SparkChaser

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F this chump! Cramer is constantly wrong and nothing but a Muppet for whomever has their hand up his backside to make his mouth move.
He is there to make movement happen. He tells everyone a thing and they react. This creates an opportunity for others to take advantage of the reaction.... Capitalisium by manufactured information...
Sponsored

 

MEWoodsMFG

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He is there to make movement happen. He tells everyone a thing and they react. This creates an opportunity for others to take advantage of the reaction.... Capitalisium by manufactured information...
I think we are essentially saying the same thing, only one of us decided to use a Muppet metaphor.:geek:
 

charliemagpie

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So Cramer says CT is Ugly a will get runover by Ford.

How uncouth ;) We should never reciprocate, especially on the Cybertruck Owners Club forum.
 

kbolt

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I do not think Tesla/Elon would have advertised their range values for the 3 trims had they weren’t certain they could achieve those numbers. On range they and performance they have never failed to achieve or succeed their promises. Which trim will come first (Tri, Quad, Dual) is anyone’s guess but I am certain of them achieving their range-for-trim values.

I am less certain about how much ‘effective’ range they will have. A truck is a different beast than a sedan. Telling the buyer 300 miles or 500 miles in a sedan is very different than telling a truck user the same thing. If they tell me 500 I had better get at least 400 on a 20%-80% charge basis. That way I don’t have to charge more than 1-2 times a week. I would feel much better if they deliver the truck with an actual, practical range like they did with the Semi; 500 miles towing at capacity from Fremont to San Diego!
I charge every night at home so I always wake up with 80%. Not sure about the idea of charging 1-2 times a week.
 

Jhodgesatmb

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I charge every night at home so I always wake up with 80%. Not sure about the idea of charging 1-2 times a week.
I do not drive every day and when I do drive it is 80 miles for the whole day so even now I can charge 2-3 days a week and be fine. I see no need to. Keep the car ‘topped off’ and Tesla has never provided me with a good rationale for keeping the car plugged in.
 


firsttruck

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I do not drive every day and when I do drive it is 80 miles for the whole day so even now I can charge 2-3 days a week and be fine. I see no need to. Keep the car ‘topped off’ and Tesla has never provided me with a good rationale for keeping the car plugged in.
Myself I do not need Tesla to give me a reason to plug in every night.

Just standard emergency preparedness means I would charge every night so if there is bad weather that gives a reason to flee, bad weather blacks out power for days, emergency long trip to visit ailing friends/relatives, or an ICE vehicle crashes into power pole and blacks out neighborhood, I will be ready and have most of my EV's range immediately available.

As the Eagle Boy Scout I was, as a wilderness cross-country skier, as a hiker of 14ers, as a turn around my vehicle to point down slope at mountain trailhead before start of hike (in case rushed emergency exit), as a back in to parking spacer, I will always charge my EV every night :)
 

Jhodgesatmb

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Myself I do not need Tesla to give me a reason to plug in every night.

Just standard emergency preparedness means I would charge every night so if there is bad weather that gives a reason to flee, bad weather blacks out power for days, emergency long trip to visit ailing friends/relatives, or an ICE vehicle crashes into power pole and blacks out neighborhood, I will be ready and have most of my EV's range immediately available.

As the Eagle Boy Scout I was, as a wilderness cross-country skier, as a hiker of 14ers, as a turn around my vehicle to point down slope at mountain trailhead before start of hike (in case rushed emergency exit), as a back in to parking spacer, I will always charge my EV every night :)
Interesting perspective. I never let my SOC drop below 20% at home (usually more like 100 miles) and I live 12 miles from ‘safety’ in 3 directions.

What I meant about Tesla is them telling me how best to preserve the maximum lifetime for my batteries. If I had some research showing that leaving the car plugged in would ensure the best lifetime I would do it for certain.
 

Crissa

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I do not drive every day and when I do drive it is 80 miles for the whole day so even now I can charge 2-3 days a week and be fine. I see no need to. Keep the car ‘topped off’ and Tesla has never provided me with a good rationale for keeping the car plugged in.
There's no reason to, unless you want it to pre-condition in the morning without losing range. If you leave it plugged in, it will just turn off when it's at its state of charge and not turn back on except to check the network and sentry mode.

-Crissa
 

firsttruck

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Interesting perspective. I never let my SOC drop below 20% at home (usually more like 100 miles) and I live 12 miles from ‘safety’ in 3 directions.
.....

