rjo71342

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Based on this video there are some questions that need answering

1. tesla semi battery size . with the semi having a possible 1 MWh battery pack for the 500mi range and the cyber truck having the same range in the tri-motor config but not carrying as much weight, so assuming the semi is double stacking the same dimensions as the cyber truck skateboard area for the semi. we maybe looking at a 500 kwh battery pack based on 18650, I am sure the 1 million mile battery is in play here and that's on the new maxwell platform so battery size will shrink but will also grow in capacity. so using the shrink from model S > model 3 pack size of 100 kwh > 72 kwh for the same range (forgetting the weight) you have a 28% reduction but we will use 25% so that 1 MWh is now down to 750 KWh based on 2170 cells but with maxwell dry cell tech we have 20% reduction says we are now at 650 kwh and based on 4 feed lines for a mega charger 162.5 kwh per bank to charge which makes me think cyber truck has a 325 kwh 2 bank system.

2. chargers and sockets
based on the mega charger having 4 feed lines for their 650 kwh pack(estimate) you then have to ask will we see a V4 charger (500kw per line) and 1 extra type of charger called an extreme charger(my idea) between a SuperCharger<>(Extreme Charger)<>Mega Charger. so S/C 1 feed , E/C 2 feeds , M/C 4 feeds. Now since most countries are coming out with the priority tesla charge socket and a type 2 for the model 3 we may see a combo socket on the cybertruck with 2 on board chargers sockets a type 2 and a tesla socket to feed the 2 battery packs.

3. bi-directional charging and V2G(h)
since I have bought up that maybe 2 packs for the cybertruck and tesla not talking about V2G(h) vehicle2grid(home) this may change here with chademo and ccs2 having many companies talking about V2G on these types of interfaces tesla may allow 1 pack to be used as a V2G pack and keep the other pack just for the vehicles driving battery and give a full 1 million mile warranty on this pack and give a 500, 000 mile warranty based on the pack being used for a V2G option because it is using more cycles than just the driving cycles. so i am also assuming that you may have a 1 way battery isolation valve between bank 1 and bank 2 if using a v4 Extreme Charger can give to both banks INWARD only at 500 kw per bank but isolate bank 1 during OUTWARD OPERATIONS (V2G)

4. possible quad motor design
since we have the semi using 4 motors 2 different types for front and rear we may actually see a quad motor cybertruck which in turn offers functions
a) security as long as you have 1 motor you are still moving
b) range extension, if you can use 1 or 2 motors you then less power being used for motors not need powering i.e. going from 4wd > 2wd mode
c)locking hub sync situation, 4 motors 2 different ratios front to rear equals 2 different speeds left<>right and front<>rear
d)model 3 motors with model S plaid motors, the speed from plaid and efficient from 3 or plaid for crawling modes and 3 for range (high speed dirt)

I want peoples thoughts on this
1. am i crazy
2. is it possible
3. am i missing anything
 
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ajdelange

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Given that the heaviest current Tesla, the X, has a range of 351 miles and a nominally 100 kWh battery its consumption is about 285 Wh/mi. Thus the CT will probably need 400 - 500 implying, with it's 500 mile range, pack capacity of 200 -250 kW.

The rectifier/converter modules Tesla is currently using charge at 11.5 kW meaning at a rate of 23 - 29 miles per hour which is 5 - 6% of a full charge per hour. That's kind of marginal IMO so I wouldn't be surprised if the vehicle had two rectifier/converter units. As the latest version of the HWPC is limited to 11.5 kW that second rectifier will probably have its own separate port as is done in the Semi (as I understand it). As a single 350 kW DC charger would completely fill even a 250 kW battery in less than an hour the second port would not be necessary at a high power SC but as I expect them to be taking this technology from the Semi it will (if it is there at all) probably be usable at a Semi charging station. How would we gain access to those?.

As to V2G - no, I don't think the CT will have it, at least not at first. First I think for many emergency preparedness means having a source of electrical energy that will endure without the grid AND a full tank of gas in case it is necessary to get out of Dodge. Using the truck to power the house obviously wipes out the second requirement. It is possible to meet both with a couple of power walls and solar and, obviously, Tesla would prefer that you buy a Tesla roof, a couple of power walls and a CT than just the CT. This, I think, is the main reason it won't be offered.

Other reasons are that there are regulatory implications in V2G. The current NEC (American electrical code), for example specifically requires that EVSE (equipment that connects the vehicle to premises wiring) have circuitry to prevent back feed from the vehicle. Standards would have to be agreed upon and the glacially slow process of approvals etc. be completed. Might be different in ROW.

Finally there is the issue of round trip current into and out of the battery. Simple calculations based on the current Tesla battery warranty and assuming that the system load leveling threshold was set at 1.5 sigmas show that the battery in the vehicle is "driven" farther in a year by load leveling than by actual use of the car. Tesla owners tend to obsess about loss of battery range and, won't, I don't think, be willing to give it up for this use. And, of course, they would be more willing to do so if the chemical aging rate is reduced to 1/4 or less of what it is now. But that kind of aging rate is currently in the lab - not on the assembly line. Occasional use of the car as a power source as during outages is a different matter. People may want that and if enough do then Tesla will probably offer it (once the regulatory requirements are tamped down).

I won't comment on 4 motors. It isn't going to happen.
 
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parapyropig

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With 220 & 110 V plugs already in the truck, it seems as though it’s already somewhat set up to be a house battery if need be.
 

