CT alternative for most BEV towing

[Tinker71]

Why can the big 3 build something like this. BYD U8 1000+ HP electric AWD drive, 49 KWhr battery pack. 2.0 liter ICE Generator. It is $150k, but apparently a real luxury SUV. Most of your in town and daily drives could be all BEV, I bet 80% over the life of the vehicle. Range only limited by fuel stops when towing and tank size. Personally I think the ICE genset should be around 60 HP with a slightly larger battery.

Ford/Chevy/Dodge/Toyota - step it up. Tesla will never do it.

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[Gurule92]

No thx lol

 

[Sirfun]

We have a PHEV Pacifica, and I've always thought that a PHEV Pickup with about 30-40 miles electric would work really well as a Tow vehicle. It would have more power & torque than an ICE pickup, with better fuel economy. Regen is awesome. Plus it would have plenty of miles per tank full. With the benefit of just having to do a quick stop for fuel, as opposed to stopping more often with much longer stops for charging. This is a good solution for now, but who knows what the future holds. Maybe the CT will be able to fast charge VERY quickly.

Our minivan gets about 30 miles electric. And we plug it in almost every night. My wife and I are retired and don't drive more than 30 miles most days. But with us taking drives to LA and around occasionally. I fill the tank maybe once a month or more. But it is also our family vacation vehicle and when we drive it on long trips it works like a Hybrid, and averages about 30mpg with about 500 miles per tank full (without our rooftop carrier). Regen is an awesome thing, ALL vehicles should at least be hybrids with some sort of battery for regen. On our last vacation in late Sept. we went to Mount Lassen and produced tons of fuel coming back down from 8,500'.

 

[PilotPete]

We have a PHEV Pacifica, and I've always thought that a PHEV Pickup with about 30-40 miles electric would work really well as a Tow vehicle. It would have more power & torque than an ICE pickup, with better fuel economy. Regen is awesome. Plus it would have plenty of miles per tank full. With the benefit of just having to do a quick stop for fuel, as opposed to stopping more often with much longer stops for charging. This is a good solution for now, but who knows what the future holds. Maybe the CT will be able to fast charge VERY quickly.

Our minivan gets about 30 miles electric. And we plug it in almost every night. My wife and I are retired and don't drive more than 30 miles most days. But with us taking drives to LA and around occasionally. I fill the tank maybe once a month or more. But it is also our family vacation vehicle and when we drive it on long trips it works like a Hybrid, and averages about 30mpg with about 500 miles per tank full (without our rooftop carrier). Regen is an awesome thing, ALL vehicles should at least be hybrids with some sort of battery for regen. On our last vacation in late Sept. we went to Mount Lassen and produced tons of fuel coming back down from 8,500'.

I have a PHEV, and I thought that was the shizzle when we bought it. Now, not so much. The problem with the PHEV is that it is the worst of all worlds.

When you're on battery, you are hauling around an engine, gas tank, transmission, axles, everything. So your limited battery range gets penalized because of all the ICE you're hauling around. Then the ICE takes over. And now you're hauling around an extra electric motor and the associated battery pack (smaller, yes) and your gas mileage suffers. So, no matter which drive you're using, you're penalized by the one you aren't. Don't think I'll do it again.

 

[HaulingAss]

When you're on battery, you are hauling around an engine, gas tank, transmission, axles, everything. So your limited battery range gets penalized because of all the ICE you're hauling around. Then the ICE takes over. And now you're hauling around an extra electric motor and the associated battery pack (smaller, yes) and your gas mileage suffers. So, no matter which drive you're using, you're penalized by the one you aren't. Don't think I'll do it again.

'Zactly! If I want a gas motor, I'll just buy an ICE car. Which is what a hybrid really is anyway. No need to pay for two systems.

 

[Sirfun]

I have a PHEV, and I thought that was the shizzle when we bought it. Now, not so much. The problem with the PHEV is that it is the worst of all worlds.

When you're on battery, you are hauling around an engine, gas tank, transmission, axles, everything. So your limited battery range gets penalized because of all the ICE you're hauling around. Then the ICE takes over. And now you're hauling around an extra electric motor and the associated battery pack (smaller, yes) and your gas mileage suffers. So, no matter which drive you're using, you're penalized by the one you aren't. Don't think I'll do it again.

I don't know what kind of PHEV you have, but my gas mileage doesn't suffer. I average 30mpg in a minivan pretty much everywhere we drive it. Before we had a 2012 Toyota Sienna which was nice, but it NEVER got over 24mpg. And when my wife drove it around town and she likes to leave the vehicle running for AC when sitting/parked, it was usually at 16-18mpg. I don't want to argue or preach about the rewards of regen. But I will NEVER buy another car without at least regen.

On that trip down the mountain from Mt. Lassen we got about 35 miles over 4000' of elevation loss without ever starting the gas engine. And virtually never used the brakes.

 

[Crissa]

... Then the ICE takes over. And now you're hauling around an extra electric motor and the associated battery pack (smaller, yes) and your gas mileage suffers.

You do get to have regenerative braking, which is really the best thing ever.

I never want a vehicle without regenerative braking, again.

-Crissa

 

[IronStation]

You do get to have regenerative braking, which is really the best thing ever.