I have lived in bay area before (as well as a dozen other places in U.S.) and I can not image a place where only 12 miles would be enough for most people to reasonably ensure safety from most common threats or unexpected travel needs.

Bad weather and cascading grid failures blacks out power to large areas.

Emergency long trip to visit ailing friends or relatives.

Domestic terrorists shooting up or bombing electrical grid components to cause grid failures and black out of large areas

-------------------------------------

** Just a few of the large outages

California stands out as the state with the most power outages between 2002 and 2022. This state had a total of 94 outages, 28 more than second-place holder, Florida. The likelihood of an outage is much higher in California than in any other state.

Published 1982 Dec 23
December 22 - MILLIONS LOSE ELECTRIC POWER AS STORM BLASTS
The power failures were in scattered but often densely populated areas from San Francisco to San Diego and as far east as Yuma, Ariz., and Las Vegas.
A transmission tower near Tracy, California collapsed onto an adjacent tower bringing down two 500-kV lines and a pair of 230-kV lines that passed underneath the 500-kV right of way. Total loss of 12,530 MW affected approximately five million people on the west coast.
https://www.nytimes.com › millio...

Published 1994 December 14
California and five other western states
SAN FRANCISCO (AP) _ A disruption in the power grid criss-crossing the West cut electricity in eight states early today, leaving more than 1.2 million customers briefly in the dark and shutting down the Diablo Canyon nuclear power plant.
https://apnews.com/article/52340617da7c54d4533449d7e37bf563

Published 1996 Aug 11
Massive Power Outage Hits 7 Western States
Traffic was backed up on both sides of the Golden Gate Bridge and the Bay Bridge.
Huge power failure hopscotched across much of California leaving millions trapped in airports, elevators and traffic snarls, and without water, phone service and air conditioners as temperatures soared.
It was the second major power failure in the West since early July.
On July 2 1996, a widespread outage affected California and 15 other western states.
https://www.latimes.com › archives

Published 1996 Aug 11 - SAN FRANCISCO BAY AREA; CA
Huge power outage hits West Coast
At least half of PG&E's 4 million customers in Northern California lost power Saturday afternoon in a massive West Coast power outage that disrupted airport and mass transit operations and caused traffic snarls. Reports of downed power stretched from Portland south to San Diego, and Las Vegas, Albuquerque, N.M., and El Paso, Texas, to the east. The outage began shortly before 4 p.m., appearing to be intermittent, affecting various areas, with some getting power back quickly.
LaFaver said the power outage began when the system started failing due to a "frequency swing" in the Pacific Interconnect, a 500,000-volt electric grid that runs from Canada to the Mexican border.
https://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/article/Huge-power-outage-hits-West-Coast-3129357.php

Published 2005 Feb 4
Tapes reveal Enron's secret role in California's power blackouts ( years 2000-2001 )
The tapes also show that Enron, whose bankruptcy three years ago was the biggest corporate scandal of recent times, manipulated energy markets
https://www.theguardian.com/business/2005/feb/05/enron.usnews

Published 2000 Jun 15
CALIFORNIA'S ELECTRICITY OPTIONS AND CHALLENGES REPORT TO GOVERNOR GRAY DAVIS
The time lost to a forced outage is unpredictable. Component failure can cause an outage lasting less than a day to as long as six months or more, which occurred to a power plant unit in 1999.32 Scheduled outages for equipment overhaul may take a week or up to four months or more depending on the extent of the overhaul.
* what would happen if a severe weather event or domestic terrorism occurred during repairs?
https://docs.cpuc.ca.gov/published/report/gov_report.htm

Published 2011 September 9
Huge power outage leaves 5 million sweltering in California, Arizona, Mexico
SAN DIEGO - A major power outage knocked out electricity to up to 5 million people in California, Arizona, and Mexico yesterday, bringing San Diego and Tijuana to a standstill and leaving people sweltering in the late-summer heat in the surrounding desert.
Two nuclear reactors were offline after losing electricity, but officials said there was no danger to the public or workers. San Diego bore the brunt of the blackout; most of the nation’s eighth-largest city was darkened.
https://web.archive.org/web/2012110...lion_sweltering_in_california_arizona_mexico/


