivian is an EV startup that chose to target the truck market, probably as a way to get traction without early direct confrontation with Tesla.

That was Rivian's original sales pitch to investors in a nutshell: "Like Tesla, but for pickups". Rivian was the first to market an EV pickup, with the R1T.

And if Rivian had stuck to that model, they would be dead by now, because the R1T doesn't sell well. Fortunately for Rivian, their R1S SUV sells a lot better. So Rivian is pivoting from electric pickups to electric SUVs. All upcoming Rivian models (the R2, R3, and R3X) are SUVs; there are no announced plans for any more pickups.

In 2024, the R1S outsold the Model X and Model S. In California, which is the country's largest EV market, the R1S was the #6 EV in 2024, just slightly behind the Cybertruck at #5.

Tesla, Rivian, Ford, and GM all make electric pickups and electric SUVs. In every case, the SUV is the sales leader.

 

[Crissa]

Like all other ICE vehicle segments, EVs will conquer eventually.

...Which is the only reason EV companies can predict and carry out if the supplies are available, astounding growth levels, even now.

-Crissa

 

[cybercricket]

There were no F-150's offering 14,000 lb. tow packages in 2019, when the Cybertruck's anticipated ratings were released. Ford buyers had to step up to the F-250 to get 14,000 lb. tow ratings.

Quote from the interwebz :

The 2019 Ford F-150’s 3.5-liter EcoBoost twin-turbo V6 with 375 horsepower and 470 lb-ft of torque can tow up to 13,200 lbs, while the 3.0-liter Power Stroke Turbo Diesel, at 250 horsepower and 440 lb-ft of torque, can tow up to 11,400 lbs.

I'd say 13.2k is close enough to 14k to make the point.

 

[REM]

Of what? Which part of what's been going on haven't you been paying attention to?

I went back and edited the quote to include your 2nd statement. Figured it was self-explanatory.

 

[HaulingAss]

Quote from the interwebz :



I'd say 13.2k is close enough to 14k to make the point.

Maybe you forgot what the point was.

I said it looks like Ford offering 14,000 lbs. in 2022-2023 was in response to Tesla announcing 14,000 lbs. at the Cybertruck reveal in 2019. And when it was learned the Cybertruck would actually be limited to 11,000 lbs. in 2023, Ford quietly dropped the 14,000 lb. option.

It was not a popular option anyway (and it probably displaced a few more profitable F-250 sales anyway).

 

[cybercricket]

Maybe you forgot what the point was.

I said it looks like Ford offering 14,000 lbs. in 2022-2023 was in response to Tesla announcing 14,000 lbs. at the Cybertruck reveal in 2019. And when it was learned the Cybertruck would actually be limited to 11,000 lbs. in 2023, Ford quietly dropped the 14,000 lb. option.

It was not a popular option anyway (and it probably displaced a few more profitable F-250 sales anyway).

That may be your point, but you're ignoring the context. An F150 variant was available with a towing capacity close to 14k without a special package before the Cybertruck. An F150 variant IS available with a towing capacity close to 14k after the Cybertruck. In other words no, if one wants to tow close to 14k with a Ford, they're not forced to go to F-250. And if the upgrade package was dropped, it wasn't necessarily because of the Cybertruck, but perhaps because people who needed such tow rating opted to get the appropriate F-150 variant.

2024 Ford F-150
The 3.5L EcoBoost V6 engine has a maximum towing capacity of 13,500 lbs

 

[GuyV]

I went back and edited the quote to include your 2nd statement. Figured it was self-explanatory.

Nice that you're not quibbling with the first part:

"Yep, the boilerplate in the earnings and shareholder meetings makes that clear regarding Musk's "forward-looking statements", but the reality is that the share price 90% depends upon them, and that they have pretty much been 90% wrong."

As to the second, I would guess his promise that all Teslas going forward from 2019 would be fully full FSD (love triple redundancy he's made necessary) capable will likely be most costly to Tesla so far, but the jury is still out.

 

[GuyV]

That may be your point, but you're ignoring the context. An F150 variant was available with a towing capacity close to 14k without a special package before the Cybertruck. An F150 variant IS available with a towing capacity close to 14k after the Cybertruck. In other words no, if one wants to tow close to 14k with a Ford, they're not forced to go to F-250. And if the upgrade package was dropped, it wasn't necessarily because of the Cybertruck, but perhaps because people who needed such tow rating opted to get the appropriate F-150 variant.

No, his comment was about 14K bragging rights for the F-150, and 13.2K wouldn't have given those if Cybertruck delivered it.

 

[REM]

Nice that you're not quibbling with the first part:

"Yep, the boilerplate in the earnings and shareholder meetings makes that clear regarding Musk's "forward-looking statements", but the reality is that the share price 90% depends upon them, and that they have pretty much been 90% wrong."

As to the second, I would guess his promise that all Teslas going forward from 2019 would be fully full FSD (love triple redundancy he's made necessary) capable will likely be most costly to Tesla so far, but the jury is still out.

I don't agree with anything you said, I just figured we could narrow it down to the 2nd part where Elon made actual promises of anything.

Can you provide proof of where Elon made this promise?

 

[GuyV]

I don't agree with anything you said, I just figured we could narrow it down to the 2nd part where Elon made actual promises of anything.

Can you provide proof of where Elon made this promise?

I'm not wasting more of my time with your nonsense. You and everyone else knows that he did and they've been raking him over it for years now. ???

 

[REM]

I'm not wasting more of my time with your nonsense. You and everyone else knows that he did and they've been raking him over it for years now. ???

Typical response of most people on the internet who want to talk game but never back it up.

 

[GuyV]

Typical response of most people on the internet who want to talk game but never back it up.

If you disagree with something it's on you to explain or show why. What's typical are people who instead of having anything useful to contribute ask others to cite proof of common knowledge and the obvious. Do some research and then show us what evidence you were able to find pro or con. If you can't, then we can help you with that.

 

[cybercricket]

No, his comment was about 14K bragging rights for the F-150, and 13.2K wouldn't have given those if Cybertruck delivered it.

Whatever I guess ? I don't believe there would be a lot of people making a buying decision based on 13.2k vs 14k.

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