500 mile Cybertruck is a must

[JBee]

But it makes sense with a QM only model range to keep the beggars on the gravy train.

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[HaulingAss]

But 1200km range. That would be enough to win over the fence sitters.

The last thing we need to do at this point in time is win over the fence sitters! We have way too much demand and not enough actual product, we want the fence sitters to keep sitting on the fence as long as possible. I know they will eventually wise up, but it's preferable that they take their own sweet time!

 

[RMK!]

I don't plan to tow, but 500mile range is must for me. After 3.5+ years of experience with LR Model 3. EV with 310miles range is not a go anywhere vehicle. Especially range drop 20+% in winter(only turn on heat seat).

The Supercharger Network like the Universe, is ever expanding.

With a 2 Tesla quiver we have never felt travel constrained. We charge at home 90+% of the time and road trip often in my Model Y LR. We have Tesla Solar with Powerwalls so most of the energy we use in the cars is self generated.

The fact that we live in California helps a great deal as the state is well covered with Superchargers as well as Tesla Destination Chargers. My wife drove her 2021 Model 3 SR with 3 colleagues on a 220 mile trip to SF yesterday. She is (much more than me) concerned about running out of battery and so she stopped at a Supercharger on the way home that the car essentially drove her to ... and in 10 minutes had a good energy buffer to get home.

She reports her colleagues were very impressed with the car and at least one of them is now intent on buying a Tesla. She is not now and never has been interested in cars. I once bought a new car (Ford SUV) and it took her a month to realize that the car was new (they were both white). She has never cared what car she drove (she actually hates driving) but seems very fond of the Tesla.

So this Tesla thing is much bigger than just the Cybertruck. The Tesla driving experience makes most people instant converts and I suggest that if you have a CT on order, you at least rent a Tesla from Hertz as an experiment. Take it to a Supercharger and see what that is like. I know you'll be impressed and that may help to quell some of that range anxiety.

 

[Ogre]

Can’t see why Tesla would push range much past 500 miles on their first stab at this.

500 miles is already well past what anyone else offers. Maybe a few years down the road when they are looking at competing with the F350 class of trucks and they want that extra power and range for towing bigger loads as a primary function. Kind of wonder if they would vary the form factor a bit if they did that.

 

[firsttruck]

Can’t see why Tesla would push range much past 500 miles on their first stab at this.

500 miles is already well past what anyone else offers. Maybe a few years down the road when they are looking at competing with the F350 class of trucks and they want that extra power and range for towing bigger loads as a primary function. Kind of wonder if they would vary the form factor a bit if they did that.

Tesla Cybertruck is not competing with EV trucks. Tesla is competing with ICE trucks like the market leader Ford F-150.

Tesla needs option of more than 500mi range on Cybertruck so the towing range of Cybertruck is closer to the Ford F-150 towing range. 0-60mph times are not the importaant thing it is the towing range that is important. Cybertruck towing range does not need to beat the Ford F-150 but the Cybertruck towing range needs to get closer to the Ford F-150 towing range.

 

[Crissa]

500 mile range makes its towing range like an F150.

-Crissa

 

[JBee]

Tesla Cybertruck is not competing with EV trucks. Tesla is competing with ICE trucks like the market leader Ford F-150.

Tesla needs option of more than 500mi range on Cybertruck so the towing range of Cybertruck is closer to the Ford F-150 towing range. 0-60mph times are not the importaant thing it is the towing range that is important. Cybertruck towing range does not need to beat the Ford F-150 but the Cybertruck towing range needs to get closer to the Ford F-150 towing range.

It's much cheaper and easier to beat the 0-60 time than the towing range though.

What percentage of truck miles are towing on average?

 

[rr6013]

I know you'll be impressed and that may help to quell some of that range anxiety

Baseline Anxiety:
California - Priority#1
South of I-10 First Order Coverage
South of I-40 Second Order Coverage
Texas - Priority#2

Regional Anxiety:
N-S Interstates
Destination Networks

Local-to-me Anxiety:
Battery Garrantee
Battery warrantee
Gaps in coverage(i.e. network restricted)
v2* compatibility
SOLAR availability mapped
Country of domicile networks
Self charging off-grid

 

[RMK!]