Published 2012 April
United States - PG&E customers in Oakland, California and surrounding areas in Alameda County suffered a heat-related power outage.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_major_power_outages

Published 2023 March 14
United States - Nearly 300,000 people in the San Francisco Bay Area, California were without power after strong wind storms.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_major_power_outages

-------------------------------------

Published 2004 April 9 by U.S. Congressional Research Service
Electric Utility Infrastructure Vulnerabilities: Transformers, Towers, and Terrorism
https://sgp.fas.org/crs/homesec/R42795.pdf

Published 2014 February 5
Sniper Attack On Calif. Power Station Raises Terrorism Fears
https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo...on-calif-power-station-raises-terrorism-fears

Published 2021 April 12
The Military, Police, and the Rise of Terrorism in the United States.
U.S. active-duty military personnel and reservists have participated in a growing number of domestic terrorist plots and attacks, according to new data from CSIS. The percentage of all domestic terrorist incidents linked to active-duty and reserve personnel rose in 2020 to 6.4 percent, up from 1.5 percent in 2019 and none in 2018. Similarly, a growing number of current and former law enforcement officers have been involved in domestic terrorism in recent years. But domestic terrorism is a double-edged sword. In 2020, extremists from all sides of the ideological spectrum increasingly targeted the military, law enforcement, and other government actors—putting U.S. security agencies in the crosshairs of domestic terrorists.
https://www.csis.org/analysis/military-police-and-rise-terrorism-united-states

Published 2022 December 12
North Carolina attacks highlight the vulnerability of power grids.


** Not electrical grid but shows that some U.S. domestic terrorists have the capability and sometimes actual act on the desire to kill masses of people (people they don't consider as fellow citizens worthy of living?) and destroy parts of the country's infrastructure.

The Alfred P. Murrah Federal Building was a United States federal government complex located at 200 N.W. 5th Street in downtown Oklahoma City, Oklahoma. On April 19, 1995, at 9:02 a.m. the building was the target of the Oklahoma City bombing by terrorists Timothy McVeigh and Terry Nichols, which killed 168 people.[1] A third of the building collapsed seconds after the truck bomb detonated.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alfred_P._Murrah_Federal_Building

-------------------------------------
 

Jhodgesatmb

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I have lived in bay area before (as well as a dozen other places in U.S.) and I can not image a place where only 12 miles would be enough for most people to reasonably ensure safety from most common threats or unexpected travel needs.

Bad weather and cascading grid failures blacks out power to large areas.

Emergency long trip to visit ailing friends or relatives.

Domestic terrorists shooting up or bombing electrical grid components to cause grid failures and black out of large areas

-------------------------------------

** Just a few of the large outages

California stands out as the state with the most power outages between 2002 and 2022. This state had a total of 94 outages, 28 more than second-place holder, Florida. The likelihood of an outage is much higher in California than in any other state.

Published 1982 Dec 23
December 22 - MILLIONS LOSE ELECTRIC POWER AS STORM BLASTS
The power failures were in scattered but often densely populated areas from San Francisco to San Diego and as far east as Yuma, Ariz., and Las Vegas.
A transmission tower near Tracy, California collapsed onto an adjacent tower bringing down two 500-kV lines and a pair of 230-kV lines that passed underneath the 500-kV right of way. Total loss of 12,530 MW affected approximately five million people on the west coast.
https://www.nytimes.com › millio...

Published 1994 December 14
California and five other western states
SAN FRANCISCO (AP) _ A disruption in the power grid criss-crossing the West cut electricity in eight states early today, leaving more than 1.2 million customers briefly in the dark and shutting down the Diablo Canyon nuclear power plant.
https://apnews.com/article/52340617da7c54d4533449d7e37bf563

Published 1996 Aug 11
Massive Power Outage Hits 7 Western States
Traffic was backed up on both sides of the Golden Gate Bridge and the Bay Bridge.
Huge power failure hopscotched across much of California leaving millions trapped in airports, elevators and traffic snarls, and without water, phone service and air conditioners as temperatures soared.
It was the second major power failure in the West since early July.
On July 2 1996, a widespread outage affected California and 15 other western states.
https://www.latimes.com › archives

