tax credit for the cybertruck

[chalupacabre]

One version has a price cap at 80k. None of it's been signed into law yet so that may change. The way Biden is so chummy with the Unions and Big Auto, they might have a carve out for trucks so the Hummer and the expensive F150 builds can get in. (Union made trucks only of course)

I doubt the Cyberquad will count against that, but it will make for some tough choices for folks who wanted the Tri motor plus FSD. Those 1,500 off-road tires might end up costing 11,500 instead.

Lots of weird math to keep that rebate.

Of course most of the interesting F150 builds, all of the early Rivian builds, and all Hummer builds are out of the running as well.

Believe you can upgrade FSD from the app after purchase, so once rebate is recieved, free FSD!

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[Ogre]

Unfortunately, there has been no action on this bill except introduction. So this revision of tax credit for EV purchases which would reopen to new Telsa purchases is a wish currently, which will need to be revisited by most on here at a later date.

They can't really move forward on this bill until the infrastructure bill plays out.

Senate voted and approved the bill Saturday (yeah weird huh) so maybe we'll see Biden sign it by the end of the week. Then we might see some interest in the bill with the EV incentives.

 

[Throwcomputer]

They can't really move forward on this bill until the infrastructure bill plays out.

Senate voted and approved the bill Saturday (yeah weird huh) so maybe we'll see Biden sign it by the end of the week. Then we might see some interest in the bill with the EV incentives.

I do hope the credits come back, but my optimism is tempered by the functionality of the decisionmakers, especially with anything even remotely labeled "liberal".

 

[tidmutt]

I would think Tesla would be savvy enough to do some shenanigans with the invoice so even if you order the ATV, FSD etc. you are under the cap.

Honestly, as much as FSD Beta 9 is looking pretty damn impressive I'm thinking of removing my FSD order and just subscribing. Looks like I might have another year or so to decide anyway.

 

[Crissa]

I do hope the credits come back, but my optimism is tempered by the functionality of the decisionmakers, especially with anything even remotely labeled "liberal".

Why 'liberal' and not the 'conservatives' who are cutting the top-line number for no reason but expecting the liberals to keep the country running? The performivity of the 50 Republicans (and two conservative Dems) in the Senate is frustrating.

-Crissa

 

[Ogre]

Well that went sideways.

 

[Crissa]

Well that went sideways.

*shrug*

Lots of blame to go around, but rolling up sleeves and getting things done is mostly one side while giving favors, self-dealing, and receiving indictments is the other.

-Crissa

 

[Deleted member 12457]

I would think Tesla would be savvy enough to do some shenanigans with the invoice so even if you order the ATV, FSD etc. you are under the cap.

Honestly, as much as FSD Beta 9 is looking pretty damn impressive I'm thinking of removing my FSD order and just subscribing. Looks like I might have another year or so to decide anyway.

I believe vehicle purchases in CA and WA treat each vehicle as a separate purchase. The ATV would be licensed and taxed separately not together. Therefore, you would submit a tax credit for each. This might not be beneficial if the eATV isn't scheduled for a tax credit but if the ATC is included in the overall purchase price and the IRS(?) doesn't want them separated then a DM CT with ATCV and FSD might be under the $80K cap. Are eBikes and eMotorcycles getting a tax rebate?

As for FSD, that's part of the vehicle like having an expensive audio system upgrade so it's included in the overall cost.

 

[Deleted member 12457]

I would think Tesla would be savvy enough to do some shenanigans with the invoice so even if you order the ATV, FSD etc. you are under the cap.

Honestly, as much as FSD Beta 9 is looking pretty damn impressive I'm thinking of removing my FSD order and just subscribing. Looks like I might have another year or so to decide anyway.

I thought when I reserved my CT with FSD, FSD was locked in at $7K not the $10K it's showing now. I've also read outright buying FSD when the CT, or any Tesla, gets the final version the actual cost will be much higher than $10K and actually worth several times that amount.

Sorry, I read this somewhere on the internet so I thought it must be true.

 

[Ogre]

Biden's plan is for the credit to not fade out until the US fleet is 50% EV. Which is still too early, if you ask me, but way longer than it should take to get our trucks.

I don't think the incentives are even needed at this point. Look at how the Model 3 and Model Y have gained momentum even when they lack the EV rebate. The rebates allowed manufacturers to create cars which are not appealing without the incentives. Look at the way the sales of the LEAF and the Bolt crashed when their incentives ran out (actually Leaf sales crashed before their incentives ran out).

We're at an inflection point here and incentives won't be needed within just a few years. The Cybertruck is the first of what I suspect will be a string of EVs which are more affordable and better performing than their ICE counterparts. The Model 3 came close, but came in at the high end of the sedan market.

What incentives are going to do is accelerate this whole process which will favor Tesla far more than people realize. As far as I can tell, there is nobody else in the US ready to crank out more than a few 10s of thousands of EVs a year. Tesla is delivering 500,000 per year right now and when Texas comes fully online, that's going to be well over a million per year to the US alone.

That's $10billion a year in government assistance. Plus a big chunk of money from the Biden plan for building out the Supercharger network.

 

[Throwcomputer]

I don't think the incentives are even needed at this point. Look at how the Model 3 and Model Y have gained momentum even when they lack the EV rebate. The rebates allowed manufacturers to create cars which are not appealing without the incentives. Look at the way the sales of the LEAF and the Bolt crashed when their incentives ran out (actually Leaf sales crashed before their incentives ran out).

We're at an inflection point here and incentives won't be needed within just a few years. The Cybertruck is the first of what I suspect will be a string of EVs which are more affordable and better performing than their ICE counterparts. The Model 3 came close, but came in at the high end of the sedan market.

