Powershare + Tesla Solar + Backup Switch?

[oisiaa]

I already have Tesla Solar without a Powerwall. I want 100% of my house circuits backed up and the ability to basically go "off grid" if there is an extended outage. Do I need the backup switch in addition to the Powershare Gateway? This is an additional purchase along with the Powershare Gateway, right?

With this configuration, can the truck receive excess solar and also discharge if a cloud goes over or over night?

Any advice is greatly welcomed. I have received my email from Qmerit, but have not responded yet. My power company is Southern California Edison and I understand that the Backup Switch is not yet approved with SCE. Should I wait until it's approved and a known product before I request the install?

Thanks!

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[AlmostHuman]

The Tesla site has all the deployment options. My understanding is the Powershare V3 Gateway will not have enough breaker slots for the entire home.

https://www.tesla.com/powershare

 

[AlmostHuman]

 

[oisiaa]

Thanks, I hadn't seen that before. My concern is that I do not have a Powerwall. I do have the Tesla PV inverters though. My setup would look like the bottom image with the solar going to the Tesla inverters and then to the panel.

It seems like my config should be supported, but it is concerning when it isn't directly depicted. It should be a dead simple install with only the backup switch (pending SCE approval) and Wall Connector needing to be installed.

 

[Woodrick]

I already have Tesla Solar without a Powerwall. I want 100% of my house circuits backed up and the ability to basically go "off grid" if there is an extended outage. Do I need the backup switch in addition to the Powershare Gateway? This is an additional purchase along with the Powershare Gateway, right?

With this configuration, can the truck receive excess solar and also discharge if a cloud goes over or over night?

Any advice is greatly welcomed. I have received my email from Qmerit, but have not responded yet. My power company is Southern California Edison and I understand that the Backup Switch is not yet approved with SCE. Should I wait until it's approved and a known product before I request the install?

Thanks!

I'm pretty sure that all of your requirements are not possible at this time. No charging of the vehicle while it is providing power is one. And is you solar even big enough to charge the vehicle? And run your house while doing so.

You'll need to temper your requirements, AFAIK.

 

[oisiaa]

And is you solar even big enough to charge the vehicle? And run your house while doing so.

Yes, easily. It's a 10kW system and my house uses ~0.4kW as a baseline.

If that's the case, it would probably look like the second image except with solar connected. During the day the solar would offset loads and Powershare would pick up any sack to include through the night. If it can't accept charge while in Powershare mode....that would be a bummer, but might be on purpose to prevent people from trying to go off grid for weeks-months.

With this setup, the truck would only provide power above and beyond what solar is producing. Not terrible and I could make that last for several weeks as my consumption between sunset and sunrise is <10kWh/day.

 

[Woodrick]

Yes, easily. It's a 10kW system and my house uses ~0.4kW as a baseline.

If that's the case, it would probably look like the second image except with solar connected. During the day the solar would offset loads and Powershare would pick up any sack to include through the night. If it can't accept charge while in Powershare mode....that would be a bummer, but might be on purpose to prevent people from trying to go off grid for weeks-months.

With this setup, the truck would only provide power above and beyond what solar is producing. Not terrible and I could make that last for several weeks as my consumption between sunset and sunrise is <10kWh/day.

Sound good, but that's just not the way it works.

You cannot charge and provide power at the same time. Powershare cannot "pick up slack" either your loads are on it or are not.

Your solar doesn't put out full power except for a very few hours. And even then, a cloud will kill it.

Powershare does NOT WORK as a Powerwall. Powershare is for outages only.

There is no second image with solar. Solar only appears in the Powerwall diagram. This is NOT an accidental overlook.

I'm assuming that you are currently on a grid-tie system and are aware what happens during the day if there is a power outage, your solar shuts down.
It may be possible with a transfer switch installed to have the Powershare provide power and the solar augment it during a daytime failure.

And while your house baseline may be 0.4kW, what is your house's peak? If you have whole-house air conditioners, you very easily may be beyond the capabilities of Powershare.

 

[oisiaa]

Sound good, but that's just not the way it works.

You cannot charge and provide power at the same time. Powershare cannot "pick up slack" either your loads are on it or are not.

Your solar doesn't put out full power except for a very few hours. And even then, a cloud will kill it.

Powershare does NOT WORK as a Powerwall. Powershare is for outages only.

There is no second image with solar. Solar only appears in the Powerwall diagram. This is NOT an accidental overlook.

I'm assuming that you are currently on a grid-tie system and are aware what happens during the day if there is a power outage, your solar shuts down.
It may be possible with a transfer switch installed to have the Powershare provide power and the solar augment it during a daytime failure.

