Cybertruck Trailer Hitch/Casting Failure @10,400 lbs *VERTICAL LOAD*

[Cyber Man]

Dynamic weight is 100% based on trailer weight, along with distribution and tow vehicle dynamics.
When the tow vehicle hits a bump the hitch will rise. The amount of force that places on the hitch is dependent on the inertia of the trailer, not the static tongue weight.

That's why trailer and hitch test standards are based on the dynamics and run around 6k of vertical tongue load for a 11k class trailer.

A trailer with 1,100 tongue weight could be 11k pounds or 2k. In the 11k case (ignoring tire&axle), it could be 6,050 pounds directly over the hitch and 4,950 pounds an equal distance from the axle the other way. The hitch needs to directly accelerate that 6k during bumps, not just the 1k of net torque difference.

Then, for long term durability, that value needs to be derated due to fatigue limits of the materials.

Jumping off a scale gives you a reading of f=m*a where a is gravity plus your jumping ability. Jumping on a scale results is a deceleration based on your body's compliance and how much you bend you knees. Typically 2-3gs per Grok, so you'll get a reading of 3-4x your weight. Think hammer resting on a nail vs hammer swung at a nail.

Tongue weight accounts for the ballpark of Dynamic load. Have you tried weighing the tongue weight of a 11,000 lbs trailer with a hitch scale? I have done that, and it can never be 6000 lbs. The skid plate testing that’s done by OEMs accounts for all these parameters to finally arrive at the Tongue weight. The tow vehicle is powerful enough to Tow more weight. Check out the Guinness world record that Porsche Cayenne holds for towing Boeing airplane, but guess how much the Tongue weight limit is as per the specs - 750 lbs. If what you are saying is true, then a bump while cornering 30 mph 11,000 lbs trailer should put 10,000 lbs weight on tongue. Can you imagine how much under/over steering that’ll cause? Research on how skid plate testing is done by OEMs to arrive at the Tongue weight. The suspension of Tow Vehicle, Axle load, WD hitch, and several more mechanics come into play. It’s not as simple as Dynamic load multiplied by X times the tongue weight when there is a bump!! If what you saying is true, then a 20,000 lbs Semi towing a 1000 lbs trailer should put 20K lbs of downward pressure on the hitch after it hits a bump. That’s not how physics works.

If you still don’t believe, then talk to a guy by name Andy who is quite popular on YouTube for towing 23+’ Airstream trailers with Tesla sedans. I have talked to him multiple times to understand how hitch reinforcement is done when you exceed Tongue weight while driving! Tongue weight can never be 10X. If this were true, most rigs will have under/over steering while driving!

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[mongo]

Check out the Guinness world record that Porsche Cayenne holds for towing Boeing airplane, but guess how much the Tongue weight limit is as per the specs - 750 lbs.

It was an Airbus 380 weighing 285 tons, but that's irrelevant since a draw bar puts none of the trailer weight onto the hitch. Velu Rathakrishnan of Malaysia pulled two trains, with a total of weight of 260.8 tonnes using his teeth (also Guinness Book of World Records).

Tongue weight accounts for the ballpark of Dynamic load. Have you tried weighing the tongue weight of a 11,000 lbs trailer with a hitch scale? I have done that, and it can never be 6000 lbs.

A hitch scale only shows differential torque, not mass, and not inertia. A trailer reading 1,100 pounds tongue weight could weigh 2,200 pounds, 11k lbs, or even 110k pounds. Are you saying those are all equally easy to tip up and down?

It’s not as simple as Dynamic load multiplied by X times the tongue weight when there is a bump!! If what you saying is true, then a 20,000 lbs Semi towing a 1000 lbs trailer should put 20K lbs of downward pressure on the hitch after it hits a bump. That’s not how physics works.

Dynamic load is the experienced force. It's inertia based which depends on total trailer mass, its distribution, and the tow vehicle dynamics (end result of its mass and suspension). The hitch loading depends on the acceleration produced by the tow vehicle against the tongue. A 20k tow vehicle exerting 2.4m/s² is the same loading as a 10k vehicle exerting 2.4m/s² (though the road conditions to produce those results would vary).

 

[Speednet]

The last thing I want to see is that idiot Jerryrig's face. He's a major douchebag.

 

[kpanda17]

This pisses me off. Jerryrigeverything publicly hates elon and taking some of it out of the Cybertruck. I am not trying to defend it, but do the same test on rivian too, right?
I mean what does this prove? Yeah we get it you hate him yadda yadda pffft

It’s Jerryrig GTM, how he makes money
Negativity unfortunately sells to the masses
He’s a click baiter

 

[Pops]

I dont understand why so many people are offended by this video. Everything has a failure point. This video only helps us to understand where that might be for the CT. It seems to be well outside the bounds of normal use, even for towing. I do plan on towing a lot soon, and I am not worried one bit, even after watching.

One thing I am concerned about is aluminum fatigue failure, so I will be getting a tow hitch with dampening to reduce the stock put into the frame and attachment points.

 

[Cyber Man]

It was an Airbus 380 weighing 285 tons, but that's irrelevant since a draw bar puts none of the trailer weight onto the hitch. Velu Rathakrishnan of Malaysia pulled two trains, with a total of weight of 260.8 tonnes using his teeth (also Guinness Book of World Records).

