cvalue13

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 17, 2022
Threads
74
Messages
7,147
Reaction score
13,759
Location
Austin, TX
Vehicles
F150L
Occupation
Fun-employed
Country flag
One of those seems like the less risky position to me from a reputation standpoint
to be fair, one of those is a completely imagined state of affairs and assumption, while the other two describe strategies
 

newwave1331

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 30, 2020
Threads
11
Messages
509
Reaction score
1,428
Location
NJ
Vehicles
Ordered: Cybertruck Tri FSD x 3
Country flag
not sure i understand your point?

you made your comment before the provision was found in a live/current Tesla form of agreement on its website?
Just that it wasn't a current agreement. It was dated and old.
 

cvalue13

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 17, 2022
Threads
74
Messages
7,147
Reaction score
13,759
Location
Austin, TX
Vehicles
F150L
Occupation
Fun-employed
Country flag
Just that it wasn't a current agreement. It was dated and old.
i understand your words but not quite the thinking 🤣

set aside that dating footers aren’t always brought down correctly

Is the suggestion that someone at Tesla not only replaced the website version of the purchase agreement with an ‘old’ contract, but that old contract happened to have added a Cybertruck-specific provision?

🤷🏻‍♂️
 

Gurule92

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 2, 2021
Threads
170
Messages
3,490
Reaction score
6,914
Location
Colorado Springs
Vehicles
MYP
Occupation
"Cyber" stuff
Country flag
to be fair, one of those is a completely imagined state of affairs and assumption, while the other two describe strategies
Idk about completely. We need only look at what happened witt rivian and even people selling res nums here
 


Gurule92

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 2, 2021
Threads
170
Messages
3,490
Reaction score
6,914
Location
Colorado Springs
Vehicles
MYP
Occupation
"Cyber" stuff
Country flag
I agree that it should account for inflation for sure. There's definitely nothing wrong with wanting to sell your stuff either. But I still don't think they are doing anything illegal by having people agree. Unlikable maybe.

Because in order to be stifling competition, you have to actually be competition. I don't think the new market and the used market (private party) would count as competition
 

newwave1331

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 30, 2020
Threads
11
Messages
509
Reaction score
1,428
Location
NJ
Vehicles
Ordered: Cybertruck Tri FSD x 3
Country flag
i understand your words but not quite the thinking 🤣

set aside that dating footers aren’t always brought down correctly

Is the suggestion that someone at Tesla not only replaced the website version of the purchase agreement with an ‘old’ contract, but that old contract happened to have added a Cybertruck-specific provision?

🤷🏻‍♂️
So Tesla has a bunch of lawyers waiting to go after customers but they can't update footers correctly on a purchase document?

Maybe this is the agreement that employees signed last year in anticipation of their early deliveries before it was pushed back again.

Like most things, we wont know until Tesla officially announces something or a real customer transaction takes place and they share those terms.
 

cvalue13

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 17, 2022
Threads
74
Messages
7,147
Reaction score
13,759
Location
Austin, TX
Vehicles
F150L
Occupation
Fun-employed
Country flag
Idk about completely. We need only look at what happened witt rivian and even people selling res nums here
the implied magnitude, is what I'm suggesting is fairly imagined - that there's some material number of scalpers who placed "10s-100s" if orders each?

regardless, any scalpers that had tens or hundreds of reservations, remember that Tesla already, before this new provision, had in place everything it would need to identify and deter that sort of scalper

so the incremental gains of adding this provision are really irrelevant to them

on the other end of the spectrum, it seems to me irrelevant that a dozen nimwits have come to this forum to attempt to sell their reservation numbers - none of them appear to know what it would take to sell their numbers, and would only do so at a good bit of risk (if they could even find a buyer), given what tools Tesla already had in place

So if we're talking about 1,000,000 reservations, what in your mind is a sufficient number of true scalpers that aren't pro's with 10s-100s, or nimwits selling their numbers?





remembering we're talking about 1,000,000 reservations, how many of these single-ish truck motivated flippers would it take to justify making every buyer sign up to these terms?

if 10% (who already weren't deterred by the existing Tesla tools), that would be 100,000 scalper reservations total.

which would mean, if Tesla manages to produce 70K trucks in 2024, there would be 7,000 true flipper purchases in 2024

Let's call that -what - a month's worth of production (if averaged over the year), and so pushing back "the line" a month?

so now to potentially deter 1 month of wait, all 63,000 remaining legit buyers are signing up to these terms? For an unknown, "revolutionary" (read untested), guineapig truck - and in the face of economic uncertainty and high interest rates?

We can agree on one thing: these provisions will shorten the wait for the legit buyers left standing.
 

cvalue13

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 17, 2022
Threads
74
Messages
7,147
Reaction score
13,759
Location
Austin, TX
Vehicles
F150L
Occupation
Fun-employed
Country flag
So Tesla has a bunch of lawyers waiting to go after customers but they can't update footers correctly on a purchase document?
you realize you're talking about the same people who, in this scenario, would have uploaded the incorrect document to the website


did I mention Tesla isn't known for it's legal department savvy?
 

