My turn for Critical Error, week 2

[JBee]

So I wonder if you put a 48v jump pack on the battery would it get rid of the errors and at least allow it to drive for enough distance to get it home or to service? I always carry a 12v pack in my model y. My model 3 12v died with no warning once and the jump pack got the electronics going.

Good question, a bit like driving with a broken alternator but with a full battery. Apparently theres a 12V connection point that gets boosted to 48V as well, so you can jump it from 12V still.

But i imagine that it will remain in a failsafe mode if only running from the 48V battery regardless. This is because the converter modules are meant to be the primary supply and the battery is a backup. So it will simply throw the critical error before things get even worse and go really wrong.

Technically its the same type of issue with a 12V setup, in that no power also means the 12V networked microcontrollers in the car using CAN bus, also can't work without power.

In the CT 48V setup this is a ring network with power over ethernet (better for redundancy - well should be). But no power is still no power, and if the primary supplies from the main pack are down it won't be going anywhere until its fixed.

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[Carlos Thomas]

I haven’t seen or heard any updates from the original poster. Hopefully he has an update. My truck was towed/transported to Dublin, CA this morning.

I will keep everyone up to date as I get them.

 

[Mini2nut]

It's known in the auto industry as the Early Adopter blues. It's the price you pay to be the first kid on the block with a new toy.

 

[LonelyCTfan]

It's not really too complicated. They seem to have borrowed the setup from the Powerwall3 (same capacity and battery voltage).

The PCS has 3-4 of these AC to DC bidirectional converters modules, which means they can also do DC to AC.

If you are plugged in a AC circuit it will take 240/120V AC and convert into DC pack voltage to charge your main pack, thats AC to DC. Same for 48V rail and 48V battery charging, but one module can only output one voltage at a time.

The running in inverter mode DC to AC you can use two modules together for 240V split phase which also gives you 2x 110V circuits. That is your powerpoint outlets in AC that comes from the pack.

This is also likely why the outlets switch off when you are 240V AC charging the vehicle, because they can only work one direction at a time. When you DC charge at a Supercharger it should not need to turn off as it doesn’t need a PCS converter module to charge and can use the Supercharger instead.

It should also be possible to operate the outlets whilst AC charging, but that would need to actively monitor your bed outlet load to derate your charging, so it doesn't exceed the charge cable rate.

So if you can't charge and you can't use the 120/240V outlets then it's nost likely that one or more of those bidirectional converter modules is out of service.

Now whilst driving at least one of those modules (probably two) is providing 48V to the vehicle systems, and redundant power to the SbW, and one is maintaining/charging the 48V battery as well. When those conversion modules fail to provide 48V from power in the main pack, then it's just going to run from the 48V battery. At that point it will not be very happy, because that ridiculously small 48V pack will only last long enough to park it or load it on a transport. If that battery dips under voltage your steer by wire is gone, (you are going mostly straight ahead from then on). It looks like the brake booster also doesn't operate from the 48V battery (or maybe it has a low voltage cutout so u can steer till the end) and operates only from the converter modules in the PCS.

If this is the setup then it's poorly managed. The likelihood of having a second or third power converter failure, without a more serious main pack fault or impact accident, is pretty slim overall. Having it all in the same PCS package doesn't really help either if it's a high voltage problem.

For SbW this is the equivalent of a steering linkage failure, or your steering wheel coming off in your hands. It should "never" be happening.

I appreciate the information, but I chuckled so hard because it's like "No it's not that complicated" then proceeds to give an entire lesson. I'm all for it!

 

[ideaXfactory]

Hope they have you back up and running soon.

 

[Cyberns]

They are finishing their second day with the car (Burlingame, CA) and only say they will have an update when they finish diagnostics, with a provisional availability date of March 8 (2 weeks).

Hope they have you back up and running soon.

 

[Carlos Thomas]

Update: Yesterday when looking at the repair process it had the estimated pick up for Saturday, March 2nd. This morning I logged into the app and it now says Thursday, February 29th.

