Miserable Towing Experience - NEED HELP! (Updated)

[Lasttoy]

I just drove from st Augustine to new Orleans. The AC is biggest drain on battery. Even when charging it eats up 4 mph. Next is speed. 68 is best.
I will attach message I got00

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[CyberLion]

Great Brainstorming, thanks for sharing

 

[flyinglow]

Hate to say it but, as great as the Cybertruck is, it is the wrong EV pickup for the job. The Silverado EV with its monster battery may be hitting a nail with a sledgehammer, for towing any distance, it is the answer to avoiding stress and heartburn.

This is one of those cases where what the heart desires needs to be overridden by reason. The range extender is a poor solution because it makes the truck a lousy truck.

 

[Cyber Man]

Hate to say it but, as great as the Cybertruck is, it is the wrong EV pickup for the job. The Silverado EV with its monster battery may be hitting a nail with a sledgehammer, for towing any distance, it is the answer to avoiding stress and heartburn.

This is one of those cases where what the heart desires needs to be overridden by reason. The range extender is a poor solution because it makes the truck a lousy truck.

Any EV pickup truck is the wrong truck for long distance towing. It’s funny how we think Silverado EV with 400ish range will magically solve long distance towing problem. It won’t. EV towing is not limited by battery but by drag from the trailer. This exact same setup that OP tried might have another 30 miles extra if he uses Silverado, but he will spend a lot more time finding charging network or waiting to charge a higher battery.

Pull through chargers, battery powered drivetrain trailers, and highly efficient aerodynamics trailers are the answers for long distance EV truck towing. Range extender is a joke. I don’t know what Tesla was thinking.

 

[Coagulation]

Any EV pickup truck is the wrong truck for long distance towing. It’s funny how we think Silverado EV with 400ish range will magically solve long distance towing problem. It won’t. EV towing is not limited by battery but by drag from the trailer. This exact same setup that OP tried might have another 30 miles extra if he uses Silverado, but he will spend a lot more time finding charging network or waiting to charge a higher battery.

Pull through chargers, battery powered drivetrain trailers, and highly efficient aerodynamics trailers are the answers for long distance EV truck towing. Range extender is a joke. I don’t know what Tesla was thinking.

Agree with this. If your use case is frequently towing long distances (say 500 plus miles), I would just get a gas / diesel truck. Towing locally such that you just juice back up at home each time, 100 percent EV.

 

[Cybertruck Dude]

You're basically towing a parachute lol

What did you set your trailer tire pressure to? I would max that tire pressure out to help with the weight and the parachute! lol ?

 

[DJAlan2000]

First, let me start out by saying that I love my AWD Cybertruck. This is my 3rd Tesla and do not believe I will ever own anything but a Tesla. I also thought I knew what I was getting into with respect to towing range. While my experience below was less than ideal, it is certainly doable for the amount of long range towing I do per year. All the above being fact, I could really use some advice.

I live in Saint Augustine, Florida. We migrate down to Marathon, Florida 2 to 3 times per year for lobster season and general fishing. I started the trip with 318 miles of range and was towing a 25 foot center console bay boat. Boat/trailer/fuel weight about 6,300 pounds in total. I was probably hauling another 1,000 pounds of gear (Scuba Tanks, Food, Ice, etc.), myself 180 lbs and my wife 118 lbs. So, in total I believe I was hauling around 7,600 pounds which I know is a lot. Over the 446 mile trip to the keys I averaged 1,140 Wh/mi!!!! We had to stop 5 times and the trip took over 11 hours. The scariest part was before the first leg where the range was dropping so fast that the nav system could not keep up with rerouting us to closer charging stations. It got so bad that it rerouted us to the nearest charging station and then said "stop and charge in order to make it to your destination" - which was the charging station! We got to the exit ramp and basically said I wasn't going to make it. We arrived at the charging station with negative 3% charge. After that, I was extremely conservative and always forced a charge stop around 80 miles to empty. I put the cruise control on 65 MPH for the rest of the trip.

On the way home, I made sure I had other members of the family haul all the gear, I made sure the fuel was pretty much on empty in the boat and also drained the fresh water tank. I averaged 1,051 Wh/mi on the way back which gave me 8.5% better efficiency. All and all, I was only able to go about 80 miles before needing to stop and charge. Again, never going over 65 MPH.