Published 1996 Aug 11 - SAN FRANCISCO BAY AREA; CA
Huge power outage hits West Coast
At least half of PG&E's 4 million customers in Northern California lost power Saturday afternoon in a massive West Coast power outage that disrupted airport and mass transit operations and caused traffic snarls. Reports of downed power stretched from Portland south to San Diego, and Las Vegas, Albuquerque, N.M., and El Paso, Texas, to the east. The outage began shortly before 4 p.m., appearing to be intermittent, affecting various areas, with some getting power back quickly.
LaFaver said the power outage began when the system started failing due to a "frequency swing" in the Pacific Interconnect, a 500,000-volt electric grid that runs from Canada to the Mexican border.
https://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/article/Huge-power-outage-hits-West-Coast-3129357.php

Published 2005 Feb 4
Tapes reveal Enron's secret role in California's power blackouts ( years 2000-2001 )
The tapes also show that Enron, whose bankruptcy three years ago was the biggest corporate scandal of recent times, manipulated energy markets
https://www.theguardian.com/business/2005/feb/05/enron.usnews

Published 2000 Jun 15
CALIFORNIA'S ELECTRICITY OPTIONS AND CHALLENGES REPORT TO GOVERNOR GRAY DAVIS
The time lost to a forced outage is unpredictable. Component failure can cause an outage lasting less than a day to as long as six months or more, which occurred to a power plant unit in 1999.32 Scheduled outages for equipment overhaul may take a week or up to four months or more depending on the extent of the overhaul.
* what would happen if a severe weather event or domestic terrorism occurred during repairs?
https://docs.cpuc.ca.gov/published/report/gov_report.htm

Published 2011 September 9
Huge power outage leaves 5 million sweltering in California, Arizona, Mexico
SAN DIEGO - A major power outage knocked out electricity to up to 5 million people in California, Arizona, and Mexico yesterday, bringing San Diego and Tijuana to a standstill and leaving people sweltering in the late-summer heat in the surrounding desert.
Two nuclear reactors were offline after losing electricity, but officials said there was no danger to the public or workers. San Diego bore the brunt of the blackout; most of the nation’s eighth-largest city was darkened.
https://web.archive.org/web/2012110...lion_sweltering_in_california_arizona_mexico/


Published 2012 April
United States - PG&E customers in Oakland, California and surrounding areas in Alameda County suffered a heat-related power outage.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_major_power_outages

Published 2023 March 14
United States - Nearly 300,000 people in the San Francisco Bay Area, California were without power after strong wind storms.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_major_power_outages

-------------------------------------

Published 2004 April 9 by U.S. Congressional Research Service
Electric Utility Infrastructure Vulnerabilities: Transformers, Towers, and Terrorism
https://sgp.fas.org/crs/homesec/R42795.pdf

Published 2014 February 5
Sniper Attack On Calif. Power Station Raises Terrorism Fears
https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo...on-calif-power-station-raises-terrorism-fears

Published 2021 April 12
The Military, Police, and the Rise of Terrorism in the United States.
U.S. active-duty military personnel and reservists have participated in a growing number of domestic terrorist plots and attacks, according to new data from CSIS. The percentage of all domestic terrorist incidents linked to active-duty and reserve personnel rose in 2020 to 6.4 percent, up from 1.5 percent in 2019 and none in 2018. Similarly, a growing number of current and former law enforcement officers have been involved in domestic terrorism in recent years. But domestic terrorism is a double-edged sword. In 2020, extremists from all sides of the ideological spectrum increasingly targeted the military, law enforcement, and other government actors—putting U.S. security agencies in the crosshairs of domestic terrorists.
https://www.csis.org/analysis/military-police-and-rise-terrorism-united-states

Published 2022 December 12
North Carolina attacks highlight the vulnerability of power grids.


** Not electrical grid but shows that some U.S. domestic terrorists have the capability and sometimes actual act on the desire to kill masses of people (people they don't consider as fellow citizens worthy of living?) and destroy parts of the country's infrastructure.

The Alfred P. Murrah Federal Building was a United States federal government complex located at 200 N.W. 5th Street in downtown Oklahoma City, Oklahoma. On April 19, 1995, at 9:02 a.m. the building was the target of the Oklahoma City bombing by terrorists Timothy McVeigh and Terry Nichols, which killed 168 people.[1] A third of the building collapsed seconds after the truck bomb detonated.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alfred_P._Murrah_Federal_Building

-------------------------------------
I can see that you have too much time on your hands but I do not need a million quotes or citations. The simple reality is that I do not plan my life around doomsday scenarios of terrorists, 7.0+ earthquakes, and the like, and you are right that there is no where in 100 miles that would be safe for anyone in such a scenario, nor would there be a passable road if there were such a scenario. On a day to day basis I feel good having 100 miles SOC.
 