Baseline Anxiety:
California - Priority#1
South of I-10 First Order Coverage
South of I-40 Second Order Coverage
Texas - Priority#2

Regional Anxiety:
N-S Interstates
Destination Networks

Local-to-me Anxiety:
Battery Garrantee
Battery warrantee
Gaps in coverage(i.e. network restricted)
v2* compatibility
SOLAR availability mapped
Country of domicile networks
Self charging off-grid

What makes me anxious ...

1st order:
Women in red hats
Poor fitting underwear
Salmon mousse
Overly sharp knives
Cars in space
Fractal geometry

Secondary concerns:
Cats
Mildew
Hex head bolts
Costume party's

Wow, just saying them outloud makes me feel so much better.

 

[firsttruck]

It's much cheaper and easier to beat the 0-60 time than the towing range though.

What percentage of truck miles are towing on average?

A lot of pickups will tow something though it might be infrequently. Most truck buyers buy the truck thinking they will tow at some time.
They are paying for flexibility. If they need to tow something, they can.

This is the same with loads in truck bed. Most new trucks will not use but every truck buyer thinks they will.
They are paying for flexibility. If they need to haul a load of stuff or help a friend move, they can.

Also it often is not the new truck buyer that does all the rough stuff (loads in bed, towing) with the
truck. It is the second or third owner of the truck ( hand me down to a relative or resale buyer) that will use truck as truck. So in the trucks lifetime there is a much higher chance it will do all those truck like things than what the new truck buyer actual did do.

Of course the main discussion here is Cybertruck and because of the bed with secure retractable bed cover every Cybertruck is a truck that has SUV like capabilities too.
So Cybertruck bed will be used more often than bed of traditional designed pickup truck bed where a secure retractable bed cover is not standard equipment.

The article below title is clickbaity, the article itself is slightly misleading, and the study has design flaw.

The biggest error is once a year usage and no usage a year are bundled together.

Average of once a year usage over 10-15 year life of truck is NOT zero of this truck capability.

If 75% do towing 1 or 0 times a year that means 25% of truck owners are towing more often.

More truck owner are using the bed than the article implies.

----------------------------------------


You Don’t Need A Full-Size Pickup Truck, You Need a Cowboy Costume The most popular vehicles in America may be the greatest examples of overcompensation ever invented.
by Brett Berk | UPDATED Mar 15, 2019
https://www.thedrive.com/news/26907/you-dont-need-a-full-size-pickup-truck-you-need-a-cowboy-costume

.....
Truck owners might protest that they are slightly less likely than owners of other categories to use their vehicle as primary transport (83% vs. 95%), limiting the miles and gallons. And they might also protest that trucks provide capabilities that other vehicles lack. But, as it turns out, a significant portion of truck owners never use their trucks for these capabilities. According to Edwards’ data, 75 percent of truck owners use their truck for towing one time a year or less (meaning, never). Nearly 70 percent of truck owners go off-road one time a year or less. And a full 35 percent of truck owners use their truck for hauling—putting something in the bed, its ostensible raison d’être—once a year or less.


----------------------------------------

 

[JBee]

A lot of pickups will tow something though it might be infrequently. Most truck buyers buy the truck thinking they will tow at some time.
They are paying for flexibility. If they need to tow something, they can.

This is the same with loads in truck bed. Most new trucks will not use but every truck buyer thinks they will.
They are paying for flexibility. If they need to haul a load of stuff or help a friend move, they can.

Also it often is not the new truck buyer that does all the rough stuff (loads in bed, towing) with the
truck. It is the second or third owner of the truck ( hand me down to a relative or resale buyer) that will use truck as truck. So in the trucks lifetime there is a much higher chance it will do all those truck like things than what the new truck buyer actual did do.

Of course the main discussion here is Cybertruck and because of the bed with secure retractable bed cover every Cybertruck is a truck that has SUV like capabilities too.
So Cybertruck bed will be used more often than bed of traditional designed pickup truck bed where a secure retractable bed cover is not standard equipment.

The article below title is clickbaity, the article itself is slightly misleading, and the study has design flaw.

The biggest error is once a year usage and no usage a year are bundled together.

Average of once a year usage over 10-15 year life of truck is NOT zero of this truck capability.

If 75% do towing 1 or 0 times a year that means 25% of truck owners are towing more often.

More truck owner are using the bed than the article implies.