Here are a few questions:

1. Ride height? Assuming I should keep it on the lowest setting.
2. Chill vs. Standard? Assume I should keep it on chill.
3. Will the wheel hubcaps help once they arrive?
4. Are there any other settings I can fiddle with to increase the range?

I believe that I can possibly eliminate 1 stop by better managing which Superchargers I stop at. Thankfully I-95 has a ton of Superchargers but there are stretches where they can be scarce. As an example, Homestead, Florida is the last Supercharger before Marathon and there is 77 miles between the two chargers. If I can schedule my chargeing so as to get to Homestead nearly empty that will possibly eliminate a stop.

The other time consumption issue was with the need to drop the trailer almost everytime we charged. I got lucky on a few of the stops due to the fact that we were traveling at 3AM and was able to pull in and take up some empty charging slots. Not so lucky on the way home due to the fact that we drove thru the day.

My wife and I are 60 years old and are generally in no hurry to get anywhere anymore so doing this 2-3 times per year is a small price to pay for having an awesome truck.

Any advice is greatly appreciated.

WAY too fast if you were going over 60mph!

What is your TRAILER rated for? Most are rated for max speed of 55mph... Those tiny little wheels and tires are not made for speed, they are made for keeping water out of the bearings more than anything else and overheating those bearings can actually damage the seals and allow water (salt water!) in which can really ruin your day.

Had a friend of mine who did just that... He was hauling his boat, every weekend (almost) down to the ocean (about 50 miles for him) and of course he wanted to get there fast! Even though the speed limit (in CA) for trailers is 55, HE was going 70 most of the time... Well, it seized up one of his wheels after a couple of months of 'weekending' and the mechanic kinda TOLD him "You were driving over 55mph weren't you?"

He also had an issue with 'fuel', his old (I think 2005) F-150 didn't get great mileage and hauling a boat it was even WORSE! He ended up buying this funky 'cover' for the front of his boat/trailer that really helped the aerodynamics and got him another 5mpg!! Significant for him... That and of course he had slowed down to 55-60 and was then getting about 14mpg instead of the 8 he was getting before that!

The WEIGHT of the truck/trailer/gear is only HALF of the problem though... DRAG is the real beast for most boat haulers... Boats are just NOT meant to be streamlined ABOVE the waterline...

 

[VAF84]

Any EV pickup truck is the wrong truck for long distance towing. It’s funny how we think Silverado EV with 400ish range will magically solve long distance towing problem. It won’t. EV towing is not limited by battery but by drag from the trailer. This exact same setup that OP tried might have another 30 miles extra if he uses Silverado, but he will spend a lot more time finding charging network or waiting to charge a higher battery.

Pull through chargers, battery powered drivetrain trailers, and highly efficient aerodynamics trailers are the answers for long distance EV truck towing. Range extender is a joke. I don’t know what Tesla was thinking.

I feel like you haven't researched the competition, or just ignoring the magnitude of the impact that a large battery makes once you go beyond basic commuting needs.. I believe Jerry Rig on Youtube just did 170 miles at 75mph towing 11k lbs. That's double the distance of 310 range pickups; much more than double if the driver hyper miles at 55mph. It opens the possibility of reasonable day trips to nearby cities and back with cargo, and fast charging once at the destination. You may not have an understanding or use for towing, but this is a huge deal for anyone that tows regularly (non-commercial). It's potentially the difference between 5-6 stops in a "300 range" EV truck, and one stop in the large battery option for that day trip to a major city 160 miles away (320mi/2.5hrs ea way).

It may not be useful to some, but one can't just blow that capability off like it's useless.

 

[Cyber Man]

I feel like you haven't researched the competition, or just ignoring the magnitude of the impact that a large battery makes once you go beyond basic commuting needs.. I believe Jerry Rig on Youtube just did 170 miles at 75mph towing 11k lbs. That's double the distance of 310 range pickups; much more than double if the driver hyper miles at 55mph. It opens the possibility of reasonable day trips to nearby cities and back with cargo, and fast charging once at the destination. You may not have an understanding or use for towing, but this is a huge deal for anyone that tows regularly (non-commercial). It's potentially the difference between 5-6 stops in a "300 range" EV truck, and one stop in the large battery option for that day trip to a major city 160 miles away (320mi/2.5hrs ea way).