Crissa

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I have lived in bay area before (as well as a dozen other places in U.S.) and I can not image a place where only 12 miles would be enough for most people to reasonably ensure safety from most common threats or unexpected travel needs.
You can't? Because none of the things you mentioned needed more than twelve miles of reserve range.

The only places where it's more would be like, Florida Keys or someplace in the high mountains. So like, not very many people in the US.

The thing is, you almost always have warning. So for the 'unexpected' you don't have to travel far. Tsunami? Nearest hill. Fire? Out of the evacuation zone. Hurricane? Inland. Earquake, power outage? Next town over. Tornado? A mile to the side.

That's not a hundred miles range. That's more like twelve. It was only six for us to get out of our largest evacuation order ever (of US wildfires, anyhow) CZU Complex fire evacuation.

-Crissa
 

charliemagpie

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In case of fire, may be possible to drive the CT into a lake or waterhole, with Air con on.

Im sure we have all read stories. 15 yrs ago, 2Km from my home a fire raged... it was across the wide freeway and I watched a big tree for hours on my property in case the wind changed. My precious possessions were packed and ready to take off.

Dozens lost their lives that day .. the black horizon continued its path and we were lucky.

People were found in water holes, on paddocks, the heat was too much. The fire jumped over roads and raced like the wind.


A possible life saver. I could be wrong.. but if I lived in areas with this risk, the first thing I would buy for the family is a CT. Better than nothing.
 

firsttruck

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Interesting perspective. I never let my SOC drop below 20% at home (usually more like 100 miles) and I live 12 miles from ‘safety’ in 3 directions.

What I meant about Tesla is them telling me how best to preserve the maximum lifetime for my batteries. If I had some research showing that leaving the car plugged in would ensure the best lifetime I would do it for certain.

Always plugged in means fewer of the vehicle's expensive and limited number of battery cycles used.

If vehicle is plugged in it always prioritizes using grid power before using vehicle's battery.
Uses like:
Someone using vehicle's computer/screen, OTA update, pre-heating, venting, pre-cooling, Sentry Mode, etc.

--------------------------------

Plug It In Tesla Motors
February 24, 2012
https://www.tesla.com/blog/plug-it
.....
We ask that you remember to charge it. A plugged-in Tesla is not only charging its battery, it is also keeping key systems within the car functioning properly. Tesla owners around the world keep their cars charged on a daily basis without any issues at all.

--------------------------------

** even for extended periods of time, Tesla recommends leaving vehicle plugged in (24 hours a day).

Travel Tips for Your Tesla Vehicle
https://www.tesla.com/support/travel-tips-your-tesla

.....
Your Tesla vehicle is designed to maintain its battery over time, and will not overcharge when plugged in for an extended period. For that reason, when you’re away from home, we always recommend leaving your vehicle plugged in.

--------------------------------

Tesla Model 3 Owner's Manual | Charging Instructions
https://www.tesla.com/ownersmanual/model3/en_tw/GUID-BEE08D47-0CE0-4BDD-83F2-9854FB3D578F.html

* Note:
Whenever Model 3 is plugged in but not actively charging, it draws energy from the wall outlet instead of using energy stored in the battery.

For example, if you are sitting in Model 3 and using the touchscreen while parked and plugged in, Model 3 draws energy from the wall outlet instead of the battery.

*** Note: Tesla strongly recommends leaving Model 3 plugged in when not in use. This maintains the Battery at the optimum level of charge.

--------------------------------

Tesla Model Y Owner's Manual | Charging Instructions
https://www.tesla.com/ownersmanual/modely/en_eu/GUID-BEE08D47-0CE0-4BDD-83F2-9854FB3D578F.html

* Note:
Whenever Model Y is plugged in but not actively charging, it draws energy from the wall outlet instead of using energy stored in the battery.

For example, if you are sitting in Model Y and using the touchscreen while parked and plugged in, Model Y draws energy from the wall outlet instead of the battery.

*** Note: Tesla strongly recommends leaving Model Y plugged in when not in use. This maintains the Battery at the optimum level of charge.