----------------------------------------


You Don’t Need A Full-Size Pickup Truck, You Need a Cowboy Costume The most popular vehicles in America may be the greatest examples of overcompensation ever invented.
by Brett Berk | UPDATED Mar 15, 2019
https://www.thedrive.com/news/26907/you-dont-need-a-full-size-pickup-truck-you-need-a-cowboy-costume

.....
Truck owners might protest that they are slightly less likely than owners of other categories to use their vehicle as primary transport (83% vs. 95%), limiting the miles and gallons. And they might also protest that trucks provide capabilities that other vehicles lack. But, as it turns out, a significant portion of truck owners never use their trucks for these capabilities. According to Edwards’ data, 75 percent of truck owners use their truck for towing one time a year or less (meaning, never). Nearly 70 percent of truck owners go off-road one time a year or less. And a full 35 percent of truck owners use their truck for hauling—putting something in the bed, its ostensible raison d’être—once a year or less.


----------------------------------------

Huh ok. Thanks for the link.

So that puts a different perspective on the use of trucks. Much, much lower than I expected, even if it was 10x as much...

If so CT is going to be a winner regardless, because most customers won't even care about towing that much, or bed, or off roading in real use.

 

[firsttruck]

Huh ok. Thanks for the link.

So that puts a different perspective on the use of trucks. Much, much lower than I expected, even if it was 10x as much...

If so CT is going to be a winner regardless, because most customers won't even care about towing that much, or bed, or off roading in real use.

I do not understand how you read that and concluded the usage number was even lower.

Here is another article

Of new full-size pickup owners, 68% use theirs for recreational towing and 92% for carrying large items at least once a year, according to a survey of 30,000 truck owners from California-based automotive research consulting firm Strategic Vision.

--------------------------------------

* The Detroit News is subscription only. investor.lordstownmotors.com had copy.

Electric trucks are coming — but pickup owners need convincing
The Detroit News
September 1, 2020
https://investor.lordstownmotors.com/static-files/6c73522e-b9bf-49c2-815e-fedfc1c70d26

.....
"I'd consider an electric if it had the capabilities of my current truck, and there was more infrastructure in the state for charging," said Rick Sobus, a Michigan resident who owns an F-150, in a Facebook comment to The Detroit News. "I don't want to be pulling my camper to northern Michigan and have to carry a generator or something to charge my truck."

Truck owners like Sobus say no matter what, they need the capability already offered by their internal combustion or diesel vehicles. Of new full-size pickup owners, 68% use theirs for recreational towing and 92% for carrying large items at least once a year, according to a survey of 30,000 truck owners from California-based automotive research consulting firm Strategic Vision.

"They have to be getting the same idea with a truck in the towing, ruggedness or capability of it," said Alexander Edwards, Strategic Vision's president. "It has to feel like a truck, behave like a truck and do better than a truck because of the electrification. If it does that, there's one in 15 (truck owners) that will go and check out it."

That 7% of the market is a starting point, Edwards said, and the demographics are desirable. These electric-vehicle truck intenders' median age is 50, lower than that of the general car-buying population and current EV owners. They typically have a college degree and report a median household income of $175,000.

They often enjoy outdoor activities, too, which is why a silent and emission-free drive could be appealing. Electric powertrains also provide instant maximum torque. With far fewer moving pieces, electric vehicles require less maintenance.

--------------------------------------

 

[RMK!]

The Cybertruck certainly has more than traditional truck buyers in the reservation que. It will bring many non-truck buyers into the truck world. I have never owned a truck and my interest in Cybertruck is only partially inspired buy hauling stuff and, pulling a trailer is low priority.

 

[Cherokee180C]

Tesla Cybertruck is not competing with EV trucks. Tesla is competing with ICE trucks like the market leader Ford F-150.

Tesla needs option of more than 500mi range on Cybertruck so the towing range of Cybertruck is closer to the Ford F-150 towing range. 0-60mph times are not the importaant thing it is the towing range that is important. Cybertruck towing range does not need to beat the Ford F-150 but the Cybertruck towing range needs to get closer to the Ford F-150 towing range.

Fully agree. Performance in a Truck is payload, towing and range. When have you known Tesla to have poor performance? They will target industry leading performance on all three of those parameters. Also 4680 cell production ramp is going much slower than planned, which would make sense to limit sales and maximize margin by producing the top of the line model first. Also doesn’t hurt that they never announced a price for that model, so anything goes without technically breaking their word, even though they will never be able to honor that pricing now. Still they would start with better PR focused on how great their performance is.

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