Gurule92

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 2, 2021
Threads
170
Messages
3,490
Reaction score
6,914
Location
Colorado Springs
Vehicles
MYP
Occupation
"Cyber" stuff
Country flag
the implied magnitude, is what I'm suggesting is fairly imagined - that there's some material number of scalpers who placed "10s-100s" if orders each?

regardless, any scalpers that had tens or hundreds of reservations, remember that Tesla already, before this new provision, had in place everything it would need to identify and deter that sort of scalper

so the incremental gains of adding this provision are really irrelevant to them

on the other end of the spectrum, it seems to me irrelevant that a dozen nimwits have come to this forum to attempt to sell their reservation numbers - none of them appear to know what it would take to sell their numbers, and would only do so at a good bit of risk (if they could even find a buyer), given what tools Tesla already had in place

So if we're talking about 1,000,000 reservations, what in your mind is a sufficient number of true scalpers that aren't pro's with 10s-100s, or nimwits selling their numbers?





remembering we're talking about 1,000,000 reservations, how many of these single-ish truck motivated flippers would it take to justify making every buyer sign up to these terms?

if 10% (who already weren't deterred by the existing Tesla tools), that would be 100,000 scalper reservations total.

which would mean, if Tesla manages to produce 70K trucks in 2024, there would be 7,000 true flipper purchases in 2024

Let's call that -what - a month's worth of production (if averaged over the year), and so pushing back "the line" a month?

so now to potentially deter 1 month of wait, all 63,000 remaining legit buyers are signing up to these terms? For an unknown, "revolutionary" (read untested), guineapig truck - and in the face of economic uncertainty and high interest rates?

We can agree on one thing: these provisions will shorten the wait for the legit buyers left standing.
Perception is everything right? It could be like 3 people scalping and because it's Tesla, if they didn't try to do the due diligence to prevent that, the media would go full anarchy reporting in another attempt to bury Tesla. So I think, like I mentioned before, they are (were?) Trying to do something to show they care about the little guy. (which is kinda elons thing lately)

Like I mentioned, I don't know what the right way is but I can appreciate the attempt.
 


thefozz

Member
Joined
Dec 1, 2022
Threads
0
Messages
5
Reaction score
14
Location
Ontario, Canada
Vehicles
Tesla Model 3
Country flag
So Tesla has a bunch of lawyers waiting to go after customers but they can't update footers correctly on a purchase document?

Maybe this is the agreement that employees signed last year in anticipation of their early deliveries before it was pushed back again.

Like most things, we wont know until Tesla officially announces something or a real customer transaction takes place and they share those terms.
That's an interesting thought. What are the odds that the resale language was only intended to cover those who are obtaining an advance unit at the delivery event - to prevent those hand selected purchasers from using that opportunity as a windfall as we wait for main production to ramp up? That could explain the sudden showing up of the language, and its disappearance could mean those agreements have all been entered into now?
 

cvalue13

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 17, 2022
Threads
74
Messages
7,147
Reaction score
13,759
Location
Austin, TX
Vehicles
F150L
Occupation
Fun-employed
Country flag
Perception is everything right? It could be like 3 people scalping and because it's Tesla, if they didn't try to do the due diligence to prevent that, the media would go full anarchy reporting in another attempt to bury Tesla. So I think, like I mentioned before, they are (were?) Trying to do something to show they care about the little guy. (which is kinda elons thing lately)

Like I mentioned, I don't know what the right way is but I can appreciate the attempt.
yes RE the perception bit

which is why, aside being bad for me, I think these resale provisions are bad for Tesla. The concept alone will cause significant blow-back, and the wrong fact pattern in a specific case - eg the widow being low balled - would be more detrimental than the scalping issue - eg a super fan butthurt because they received their truck a month later



one guy’s view
 

Mini2nut

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 2, 2020
Threads
93
Messages
2,467
Reaction score
4,545
Location
CA
Vehicles
2022 R1T
Country flag
This newest move tells me that the Cybertruck will be produced in extremely limited numbers.
 

HaulingAss

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 3, 2020
Threads
11
Messages
5,106
Reaction score
10,693
Location
Washington State
Vehicles
2010 F-150, 2018 Model 3 P, FS DM Cybertruck
Country flag
This newest move tells me that the Cybertruck will be produced in extremely limited numbers.
Indeed, Tesla has always said initial production would be limited in quantity with a slow ramp. They have also recently disclosed target production rates for the 4th quarter of 2024 and those targets do not point to extremely limited numbers (except relative to the number of reservations).

Any way you slice it, there will be a lot more demand than supply for at least the first year and a half, and probably for years after that if the truck is as good of a value as I think it will be, and new buyers continue to pile on. It could be 3-4 years before it can be bought without a wait of many months.
 

Mini2nut

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 2, 2020
Threads
93
Messages
2,467
Reaction score
4,545
Location
CA
Vehicles
2022 R1T
Country flag
I think the rollout will look similar to the Rivian R1T.

Hand over the keys(?) to Tesla employees at the delivery day event and have all owners sign an NDA.

Let a few months roll by to get some additional real world testing before retail sales begin sometime in Q1 of 2024. Use this time to allow 4680 battery production and assembly line tweaks get up to speed.
Sponsored

 
 




Top