A hitch scale only shows differential torque, not mass, and not inertia. A trailer reading 1,100 pounds tongue weight could weigh 2,200 pounds, 11k lbs, or even 110k pounds. Are you saying those are all equally easy to tip up and down?


Dynamic load is the experienced force. It's inertia based which depends on total trailer mass, its distribution, and the tow vehicle dynamics (end result of its mass and suspension). The hitch loading depends on the acceleration produced by the tow vehicle against the tongue. A 20k tow vehicle exerting 2.4m/s² is the same loading as a 10k vehicle exerting 2.4m/s² (though the road conditions to produce those results would vary).

Now we are talking about two different things - Dynamic load based on inertia versus vertical Dynamic load on the hitch that some are hypothesizing to be problem in CT. As I said above, please research on how skid plate testing is done to arrive at the Tongue weight. It *does* account for Dynamic vertical load on the hitch and axles. This is a very serious regulation thing that OEMs do all the time.

Are you saying CT frame snapping at 10,000 lbs makes it unsafe to tow 10,000 lbs trailer? That’s an absolutely ridiculous conclusion with no scientific basis. If this were true, under/over steering is a bigger problem before the hitch snaps. 10,000 lbs hitch breaking point means CT can technically handle a trailer of 100,000 lbs!

 

[mongo]

Now we are talking about two different things - Dynamic load based on inertia versus vertical Dynamic load on the hitch that some are hypothesizing to be problem in CT. As I said above, please research on how skid plate testing is done to arrive at the Tongue weight. It *does* account for Dynamic vertical load on the hitch and axles. This is a very serious regulation thing that OEMs do all the time.

Are you saying CT frame snapping at 10,000 lbs makes it unsafe to tow 10,000 lbs trailer? That’s an absolutely ridiculous conclusion with no scientific basis. If this were true, under/over steering is a bigger problem before the hitch snaps. 10,000 lbs hitch breaking point means CT can technically handle a trailer of 100,000 lbs!

???
I never said Cybertruck was unsafe.
Nor do I follow what skid plate testing has to do with imposed vertical forces on a hitch.

Needed tongue weight for safe handling is 10% trailer weight. SAE hitch tests are roughly 50% trailer weight as are European ones.
10k is thus 80% or so over the standard, and that's what one would want to allow for fatigue margin.

 

[cybercricket]

Now we are talking about two different things - Dynamic load based on inertia versus vertical Dynamic load on the hitch that some are hypothesizing to be problem in CT. As I said above, please research on how skid plate testing is done to arrive at the Tongue weight. It *does* account for Dynamic vertical load on the hitch and axles. This is a very serious regulation thing that OEMs do all the time.

Are you saying CT frame snapping at 10,000 lbs makes it unsafe to tow 10,000 lbs trailer? That’s an absolutely ridiculous conclusion with no scientific basis. If this were true, under/over steering is a bigger problem before the hitch snaps. 10,000 lbs hitch breaking point means CT can technically handle a trailer of 100,000 lbs!

No, that would be incorrect. If the receiver breaks under 10k static load, then it can only handle a similar dynamic load of 10k or so (not quite the same given time is probably a factor, but good enough for the argument).

 

[CyberGus]

Is there a quiz on this later? This is a lotta maths

 

[AlmostHuman]

Wait, are you telling me my Cybertruck has a hitch?!? I need to check that out!

 

[AlmostHuman]

Structures Engineer w BS and 28yrs as an Aircraft SE FedEx / Boeing / Airbus. Good test

Fix

Easy fix a doubler on the casting or better to just increase the casting thickness. Easy fix is to get a better shear strength adhesive with a few what is called chicken fasteners.

If it were me as a Tesla Engineer I would do both

and

Add a water proof sealer outside of that adhesive bond area. Weakest problem with adhesives is hot / wet strength so one fix would be eliminate the wet.

Problem

Road salt or cracks in adhesive / casting due to prior use will cause a premature failure.

You should reach you to Tesla.

 

[mongo]

Structures Engineer w BS and 28yrs as an Aircraft SE FedEx / Boeing / Airbus. Good test

Fix

Easy fix a doubler on the casting or better to just increase the casting thickness. Easy fix is to get a better shear strength adhesive with a few what is called chicken fasteners.

If it were me as a Tesla Engineer I would do both

and

Add a water proof sealer outside of that adhesive bond area. Weakest problem with adhesives is hot / wet strength so one fix would be eliminate the wet.

Problem

Road salt or cracks in adhesive / casting due to prior use will cause a premature failure.

Why do think it needs further strengthening?

AFAIK, from the factory, the hitch loading path doesn't include adhesives. That's only for repairs.

 

[Speednet]

So some idiot with a YouTube channel purposely overloads the tongue weight many times more than its rating until something breaks and now a bunch of Einsteins want to "fix" it. Do you folks not understand that you are being trolled? Are you new to the Internet?

 

[AlmostHuman]

So some idiot with a YouTube channel purposely overloads the tongue weight many times more than its rating until something breaks and now a bunch of Einsteins want to "fix" it. Do you folks not understand that you are being trolled? Are you new to the Internet?

Nothing wrong with people talking about things. Chill out.

 

[Speednet]

Nothing wrong with people talking about things. Chill out.

Nah, you play into the hands of anti-Tesla morons by discussing their trolling as if it was legitimate. It isn't and you shouldn't. Be smarter.

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