What incentives are going to do is accelerate this whole process which will favor Tesla far more than people realize. As far as I can tell, there is nobody else in the US ready to crank out more than a few 10s of thousands of EVs a year. Tesla is delivering 500,000 per year right now and when Texas comes fully online, that's going to be well over a million per year to the US alone.

That's $10billion a year in government assistance. Plus a big chunk of money from the Biden plan for building out the Supercharger network.

The credits are incentivizing and rewarding manufacturers for pushing progress.. instead of incentivizing and rewarding the refusal to progress, which is the norm currently.

Yes it will benefit Tesla predominantly up front.. but it will also push resistant manufacturers to move to modern technology as their sales numbers decrease over time when everyone and their mother can get a better car for less with the tax incentive through Tesla.

EDIT: and Im not sure but it might have been an end to the credit when EV reach 50% for all vehicle sales, not by manufacturer. As the credit wouldn't really benefit Tesla if understood to cap at 50% of their total sales, given they are already at 100% of their vehicle sales being EV. If that were the case, then Tesla would only get a tax credit for new sales extension of 3 years, since they meet the requirement immediately.

Regardless.. whatever it was, doesn't matter until something is finalized and we are all in the same wait and see boat!

 

[tidmutt]

I believe vehicle purchases in CA and WA treat each vehicle as a separate purchase. The ATV would be licensed and taxed separately not together. Therefore, you would submit a tax credit for each. This might not be beneficial if the eATV isn't scheduled for a tax credit but if the ATC is included in the overall purchase price and the IRS(?) doesn't want them separated then a DM CT with ATCV and FSD might be under the $80K cap. Are eBikes and eMotorcycles getting a tax rebate?

As for FSD, that's part of the vehicle like having an expensive audio system upgrade so it's included in the overall cost.

What is to stop Tesla from simply asking you to register your "interest" in buying an ATV or FSD? After you purchase the truck an email is sent with a link to purchase the ATV and the FSD in separate transactions.

 

[tidmutt]

I thought when I reserved my CT with FSD, FSD was locked in at $7K not the $10K it's showing now. I've also read outright buying FSD when the CT, or any Tesla, gets the final version the actual cost will be much higher than $10K and actually worth several times that amount.

Sorry, I read this somewhere on the internet so I thought it must be true.

I have read all the same. It's true that if Tesla ever reaches something like full autonomy then the value climbs significantly. So the purchase is a gamble. I do know that if my partner bought it on our Model 3 it would have felt like a rip-off as it's been a couple of years and still no FSD... sure, Tesla is closer than ever, but FSD Beta 9 is out, the fundamentals are better but the actual functionality is roughly the same or a little worse then the previous version. That's okay, with better fundamentals it will improve quickly. Elon talks about Beta 10 and 11, but how long before those are out?

I will keep watching the progress, I have FSD on order but I may decide to remove if it still feels many iterations away. Even if say FSD RC1 is AMAZING and is almost Level 5 it will still need regulatory approval before I can actually use it to make money. By the time that happens I may be ready to buy move on from the CT. I am not one of these who wants the CT to last 20 years, I'll likely sell it after 3-5 years, depends if there is something more interesting to drive.

In the end it's a gamble.

 

[tidmutt]

I don't think the incentives are even needed at this point. Look at how the Model 3 and Model Y have gained momentum even when they lack the EV rebate. The rebates allowed manufacturers to create cars which are not appealing without the incentives. Look at the way the sales of the LEAF and the Bolt crashed when their incentives ran out (actually Leaf sales crashed before their incentives ran out).

We're at an inflection point here and incentives won't be needed within just a few years. The Cybertruck is the first of what I suspect will be a string of EVs which are more affordable and better performing than their ICE counterparts. The Model 3 came close, but came in at the high end of the sedan market.

What incentives are going to do is accelerate this whole process which will favor Tesla far more than people realize. As far as I can tell, there is nobody else in the US ready to crank out more than a few 10s of thousands of EVs a year. Tesla is delivering 500,000 per year right now and when Texas comes fully online, that's going to be well over a million per year to the US alone.

That's $10billion a year in government assistance. Plus a big chunk of money from the Biden plan for building out the Supercharger network.

I think your logic is correct although I will take the rebate.

I do think it's safer to have the rebates. The transition to EVs does seem inevitable now but I'd rather be cautious and continue to offer incentives. I don't really care about the cost, it's tiny compared to the expenditure on other things. The traditional automakers aren't exactly inspiring when it comes to EVs and if the incentives favor Tesla then so be it, it favors them because they are the ones who created the market. I won't shed a tear if it's the nail in the coffin of Ford and GM, perhaps it's time that younger, more nimble companies replaced them.

 

[tidmutt]

The credits are incentivizing and rewarding manufacturers for pushing progress.. instead of incentivizing and rewarding the refusal to progress, which is the norm currently.

Yes it will benefit Tesla predominantly up front.. but it will also push resistant manufacturers to move to modern technology as their sales numbers decrease over time when everyone and their mother can get a better car for less with the tax incentive through Tesla.

EDIT: and Im not sure but it might have been an end to the credit when EV reach 50% for all vehicle sales, not by manufacturer. As the credit wouldn't really benefit Tesla if understood to cap at 50% of their total sales, given they are already at 100% of their vehicle sales being EV. If that were the case, then Tesla would only get a tax credit for new sales extension of 3 years, since they meet the requirement immediately.

Regardless.. whatever it was, doesn't matter until something is finalized and we are all in the same wait and see boat!

My understanding is that the credit phases out when EVs reach 50% of total sales for the automotive market. Not per manufacturer. They seemed like very aggressive and effective incentives in that they are in place until a real shift has occurred in the industry.

Something may have change since it was announced though.

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