And while your house baseline may be 0.4kW, what is your house's peak? If you have whole-house air conditioners, you very easily may be beyond the capabilities of Powershare.

How are you speaking with such authority? Just curious.

Yes, I have a grid-tied system and I'm well aware of baseline vs. peak loads of my house.

Powerwalls have solar inverters built in to them. I have Tesla branded solar inverters which are software defined just like the rest of the ecosystem. I would be surprised if solar can't be integrated with Powershare to some extent unless it is purposely not allowed to prevent abuse of the truck's battery for long-term off grid operation.

As for "picking up the slack". If the solar is covering 100% of the load, then Powershare will just export 0W as if there is no load. As the load increases above solar production, Powershare will export to support the load. This is no different to how the grid feeds a grid-tied system.

 

[mongo]

How are you speaking with such authority? Just curious.

Yes, I have a grid-tied system and I'm well aware of baseline vs. peak loads of my house.

Powerwalls have solar inverters built in to them. I have Tesla branded solar inverters which are software defined just like the rest of the ecosystem. I would be surprised if solar can't be integrated with Powershare to some extent unless it is purposely not allowed to prevent abuse of the truck's battery for long-term off grid operation.

As for "picking up the slack". If the solar is covering 100% of the load, then Powershare will just export 0W as if there is no load. As the load increases above solar production, Powershare will export to support the load. This is no different to how the grid feeds a grid-tied system.

The local installer said Powershare can work with 11.5 kW (AC) of solar. They spec IQ8As, so I'm guessing in grid forming mode.

 

[oisiaa]

The local installer said Powershare can work with 11.5 kW (AC) of solar. They spec IQ8As, so I'm guessing in grid forming mode.

That makes more sense. Considering that Powerwalls + Solar can operate off grid in a "grid forming mode", I'd assume that the Tesla Solar Inverter (stand alone) has similar capabilities when coupled with the Powershare Gateway. Time will tell if this is true.

 

[Woodrick]

How are you speaking with such authority? Just curious.

Yes, I have a grid-tied system and I'm well aware of baseline vs. peak loads of my house.

Powerwalls have solar inverters built in to them. I have Tesla branded solar inverters which are software defined just like the rest of the ecosystem. I would be surprised if solar can't be integrated with Powershare to some extent unless it is purposely not allowed to prevent abuse of the truck's battery for long-term off grid operation.

As for "picking up the slack". If the solar is covering 100% of the load, then Powershare will just export 0W as if there is no load. As the load increases above solar production, Powershare will export to support the load. This is no different to how the grid feeds a grid-tied system.

I'm an Electrical Engineer and I have good knowledge of the options and great knowledge of what has to be done.

I am quite aware that the Powerwalls have inverters in them. They can be configured in parallel to allow for higher loads. Many houses require multiple Powerwalls just to handle the load requirements.

The Powershare available today is not able to provide power, if the circuit already has power. Just the opposite of your grid-tie system that requires power to operate. Before the Powershare can connect, it has to get the gateway to disconnect from the utility. And it can't charge when providing power.

If wired correctly, it's possible that the Solar may be able to come back online after the Cybertruck starts providing power, but I'm not sure of this. But in any case, this means that the grid is down, no commerical power.

Don't believe me, get an appointment with the folks who installed your solar and see what they say.

 

[oisiaa]

If wired correctly, it's possible that the Solar may be able to come back online after the Cybertruck starts providing power, but I'm not sure of this. But in any case, this means that the grid is down, no commerical power.

None of this conflicts with my understanding of how it should/could work with solar. I guess we need to wait and see.

I probably won't contact the installer until SCE approves the Backup Switch.

 

[mongo]

The Powershare available today is not able to provide power, if the circuit already has power.

Yeah, based on today's software. Eventually it will, that's the missing piece for installations with Powerwalls.

 

[Woodrick]

Yeah, based on today's software. Eventually it will, that's the missing piece for installations with Powerwalls.

But that's with Powerwalls. I'm not sure that they would ever support Cybertruck as a Powerwall. As well as I remember, the answer to that was a no. Probably the biggest reason is the battery wear. It's hard for them to provide the same warranty on the batteries when they also perform Powerwall storage functions.

And there's also little things like "does it make sense to run the Cybertruck battery down overnight and try to drive it the next day?" When does it get a chance to charge?

 

[oisiaa]

Yes, I agree that if there are limits, it's likely an artificial limit for warranty reasons.

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