It may not be useful to some, but one can't just blow that capability off like it's useless.

I have been towing since 5 years, but I don’t have experience with EV towing. I did my extensive research on towing and hitch system and fully aware of what it takes to tow. I have done many long distance towing. Every rig is different in terms of towing. This is the most basic thing about towing and people get it wrong whenever they see a YouTube video about someone towing and claiming xyz range. I can guarantee you that if you take your rig in the exact same road with the same conditions, you will see different results. Something as simple as low air pressure can change the range by few miles. Add wind conditions, temperature, tire traction, trailer drag, hitch setup, elevation gain, and several other parameters that goes with towing, it’s a totally different condition. Just because someone gets 150 miles with their rig doesn’t mean you will get the same or you will have the best long distance towing experience. Did they tell you how many minutes they spent recharging a heavy battery? What about finding a good charging station? Have you ever towed long distance and tried searching for a gas station while driving? People get white knuckles even if a simple Semi passes you at high windy conditions and if the rig is prone for swaying. Doubling the battery size magically wont solve long distance towing problems. Anybody who has done serious towing and understands EV dynamics knows this by heart!

Yes I have seen Jerry’s towing videos. He is awesome. Did you notice the weather condition difference between CT towing and Silverado towing? Do you know towing a trailer with a hummer on it is completely different from towing an Airstream? What about the range difference with AT vs AS tires? How about tire pressure on snow conditions? Cold weather climate control?

Im saying this again, a solid network of Pull through chargers with a highly efficient aerodynamic Trailer, along with drivetrain system is the best solution for long distance EV towing. Until then, doubling the battery size is only a marketing gimmicks. If you don’t believe, try renting Silverado EV truck and tow from coast to coast. I’ll be very curious to know how you efficiently found parking spot near regular charging station, and how you waited for an hour every 150 miles, and how you hitched/unhitched magically in less than a minute, and how you maneuvered in those tight spots. First time when I fueled gas while towing, I was so determined to not run over a curb, but nope. It happened. On my day one, I couldn’t get my simple 20’ trailer inside a tight spot in the campground. Charging a humongous battery while also figuring out an empty spot and doing hitching/unhitching is a nightmare. People don’t tell those boring stuff on YouTube. You have to experience and learn the hard way. You might get 30 miles extra range with more batteries, but seriously, are you 100% sure the world magically changes from 70 mile radius to 100 mile radius?

 

[flyinglow]

Any EV pickup truck is the wrong truck for long distance towing. It’s funny how we think Silverado EV with 400ish range will magically solve long distance towing problem. It won’t. EV towing is not limited by battery but by drag from the trailer. This exact same setup that OP tried might have another 30 miles extra if he uses Silverado, but he will spend a lot more time finding charging network or waiting to charge a higher battery.

Pull through chargers, battery powered drivetrain trailers, and highly efficient aerodynamics trailers are the answers for long distance EV truck towing. Range extender is a joke. I don’t know what Tesla was thinking.

Early stages but Silverado EV owners are getting 200-250 miles towing. ICE vehicles are also impacted by trailer aero and loose a similar % range. Some diesels might get another 50 miles (assuming no auxiliary tanks) though you have to put up with the racket/smell and cost of diesel on a day to day basis. On their owners forum the truck is getting rave reviews on its towing prowess/range keeping in mind these owners are EV supporters/many own Tesla passenger cars.

Pull through chargers - absolutely.

I think the Cybertruck is a fascinating and fun vehicle but Tesla has kind of put itself in a corner in that the platform is kind of limited and can't offer the range of variations legacy pickup manufacturers can offer.

Hopefully the updated 4680 battery cells that partially eliminate fluid electrolyte will give the Cybertruck more range because the range extender makes no sense.

 

[mongo]

Hopefully the updated 4680 battery cells that partially eliminate fluid electrolyte will give the Cybertruck more range because the range extender makes no sense.

Dry cathode has nothing to do with electrolyte. Wet cathode application is dry after the solvent gets evaporated in the ovens.

