Towing Capacity and Range?

[JBee]

And I could very well be wrong, but thinking that might be a case of the impossible perpetual motion machine theory.

If the weight of the object and shape of object being moved (CT+trailer+load+resistance) stays the same, changing gears only changes the power output profile to consist of more torque and less rpm, but it still takes the same amount of power to move that object the same distance. All you've done is shift how the energy gets consumed.

Not quite?
The right gearing helps put the motor/engine in the right rpm range where it is most efficient.

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[CyberGus]

Each stop adds ~25 minutes by the time you get to the station charge and leave. If you have 100 miles range and it takes 25 minutes to recharge you are spending about a quarter of your drive charging

I think that would suck.

I would think that someone of your age would appreciate the opportunity to stretch every hour or two.

 

[CyberGus]

Early adoption of EV's is one thing, but the biggest limitation in our cross country driving will be all the EV's wanting to charge at the same times, like lunch or dinner, or overnight when theres no solar and typically less wind as well (unless there's a storm front).

Stopping for 15-25min every 1.5 hours will be quite a pain for sure. Just as an example, getting from my place to our nearest metropolitan city Perth would take an 45-115 minutes. At this time two of those stops wouldn't be at superchargers, one would be at 50kW and the other at 22kW.

Not only would the trailer require a slower speed to reduce aero consumption for something reasonable, but I would then still need to add 3 stops. Thats a good 7 hours trip one way. In comparison my current van does that same trip on 5/6 of a tank but takes 4.5 hours, with 1.5 tons in the back so I don't need a trailer. In this case I'd prefer a Cybervan option where the consumption is optimised.

All up a trailer is really a poorly executed vehicle extension. Something more integrated can really improve performance without loosing utility.

If you're going tow your boat while competing in the Cannonball Run, you should probably take the Escalade.

 

[charliemagpie]

Early adoption of EV's is one thing, but the biggest limitation in our cross country driving will be all the EV's wanting to charge at the same times, like lunch or dinner, or overnight when theres no solar and typically less wind as well (unless there's a storm front).

Stopping for 15-25min every 1.5 hours will be quite a pain for sure. Just as an example, getting from my place to our nearest metropolitan city Perth would take an 45-115 minutes. At this time two of those stops wouldn't be at superchargers, one would be at 50kW and the other at 22kW.

Not only would the trailer require a slower speed to reduce aero consumption for something reasonable, but I would then still need to add 3 stops. Thats a good 7 hours trip one way. In comparison my current van does that same trip on 5/6 of a tank but takes 4.5 hours, with 1.5 tons in the back so I don't need a trailer. In this case I'd prefer a Cybervan option where the consumption is optimised.

All up a trailer is really a poorly executed vehicle extension. Something more integrated can really improve performance without loosing utility.

Every couple of months I Google search EV charging stations, and its slow, but always an incremental new initiative is on the horizon.

For example .. Ampol will have EV chargers, and I expect various businesses will add charges as quick as they can get them.
Woolworths , Coles, Shell, Hungry Jacks, Caravan parks etc

I dont think we are far away from the flood gate opening and we will have far more EV charging options than petrol...I think outlying areas will be avoided by most EV drivers,,, natural selection will be in force, and eventually we will have enough charging options to avoid queues.

 

[GnarlyDudeLive]

I would not be at all surprised of the CT takes a huge hit on towing range. Mostly because, the CT itself is about the most aero of any pickup ever built. While this is awesome as a pickup it also means it is going to take a larger hit in range when towing something non-aero in nature. Any vehicle that gets a huge portion of its range efficiency from aero design is going to have the same challenge. We defiantly need better more aero tow options. Trailers or pull behind campers that telescope down ala CyberLandr when empty and being pulled. Batteries in trailers could help but the balancing the extra weight when not always needed is a tough one to make a judgement call on. Pull through chargers are an inevitable in time as the transition to electric occurs. Pull in chargers IMO are just a stop gap solution and won't really work once charger congestion increases and it becomes a traffic hotspot.

 

[JBee]

Every couple of months I Google search EV charging stations, and its slow, but always an incremental new initiative is on the horizon.

For example .. Ampol will have EV chargers, and I expect various businesses will add charges as quick as they can get them.
Woolworths , Coles, Shell, Hungry Jacks, Caravan parks etc

I dont think we are far away from the flood gate opening and we will have far more EV charging options than petrol...I think outlying areas will be avoided by most EV drivers,,, natural selection will be in force, and eventually we will have enough charging options to avoid queues.

In the sticks those places don't exist. The nearest Woolies and Maccas is 180km away...