What it does not say is what the actual diagnosis is and remedy. I sent my service advisor that question via the app. I will report back what I here.

One thing to note, the GPS location on the map within the app shows the truck is in the exact same location in their parking lot and not inside of a building. I am new to owning a Tesla, so I don’t know how accurate the GPS location is.

 

[Gigahorse]

Update: Yesterday when looking at the repair process it had the estimated pick up for Saturday, March 2nd. This morning I logged into the app and it now says Thursday, February 29th.

What it does not say is what the actual diagnosis is and remedy. I sent my service advisor that question via the app. I will report back what I here.

One thing to note, the GPS location on the map within the app shows the truck is in the exact same location in their parking lot and not inside of a building. I am new to owning a Tesla, so I don’t know how accurate the GPS location is.

Good to hear you might get it back early, especially since early is TODAY! I would press them to tell you what was wrong when you pick it up, I am sure you are just ready to get your truck back but after going through that you should know what caused it so if it happens again you know, and because others like myself are curious. Keep us posted!

 

[Sjohnson20]

usually when they are in service you lose the GPS until the car is done, it's most likely inside the building now

 

[Carlos Thomas]

usually when they are in service you lose the GPS until the car is done, it's most likely inside the building now

I just checked and it now shows the vehicle is inside the building and the front two doors are open. So I guess you still have the ability to see/track the vehicle.

And now it says waiting for parts, but still showing a pick up time for today. My guess is that if they are waiting on some sort of part, they will revise the pick up estimate to some other date.

I will try to find out what part(s) they are waiting on.

 

[someccie]

I just checked and it now shows the vehicle is inside the building and the front two doors are open. So I guess you still have the ability to see/track the vehicle.

And now it says waiting for parts, but still showing a pick up time for today. My guess is that if they are waiting on some sort of part, they will revise the pick up estimate to some other date.

I will try to find out what part(s) they are waiting on.

I hope you can get your vehicle back today. Unfortunately, I've had bad luck with their estimation times and wouldn't update to a future day until the day you're supposed to pick up. This happened to me when my rear drive unit, HV PCS Fuse [aka Pyro fuse], and subsequent 12V battery went bad on my 2019 Model 3 Performance a few years ago. They estimated a week, but it took three due to holidays and COVID. This was in 2022, so hopefully, the service center in your area is better now with communicating details, especially given this is a brand-new vehicle.

Good luck, and please let us know how it goes. Thanks for taking the time to share with us!

 

[Crissa]

But I was not expecting the softness in the brakes. Almost like brake fade when brakes get too hot.

Yeah, that's the loss of regeneration. You can also experience this in older Teslas that are at 100%.

I get this pretty frequently on my Zero 'cause there's no hilltop mode, and when I balance the battery there's no room for regeneration to store electrons on my first half mile down the hill so it gets disabled.

-Crissa

PS, A failure in one section may throw errors all over because now things that depend upon things - or sensors that depend upon power levels - are all upset. That's not a design failure, that's just how complex systems are.

And just because there's an error, warning, or shut down in a system doesn't mean that system is broken. It may just be warning you that that won't work now, or that it needs to protect that part, or that part's sensors can't be trusted in the current conditions.

 

[Spacenoddle]

I just checked and it now shows the vehicle is inside the building and the front two doors are open. So I guess you still have the ability to see/track the vehicle.

And now it says waiting for parts, but still showing a pick up time for today. My guess is that if they are waiting on some sort of part, they will revise the pick up estimate to some other date.

I will try to find out what part(s) they are waiting on.

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[Carlos Thomas]

It appears they have identified the issue. This is a good thing. Latest update (Thursday, February 29th):

“Carlos, hope you are doing well. We are progressing through service and technician diagnostic, Bed and Backbone Harnesses - Harness - LV Backbone is faulty. The part is special order and plan to have the part by 03.08.24. Once we install the part we will need to perform an extended road test to ensure there is no other alerts.”

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