--------------------------------

Summer Driving Tips
https://www.tesla.com/support/summer-driving-tips

.....
Cabin Overheat Protection
Enable settings to prevent your cabin from getting excessively hot even when warm weather features are not in use:
* ‘On’ uses air conditioning to prevent the cabin from exceeding 105° F / 40° C.
* ‘No A/C’ uses less energy while still providing some cooling by blowing outside air into the cabin.

To activate, go to ‘Controls’ > ‘Safety’ > ‘Cabin Overheat Protection’ on your vehicle touchscreen, or expand the bottom drawer in the Climate section of the Tesla app.

Note: Running the climate system when your vehicle is unplugged gradually consumes energy from the battery pack. Expect a reduction in remaining energy after using the features above for prolonged periods of time. Monitor state of charge from the home screen of the Tesla app.

.....
Scheduled Departure ‘Scheduled Departure’ manages both charging and cabin preconditioning so you start each day with a charged battery and your desired cabin temperature. Preconditioning the cabin while your vehicle is plugged in adjusts the cabin to your desired temperature without using energy from the battery, saving its energy for maximum range.

--------------------------------

Tesla Support | Range Tips
https://www.tesla.com/support/range

Range Tips Tesla vehicles can travel some of the longest driving ranges of any other production electric vehicle on the market. It is natural for estimated range to change, particularly over time or with a recent change in temperature. Read more about the range and efficiency of your Tesla.

.....
Keep your vehicle plugged in whenever possible. This will help the battery retain some heat.
** The onboard computer will automatically prevent over-charging. **

.....
Why does estimated range decrease overnight while my car is off? It is expected for a Tesla car to consume around 1% of charge per day while parked.

In some cases, you may notice that consumption is higher. We recommend deactivating features such as preconditioning, Sentry Mode, Keep Climate On and any aftermarket equipment when not needed. It’s best to keep the vehicle plugged in when using those features when possible.

--------------------------------
 

firsttruck

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You can't? Because none of the things you mentioned needed more than twelve miles of reserve range.

The only places where it's more would be like, Florida Keys or someplace in the high mountains. So like, not very many people in the US.

The thing is, you almost always have warning. So for the 'unexpected' you don't have to travel far. Tsunami? Nearest hill. Fire? Out of the evacuation zone. Hurricane? Inland. Earthquake, power outage? Next town over. Tornado? A mile to the side.

That's not a hundred miles range. That's more like twelve. It was only six for us to get out of our largest evacuation order ever (of US wildfires, anyhow) CZU Complex fire evacuation.

-Crissa
I think in most of the examples I gave for most of the people affected there was no warning, area affected was much more than 12 miles in size, and the actual faulty condition (downed high tension line, downed plant, weather event) was much more than 12 miles away from many of the affected people.

It might not only be travel 12 miles it also may be no charging access for days while using battery for heat or cooling.

None I listed were doomsday events. These things happen quite frequently and I have experienced several of them in my life. Some like the domestic terrorists seem to be increasing in frequency.
Even just grid failure seem to be increasing because the operators do not spend enough on maintenance and replacements so reliability decreases.

One of the great advantages of EVs is the ability to charge it up from home every night.
ICE vehicles typically do not fuel up at gas station every night. Many ICE parked at home might have 30% or less range. If something unexpected happens to a single operator they have to rush to a station and if it is a wide area event large numbers of ICE operators rush to the available stations, many spend hours in waiting line and frequently some operators after waiting hours get nothing. Many ICE spend precious gas driving all over looking for an available station.
 
Last edited:

Crissa

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I think in most of the examples I gave for most of the people affected there was no warning, area affected was much more than 12 miles in size, and the actual faulty condition (downed high tension line, downed plant, weather event) was much more than 12 miles away from many of the affected people.
There is no way to 'drive out' from any of these things that are larger than that.

At that point, roads are damaged or clogged up with emergency vehicles, so you should stay put. Not drive a hundred miles while emergency vehicles and supplies are trying to get around.

-Crissa

PS, if there's a tsunami, or earthquake, or whatever and you get stuck in traffic, get your vehicle off the road and hoof it. Don't block the roads, your truck either will survive or not.

If the water or fire has already gotten to your vehicle, stay in the vehicle until everything stops moving/flowing/burning. That cage gives you a better chance of survival... But your chance woulda been better had you already hoofed it out of there.
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