I never want a vehicle without regenerative braking, again.

-Crissa

Besides the added mileage from them, I just love 1 pedal driving. The smooth stops they make, the decreased wear on brake shoes, but what I love the most is how they help set up a great winding country road curve. Let off the gas go pedal setting up the turn and let the regen brakes get you to perfect entry speed then unleash the electrons at the apex, letting that amazing torque throw you back in your seat.

 

[Tinker71]

I have a PHEV, and I thought that was the shizzle when we bought it. Now, not so much. The problem with the PHEV is that it is the worst of all worlds.

When you're on battery, you are hauling around an engine, gas tank, transmission, axles, everything. So your limited battery range gets penalized because of all the ICE you're hauling around. Then the ICE takes over. And now you're hauling around an extra electric motor and the associated battery pack (smaller, yes) and your gas mileage suffers. So, no matter which drive you're using, you're penalized by the one you aren't. Don't think I'll do it again.

The BYD is different. All electric drive and genset that probably weighs 500 lbs. This is less than a giant battery you only use on trips. Plus all electric range is probably 120 miles. ICE fuel is really energy dense. BEV cars get by because they are aerodynamic. Not so much when towing.

 

[HaulingAss]

You do get to have regenerative braking, which is really the best thing ever.

I never want a vehicle without regenerative braking, again.

I never want a vehicle without regenerative braking either!

And it's just as important to me to not have a vehicle with a gas tank and an exhaust pipe that spews toxic emissions whenever it's on.

That pretty much leaves pure electric vehicles for me. Those of you who like oil changes, starter motors and batteries, emission control systems, smog checks, spark plugs and belts and pulleys can drive whatever pushes your buttons. But not for me, when there are better cars out there. You will not save money in the long run having the complexity of two systems.

 

[HaulingAss]

The BYD is different. All electric drive and genset that probably weighs 500 lbs. This is less than a giant battery you only use on trips. Plus all electric range is probably 120 miles. ICE fuel is really energy dense. BEV cars get by because they are aerodynamic. Not so much when towing.

When it comes to electric vehicles, I can see you really know what you are talking about with regard to how important aerodynamics are with electric vehicles.

I'm guessing your electric conversion VW van doesn't have the greatest range or aero with those solar cells on the roof! How many miles on a charge do you get? 96 miles? 70 miles? Oh, wait, 30 miles?

 

[CyberGus]

"A world filled with 100% Priuses is still 100% addicted to oil." - Elon Musk

 

[PilotPete]

You do get to have regenerative braking, which is really the best thing ever.

I never want a vehicle without regenerative braking, again.

-Crissa

Regen braking is awesome. I, too, love it. And as everyone points out, making your brakes last for way longer is a plus. As @HaulingAss said, you are now hauling around two systems, and have to maintain/repair two systems. And while gas is light (relatively), the engine isn't. Exactly the opposite of a BEV. Our BMW had the option of straight ICE or PHEV. the PHEV gets a couple mpg less than the straight ICE when burning dinosaurs. BMW admits this is due to having to haul around the battery and electric motor. After renting as many EVs as I have now, (a couple non-teslas), I like electric better. Even more, I like TESLA's implementation of electric even more.

Our PHEV went into the dealer for a couple weeks on a warranty issue. We requested and received an I4 to drive. Nice car overall. I was very disappointed that BMW didn't bother to change ANYTHING from the regular 4 series. There is still a transmission tunnel, and still a hump in the backseat floor for the drive axle that isn't there. And there is no frunk, they just put a plastic cover and put the front motor up there. And looking at it, it really looks like they just "threw" all the stuff up there without a care because they had all that room. SOME of it could have certainly been saved for at least a small frunk, but no. They clearly just took the path of absolute least resistance and cost to put it out there. On the side, it has a HUD (nice) and they programmed in some kind of sound, evidently their impression of what an electric motor is supposed to sound like, that plays through the audio when you step on the accelerator. (Found how to disable it!) I looked at their recharging map, and let's just say it ain't the supercharger network! Fortunately, we were able to charge at home every night with the same charger we use for the PHEV. We never had to use their network.

 

[Tinker71]

When it comes to electric vehicles, I can see you really know what you are talking about with regard to how important aerodynamics are with electric vehicles.

I'm guessing your electric conversion VW van doesn't have the greatest range or aero with those solar cells on the roof! How many miles on a charge do you get? 96 miles? 70 miles? Oh, wait, 30 miles?

It is a .5 Cd brick hobby, but I love it. My 26.5 Kwhr pack is good for 70 miles below 50 MPH if I really push it.
I rarely go on the highway, but I can still do 100 MPH. It is perfect for trips to Home Depot and camping in the mountains right near my house.

The solar panels can add 10 mile of range per day if I want to, but this really my home back up power. I paid less than 2 power walls for everything and it is fun.

 

[Diehard]

It is all about use case. If it is occasional long distance trip along a route with good charging infrastructure, then emission test, oil change and inefficiencies and complications of having two systems is not worth it. If you are towing long distance with iffy charging along the way often enough then either a hybrid or a two car solution (ICE for towing BEV for everything else) may make sense. With $150K, you could get an efficient BEV and a truck.

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