12V vs 48V

[ÆCIII]

I was hoping to get an answer in dollars and ounces-or-grams per vehicle, not percentages.

Well that would be out of context because each system or area of the vehicle obviously has it's own aspects engineers are working on to improve efficiency in the other various areas as well.

Trying to drag the whole vehicle contextually into efforts of a single system improvement would be a sound byte or misleading, because this is certainly not the only thing Tesla is doing for improvements.

Acting like one little thing is really the only improvement that's being made, is a 'give up' attitude, and of course Tesla is always trying to improve several thing at any given time. Any improvement in efficiency is worth doing as long as it's not cost prohibitive and doesn't implicate problems with other systems.

- ÆCIII

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[ÆCIII]

That's likely because the vendors are too entangled in things they shouldn't be, or possibly one is too entangled with those outside vendors. That's one of the benefits of vertical integration, in being able to rip off the band-aide and break stagnant fevers.

I like a company that doesn't give two $h1ts about what some vendors think.

- ÆCIII

 

[Bill837]

I love how Gordon Johnson often appears in the role of 'total and complete idiot' in discussions. How did that guy get any credibility from anyone?

The Hank Johnson of stock analysts......

 

[ÆCIII]

The Hank Johnson of stock analysts......

I try to be careful before I comment whenever I can be, so that I can be thorough and make some contribution whenever possible. I also wouldn't want to unfairly "...capsize" anyone's point of view! ?

- ÆCIII

 

[CyberGus]

I was hoping to get an answer in dollars and ounces-or-grams per vehicle, not percentages.

I scoff at your "ounces and grams".

"The wiring harness is one of three heaviest subsystems in many vehicles—as much as 150 lbs in highly contented vehicles—and it's very typical for the average vehicle to have 100–120 lbs of wire harness in the vehicle."
- https://semiengineering.com/shedding-pounds-in-automotive-electronics/

 

[Jhodgesatmb]

And also, Tesla has said CT is only 80% 48v

The other 20%?

Might it be weighted towards the “normal” UI features: monitors, plugs, etc.?

I think that what Tesla said is that 80% of the controllers would be Tesla made. I do not recall them saying that the truck would only be 80% 48V. They are using a hub and spoke type system, where the hubs interact over ethernet (POE, or some such) and that the devices hang off the hubs, reducing the amount of wire used. I suspect that the hubs will have 12v connections to devices. Can someone more knowledgable comment on this?

 

[cvalue13]

I think that what Tesla said is that 80% of the controllers would be Tesla made. I do not recall them saying that the truck would only be 80% 48V. They are using a hub and spoke type system, where the hubs interact over ethernet (POE, or some such) and that the devices hang off the hubs, reducing the amount of wire used. I suspect that the hubs will have 12v connections to devices. Can someone more knowledgable comment on this?

agree the percentage probably isn’t spot on. But also think it’s still more of a mixed platform

there’s still a low voltage (12v) and high voltage (battery) in addition to the mid-voltage system (48v)

 

[FutureBoy]

Can someone more knowledgable comment on this?

In a disagreement this often means one is asking for validation of their viewpoint.

 

[PilotPete]

I was hoping to get an answer in dollars and ounces-or-grams per vehicle, not percentages.

The journey of 1,000 miles begins with a single step.

 

[Jhodgesatmb]

In a disagreement this often means one is asking for validation of their viewpoint.

Or just laziness. Here is a link from Investor Day that talks specifically about the Cybertruck controllers. It is backing up my statement about distributed nodes connected by ethernet:



Here is a link where they talk about the 48V architecture. They say that most of the Cybertruck will use a consolidated network architecture and that the next-generation vehicle will use it completely. They didn't say anything about the Cybertruck only using 80% 48v architecture:



So, not a disagreement requiring validation.

 

[ÆCIII]

I may have come across a little arrogant or presumptuous, but do actually respect other points of view yours included. I've seen many comments from legacy auto shills over recent months making broad vague statements, so at times I'm probably reacting toward that due to many naysayers trying to throw shade on Tesla.

What some may be overlooking, is the sheer speed that manufacturers in China and other countries can adapt and make something new, especially with things electrical or technical. Just look at how many new drills and power tools have shown up in big box stores over the last five to ten years, and how many types, using a myriad of different voltages and brands of about anything one would ever want.

If I were someone working in such technical sectors at an American company, I would not be trying to reinforce the status quo, but instead embrace agile approaches and encourage leadership and management to do so, because to be frank if they don't, China or other countries are likely going to eat their lunch. The world is a competitive place as far as manufacturing, trade and market share is concerned.

Tesla seems to be smartly preparing to manufacture needed accessories and continue strengthening their vertical integration as well. They did say they were standing up a dedicated development team for Cybertruck accessories. So for me, it's hard to understand how some people still armchair criticize Tesla for their engineering decisions, even after all the innovation and success that Tesla has accomplished over the past 15 years.

Again I respect your point of view but for long term outlooks, I do hope your place of work is not with legacy auto considering their focus and trends over recent years.

- ÆCIII

 

[JWass]

I was hoping to get an answer in dollars and ounces-or-grams per vehicle, not percentages.

The average weight of wiring in cars is 150lbs. So a 4 x size down in wiring diameter and potentially weight is huge. Thats the weight of a heat pump or other heavy duty system. Or extra batteries in the pack. That extend range. Win, win, win

 

[PilotPete]

What some may be overlooking, is the sheer speed that manufacturers in China and other countries can adapt and make something new, especially with things electrical or technical. Just look at how many new drills and power tools have shown up in big box stores over the last five to ten years, and how many types, using a myriad of different voltages and brands of about anything one would ever want.

I was speaking recently to one of the managers of a highly technical IT company with contracts with the DoD. They echo the same stories I heard over the past decade at my previous employer. The IT company thwarts over 400 hacking threats EVERY day, with the VAST majority coming from China. Their appetite for “back door intel” is unquenchable. And if you get your product to market without them seeing it first, their ability to tear it apart, reverse engineer the thing and build an exact copy makes Sandy Munroe look bad. They are covering all the bases, innovating, copying, and undercutting.

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