Fabville

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With 220 & 110 V plugs already in the truck, it seems as though it’s already somewhat set up to be a house battery if need be.
I’ve been wondering with the 220v source onboard any reason why you wouldn’t be able to run an extension from this plug to at least manual transfer switch on your home. My neighbor has a 30 amp manual transfer switch wired up to some of their more critical circuits which can be powered with their small, gas powered generator.

With only 13.5 kWh’s on the current Powerwall it’s seems more practical to use V2H in the event of a power outage. I believe Nissan has offered V2H in Japan for a couple years now.
 

Cyberpartyboy21

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This would be an incredible function for off grid homes. Not so sure about grid connected homes, though. CT would have enough power for probably a couple of weeks at full power.
 

Earthkeepr

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This would be an incredible function for off grid homes. Not so sure about grid connected homes, though. CT would have enough power for probably a couple of weeks at full power.
Would love to have VTH for back up power, but it may be counterproductive for selling Powerwall. Maybe it could be a $5k upgrade feature? A 100kW CT would be a far better back up for intermittent power loss than a CDN$15k Powerwall
 

ajdelange

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The TriMotor will have a battery capacity of about 200 kWh. That means you can get 1 kW out of it for 200 hr which is 8.3 days if you can live on 1 kW. My average draw is 3.9 kW. It would, thus, run my establishment for 2.1 days though, of course, if it were the only source of energy I had I would try to get the load down from 3.9 kW. People don't seem to grasp that 200 kWh just isn't that much electricity.
 

Earthkeepr

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The TriMotor will have a battery capacity of about 200 kWh. That means you can get 1 kW out of it for 200 hr which is 8.3 days if you can live on 1 kW. My average draw is 3.9 kW. It would, thus, run my establishment for 2.1 days though, of course, if it were the only source of energy I had I would try to get the load down from 3.9 kW. People don't seem to grasp that 200 kWh just isn't that much electricity.
Still beats buying a Powerwall for intermittent power loss from grid
 

ajdelange

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It's going to have a 240 A outlet in the bed. This might have as much as 30A behind it. That's 7.2 kW which is about the same as many popular portable generators hooked into small houses via manual transfer switch and is clearly the easiest and most likely means that will be initially available for using the truck as a source of backup or remote power. Some discipline is necessary WRT to load shedding.

The best arrangement for intermittent power loss from the POV of convenience is a bank of power walls that will carry you for a couple of days of cloudy weather plus have the capacity for your peak load(s) and solar panels that will recharge them. Clearly a fairly expensive proposition.
 

Earthkeepr

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Agreed, Powerwall is a better option but the few times a year the grid fails, $15-30k is better invested in the CT. An extension cord from CT to critical devices at home is ok if VTH doesn’t materialize, but a VTH connection through my solar inverter to a transfer switch to power only those necessary power demands is a lower cost back up power.
 

Fabville

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Agreed, Powerwall is a better option but the few times a year the grid fails, $15-30k is better invested in the CT. An extension cord from CT to critical devices at home is ok if VTH doesn’t materialize, but a VTH connection through my solar inverter to a transfer switch to power only those necessary power demands is a lower cost back up power.
I'm in the process for the Tesla Solarglass v3. I was asked about whether or not I was interested in Powerwalls, I just don't see much benefit for my instance. We have net metering, don't have off-peak rates, and haven't had any major power outages in a couple of years. I'll test an extension cord going to my neighbor's transfer switch when we get our CT, for the rare instance we'd want power to a portion of hour house during an extended power outage.

Another product I've seen that I thought was interesting is an inverter with built-in J1772 charger from SolarEdge: https://tandem-solar-systems.com/bu...dbDa8-KGCqu677pY-Bl8ert0TClmfFmhoCYO8QAvD_BwE
 

Earthkeepr

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Yes, solar edge is the inverter I chose. I ordered a Tesla V3 solar shingle roof but I am way down the list to get one here in Canada. So conventional panels on standing seam steel roof for my 10kW array. Passed on the Powerwall for the same reasons you had. Good luck on getting the Solar shingles! It’s the roof of the future
 

cybrtrk_maybe

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I have solar, connected to the grid, but didn't chose to get the power walls because I was told that... in the event of a power outage my house could not use the power wall, or any solar that would have been collected while it's out. I was also told that I could not disconnect from the grid. The solar has brought my electric bill down quite a bit, but I still have the monthly payment for the loan to get the solar. The bottom line is that when electricity prices go up, mine won't be as drastic. If I can, legally, disconnect from the grid, then please let me know how. Also, if I could use the power walls and the solar collected during a power outage, then that would help a lot too. Thank you.
 

David R Kirkpatrick

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I have solar, connected to the grid, but didn't chose to get the power walls because I was told that... in the event of a power outage my house could not use the power wall, or any solar that would have been collected while it's out. I was also told that I could not disconnect from the grid. The solar has brought my electric bill down quite a bit, but I still have the monthly payment for the loan to get the solar. The bottom line is that when electricity prices go up, mine won't be as drastic. If I can, legally, disconnect from the grid, then please let me know how. Also, if I could use the power walls and the solar collected during a power outage, then that would help a lot too. Thank you.
I got solar roof 10 years ago and Powerwalls last year. We have net metering but are paid about 1/3 for power produced and charged full price for power used. Central Hudson really has a scam going! With Powerwalls in the Summer I can charge all day and consume all night and still put a little in the grid. Hence, my summer (J,J,A,S) usage is zero. I am so happy with the Powerwalls...before and after are like night and day! However, even with 4 Powerwalls they only last about 1-2 days if there is an outage or cloudy days.
I don’t really get the advantage of trying to make the CT into home backup. Too little storage to make a difference. Seems better to just let it be a truck and power the house with it’s own batteries. Much simpler and more efficient.
 

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