But even there the problem is grid size and the ability to supply power to a Supercharger at all. Our town has some 1400 people, but uses just 2 superchargers worth of power on average. If you were to pull into town with half a dozen CTs, if there ever was 6 superchargers here, the microgrid would be maxed out and trip, just by charging those six cars alone.

The point is that proportionally most people just don't know just how powerful Superchargers are in relation to normal house supplies. Typical household connections are expected to draw around 1kW on average here, so 250kW is 250 households worth of power. Thats actually heaps more than most towns have houses, that still get a mention on a Aussie map as a "town".

There's ways to do it by using EVs to buffer microgrids, but as of yet there's not much happening in that space that I've heard of, and I've been trying to get out of the generation reatrace, not into it.

 

[Bill906]

In the sticks those places don't exist. The nearest Woolies and Maccas is 180km away...

But even there the problem is grid size and the ability to supply power to a Supercharger at all. Our town has some 1400 people, but uses just 2 superchargers worth of power on average. If you were to pull into town with half a dozen CTs, if there ever was 6 superchargers here, the microgrid would be maxed out and trip, just by charging those six cars alone.

The point is that proportionally most people just don't know just how powerful Superchargers are in relation to normal house supplies. Typical household connections are expected to draw around 1kW on average here, so 250kW is 250 households worth of power. Thats actually heaps more than most towns have houses, that still get a mention on a Aussie map as a "town".

There's ways to do it by using EVs to buffer microgrids, but as of yet there's not much happening in that space that I've heard of, and I've been trying to get out of the generation reatrace, not into it.

Not disagreeing with what you said, just pointing out 1kW per household seems awfully low. Typical hair dryer is 1.5kW by itself.

 

[JBee]

Not disagreeing with what you said, just pointing out 1kW per household seems awfully low. Typical hair dryer is 1.5kW by itself.

Yep but how long do you dry your magical locks for?
The magic word is 'average", also note our climate here is very mild. Average consumption is 18kWh per 24hours, which is technically just 750W.

 

[Misterbee]

Hello, has anybody done the math on the potential range for each of the models?

I ask this because I saw a couple of videos on other electric vehicles towing things and the results are a bit disappointing.
Rivian which is now producing vehicles in production was getting around 1 mile per % of battery charge when towing near its capacity limits.


The same people did this using a Model X utilizing a different trailer but near the Model X's capacity limits and the results were similar, about 1 mile per % of battery.


In general, it appears that you get about 1/3rd of the normal range when towing things.
I'm hoping the cybertruck can tow things further than 100 miles, otherwise, most of the time will be spent at supercharger stations when towing regularly.
Maybe the range numbers will be closer to the new Model Y towing things as a result of the new batteries.

My 2018 M3 gets about 2 miles per % of battery charge when towing a teardrop trailer. I expect things will only improve with newer vehicles.

 

[ςyb3®tЯμ¢kℓ|gh†n!ng]

A Tesla can currently charge to 80% in as little as 15 minutes. The expectation is that the 4680 pack will have superior thermal characteristics, allowing for even faster times.

If charging only takes a few minutes, then does the range even matter?

That's a good point, it still matters just less. If I were to be towing a motorhome, then I'd have to figure out how to get access to the charger with that still attached, but if its less frequent then you'd have to detach the motorhome, charge, and then re-attach at each recharge station.

 

[ςyb3®tЯμ¢kℓ|gh†n!ng]

Yeah, it's about as nasty as trying to guestimate how many miles you have left through the mountains. You need to know the weather, the route, the elevation changes, the speeds...

Your trailer not only has weight, it has its own aerodynamic load. Big cross sections and flat faces will be terrible. I've said it before, but maybe shells designed to reduce that loading will become available.


It means the amount of stuff you can do in those hops. The distance off the beaten path. Also, the more energy spent the more time spent charging - and with a smaller, less absorbent pack, the time spent at a lower charge rate.

-Crissa

Another consideration is if you can somehow wire up solar panels to the charging port if you were towing say a motorhome that has a large surface area on the top.

 

[ςyb3®tЯμ¢kℓ|gh†n!ng]

My 2018 M3 gets about 2 miles per % of battery charge when towing a teardrop trailer. I expect things will only improve with newer vehicles.

Yep, Aerodynamics matter. That's signficantly more efficient then what they were driving in the video. Do you find your self stopping often to charge?

 

[pagesix1536]

A Tesla can currently charge to 80% in as little as 15 minutes. The expectation is that the 4680 pack will have superior thermal characteristics, allowing for even faster times.

If charging only takes a few minutes, then does the range even matter?

It doesn't. People get all wacko on this stuff, and it's most likely going to end up being no big deal to charge.

 

[Ogre]

I would think that someone of your age would appreciate the opportunity to stretch every hour or two.

Ouch, that’s a burn.

My bladder can make it at least 3 hours between stops!

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