 

[mongo]

Early stages but Silverado EV owners are getting 200-250 miles towing. ICE vehicles are also impacted by trailer aero and loose a similar % range. Some diesels might get another 50 miles (assuming no auxiliary tanks) though you have to put up with the racket/smell and cost of diesel on a day to day basis. On their owners forum the truck is getting rave reviews on its towing prowess/range keeping in mind these owners are EV supporters/many own Tesla passenger cars.

Pull through chargers - absolutely.

I think the Cybertruck is a fascinating and fun vehicle but Tesla has kind of put itself in a corner in that the platform is kind of limited and can't offer the range of variations legacy pickup manufacturers can offer.

Bigger pack -> more range in identical conditions (for typical values)

Where Teslas look worse is range loss due to towing. That is a result of their higher initial efficiency.

Silverado: 533 Wh/mile
Cybertruck: 362 Wh/mile
So Cybertruck uses only 68% as much energy. Every mile driven costs 32% less in electricity. Or, Silverado costs 47% more per mile.

Add a 600Wh/mile trailer
Silverado: 533/(533+600) = 47% inital range
Cybertruck: 362/(362+600) = 38% inital range

To get 200 miles of towing range in Cybertruck in this setup requires a 200*(362+600) = 192 kWh pack which would give 192/.362 = 530 mile range.

Well, not quite, 70 extra kWh @ 250Wh/kg = 280kg = 616 pounds, with 0.008 rolling resistance tires, that's 5 pounds of extra drag = 10Wh/mile.
So 192/0.372 = 516 mile range unloaded and a towing range 372/(372+600)=38% of that.

If range extender is 50kWh and 600 pounds, then unloaded should be around 465 miles and, with the trailer, around 178.

 

[flyinglow]

Silverado: 533 Wh/mile
Cybertruck: 362 Wh/mile
So Cybertruck uses only 68% as much energy. Every mile driven costs 32% less in electricity. Or, Silverado costs 47% more per mile.

No question that the Cybertruck is more efficient but some of the Silverado owners are getting 416 Wh/mile, so the difference isn't quite that large. Like anything to do with efficiency, details matter. With the Silverado, part of the problem is GM sticking them with those ridiculous 24" wheels. The WT versions on smaller wheels and tires get significantly better efficiency and can often go 500 miles if the speed is kept to 65 or so.

The Cybertruck has a similar coefficient of drag but a smaller frontal area so is more efficient aerodynamically. It also disconnects one axle when in cruise while the Silverado is full time AWD and doesn't disconnect an axle in cruise.

I only started out by suggesting that, if you are going to be trailering any distance regularly and want an EV pickup, the Silverado makes more sense. It goes further and charges faster (assuming you can find an empty 350 kW stall). Everyone gets to make their own choices and we are blessed with a fascinating array of EV pickups, each being unique in its own way.

 

[Tecyber1]

I tow all the time, but usually locally. It's fantastic, the best towing experience out there! It's just really long trips that the disadvantage is bad, especially if the thing being towed isn't aerodynamic. Also, this is where the range extender will really help. It won't change the dynamic greatly, but will make it far more bearable for long trips.

"tow locally" being the keyword and use case! Yes sir, the CT can be the right tool for that specific job. Long road towing? Absolutely not!

 

[Tecyber1]

ouch!

we just towed our camper over 1,000 miles from Canada back to Virginia. Piece of cake.

No we cannot go 200 miles per charge, only about 150 going from 80-85% to 15-20%. But doing the speed limit.

Travel can be point to point wide open but if that is not the goal. “Get there”. Then stopping every 2-3 hours for a few minutes is fine for us.

biggest plus I see for camp traveling is this.

Chrage for free at the campground and start the day with 90~95%. Go 150 miles to a supercharger and have lunch while you charge and the CT will be ready before you can eat … then drive 150 more miles and camp. And charge for free again.

so it makes charging half price and 300 miles per day easy.

I have done 800 miles in one day, Orlando to Richmond in our Y. Not so much fun. Exhausting.

Yep! Sounds like your expectations are within the CT's capabilities again with the tradeoff being the frequent and long stops. The CT "can" do it but is it the "right" tool for the job? YMMV!

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