Foundation Series Remorse

[cvalue13]

On a different perspective this level of consistent confusion speaks to the fact the EPA needs to provide a different approach/formula so the average consumer understands what they are reading.

I don’t think think that’s the problem, respectfully

the EPA data is simple, clear, informative, and accurate - as any such standard can be

EPA gives three figures:

City:
Highway:
Combined:

EPA gives the parameters of those three figures.

From there, if people can’t grasp the directionality of outcomes impacted, I’m not sure there’s anything more the EPA can do.

What’s left of it, here on this forum and with respect to the CyberTruck, again, are Tesla people seeped in the range behaviors of an EV sedan, not yet getting how EV trucks behave differently due to basic physics.

That confusion not helped by 2 years of silly Tesla fanbois looking at Lightning range data and telling one-another how Tesla is so smart they’ll never subject themselves to physics like that.


I have empathy for folks not used to BEV trucks getting up to speed, sometimes the hard way, like OP.

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[BayouCityBob]

Is anyone else having serious concerns/remorse on the foundation series range? I completed my down payment Christmas eve, and since have been seeing range tests maxing out around 250 miles on the freeway.

I currently have a 2022 Model S long range (405 mile range) and have done the trip Milwaukee to New Orleans. All went well and I felt 400 miles was enough to comfortably stop and recharge every 3-4 hours.

I was planning to use the CyberTruck to travel to Florida frequently. Having to stop every 2 hours kind of changes the dynamic of the trip.

Do you think we have anyway of getting out the 1k down payment considering the range seems to not be what was advertised?

I had the same concerns and tried to pull out of the FS but was told by Tesla that it was either cancel and lose the down payment and place in line or buy the FS. (I cancelled altogether which made me very sad but so it goes.) Another person posted on here that Tesla told him he could just not finish the purchase process and he would retain his place in line. It is worth a phone call to see what they say.

PS We also have a Model S LR (2023) - it is a road trip monster for sure.

 

[Sjohnson20]

Just cancel and eat the $1,000. That’s why Tesla required the $1,000.

Do you get 400 miles in the Model S?

 

[we7313]

Just cancel and eat the $1,000. That’s why Tesla required the $1,000.

Do you get 400 miles in the Model S?

Yes 379 or so on the freeway. If we do over 80 it creeps down, but not that bad.

 

[Fleetwood75]

The range is not a deal-breaker for me, especially with the range extender coming later this year. Everybody has their own needs and priorities so I get it if it doesn't work for you but I'm eager to jump on a FS invitation if Tesla will just please please send me one.

 

[pricedm]

approx 81 kWh battery in Model Y
Recent WINTER round trip with significant elevation change (3 mountain passes).
278 w/m or approx 3.6 miles/kWH
3.6 x 81 = 290 mile range.
One 30 min charge on return trip; first leg 200 miles traveled, used 230 miles of range; second leg 170 miles traveled, used 250 miles range (temps 3 - 30* F; up three significant mountain passes).

--> versus a Cybertruck with 120+ kWh battery and 2.0 - 2.2 miles/kWh = MOR charging time.

Model S is the king of road trips, based on range. Same with Lucid Air (if Lucid can manage to stick around and if you can find a working CCS DC charger).

 

[Outdoors]

Yes 379 or so on the freeway. If we do over 80 it creeps down, but not that bad.

So you own a Model S Long Range and you charge to 100% and say you get 379 miles. What speed roughly? Cause I gotta call Bull Shi$% unless you are going down a hill or really slow like 45mph.

 

[Rutrow]

You should have no trouble getting the EPA range if you follow the EPA conditions.

Yeah, so long as all your driving is indoors you'll have no problem getting the full EPA rated range. ?

 

[scottf200]

These batteries are the largest ones produced by Tesla (for non-commercial use) and I would think they can push out a software update to allow the batteries to “fast charge” for a longer time.

On V3 TSuperchargers they are charging two 400v packs that are 61.5 kWh each tho!

I think that is the same as charging older TM3s.

On V4+ perhaps charging one 800v pack that is 123 kWh can take advantage of it in some way. As many say at the individual cell level are the same and don't really care about 800v vs 400v.

 

[scottf200]

I doubt you will get any sympathy from Tesla and IMO you shouldn't. The EPA estimated range is determined by the EPA and not Tesla. So your beef is actually with the EPA.

The EPA range tests are garbage IMO. They run them on a dynamo in a lab until the battery is dead and average out the cycle results. Average highway speed tests are around 50mph and peak around 60mph. They then apply a 0.7 factor to the results to simulate a "real world" result. Its a crap system that is not accurate.

With that being said "real world" highway numbers are more like 70MPH for most people. At 70MPH an EV will never meet the EPA rated range results because the EPA "real world" results are not real world.

Visual example (Troy Xwitter)

 

[OnTheSnap]

If they don’t look bad, I’ll switch to the all season tires/wheels and gain 10% range later in the year. Works for my use case which has mild off road trails and more miles.

I think the current all terrain tires are the real culprit to the disappointing numbers

 

[we7313]

So you own a Model S Long Range and you charge to 100% and say you get 379 miles. What speed roughly? Cause I gotta call Bull Shi$% unless you are going down a hill or really slow like 45mph.

This is a tangent & don't care to debate the range of my Model S.
I am wondering if others are considering this a mistake purchase after putting down the 1k. Also interested in seeing what my options are.
I appreciate others sharing what they plan to do in a similar situation.

 

[we7313]

If they don’t look bad, I’ll switch to the all season tires/wheels and gain 10% range later in the year. Works for my use case which has mild off road trails and more miles.

I think the current all terrain tires are the real culprit to the disappointing numbers

Yes, I'm hoping someone does this and conducts a test. I probably will replace the wheels and tires regardless. Also would consider getting the range extender to make this a viable option.

 

[Outdoors]

This is a tangent & don't care to debate the range of my Model S.
I am wondering if others are considering this a mistake purchase after putting down the 1k. Also interested in seeing what my options are.
I appreciate others sharing what they plan to do in a similar situation.

This isn't a tangent. This is exactly spot on when you speed up and go highway speed. You lose range so you're 400 and whatever mile s is going to get about 320 at 80 mph.

The same situation happens with a cyber truck but you are carrying around a lot more weight and it's not nearly the coefficient of drag of a Model S.

I think the real debate is you're having with yourself is that you don't want to spend $100,000 until the range matches what you want. Which means probably stick with the car and for going to Florida.

I have a place in Florida too and I agree with you 100%. I'm not going to drive it to Florida.

In a nutshell, that spreadsheet is going to look the same way for a cyber truck. It's not going to be any different. Those that drive really slow and go downhill are going to get rated range or even greater than that. Those that don't aren't going to show up on that list because they drive the car. They want the way they want to drive the car or truck.

You aren't getting your thousand back unless you buy another Tesla is my thought. That way you aren't really getting it back. It's in the car

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