Powershare compatible wall charger - Tesla Universal Wall Connector in online shop

[Aces-Truck]

So if I understand correctly, if the power goes out, you have a transfer switch that separates you from the grid, and you can run the house and Tesla charger from the Gen. If I understand everything correctly, then you should be able to run the house off the CT or the generator.

Not necessarily. The advantage with a switch like this, is also a problem for certain home situations. The generator connections that I have seen, fall into two types: With a switch for the whole house panel; or where there is a subpanel for only the essential circuits. Tesla's switch appears to be designed for the whole panel. For those (like myself) who have used standalone Generators that you wheel into place (outdoors), then connect a wire to service the house, the generator typically can't handle the load of everything in the panel. For example, if you have electric heat, you could be drawing 40Amps at 220V. A gas generator, if it's overloaded, will pop the circuit breaker on the generator itself. So you'd typically turn off the high load items in your panel before connecting the generator. My generator is only 4k capacity. But if the CT or a Powerwall can deliver enough, then this switch would make everything seamless.

But if you have a subpanel approach, it contains only the circuits you care about in an outage. It gets it's power from the main panel, though a circuit Breaker in the main. If you use Tesla's switch in that case, you would still be powering everthing in the house. So you'd have to manually switch off any high load circuits you don't need.

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[PilotPete]

Not necessarily. The advantage with a switch like this, is also a problem for certain home situations. The generator connections that I have seen, fall into two types: With a switch for the whole house panel; or where there is a subpanel for only the essential circuits. Tesla's switch appears to be designed for the whole panel. For those (like myself) who have used standalone Generators that you wheel into place (outdoors), then connect a wire to service the house, the generator typically can't handle the load of everything in the panel. For example, if you have electric heat, you could be drawing 40Amps at 220V. A gas generator, if it's overloaded, will pop the circuit breaker on the generator itself. So you'd typically turn off the high load items in your panel before connecting the generator. My generator is only 4k capacity. But if the CT or a Powerwall can deliver enough, then this switch would make everything seamless.

But if you have a subpanel approach, it contains only the circuits you care about in an outage. It gets it's power from the main panel, though a circuit Breaker in the main. If you use Tesla's switch in that case, you would still be powering everthing in the house. So you'd have to manually switch off any high load circuits you don't need.

And there are electronic sub-panels that let you load shed on the fly.

However, I understood @Jhodgesatmb to say that when he is on the gen, he can charge the car. So that should mean that without the gen, the CT can feed the same circuits that the gen feeds. Yes???

 

[JBee]

Not necessarily. The advantage with a switch like this, is also a problem for certain home situations. The generator connections that I have seen, fall into two types: With a switch for the whole house panel; or where there is a subpanel for only the essential circuits. Tesla's switch appears to be designed for the whole panel. For those (like myself) who have used standalone Generators that you wheel into place (outdoors), then connect a wire to service the house, the generator typically can't handle the load of everything in the panel. For example, if you have electric heat, you could be drawing 40Amps at 220V. A gas generator, if it's overloaded, will pop the circuit breaker on the generator itself. So you'd typically turn off the high load items in your panel before connecting the generator. My generator is only 4k capacity. But if the CT or a Powerwall can deliver enough, then this switch would make everything seamless.

But if you have a subpanel approach, it contains only the circuits you care about in an outage. It gets it's power from the main panel, though a circuit Breaker in the main. If you use Tesla's switch in that case, you would still be powering everthing in the house. So you'd have to manually switch off any high load circuits you don't need.

That purely depends on where the Backup/Transfer switch is installed, either between the sub-panel and the main panel, or the main panel and the grid.

If you have a manual generator input switch, this will also disconnect either sub/main panel from the grid. If you connect the CT via the bed 240V outlet to the generator switch you will only get 9.6kW to the house, and you will have to do the connecting and switching completely manually.

On the other hand if you use the V2G setup and the Tesla bi-directional charger, you will be able to simply plug in the CT on the outside NACS port and it will be able to automatically switch off the grid connection and connect the CT power to your house, but with the full 11.5kW available.

This is because the NACS charge plug has a higher rating of 250,000W than the 240V NEMA plug in the bed, being only 240V x 40A = 9600W.

It's important to point out here, that this capability is just by using the bi-directional capabilities of a full H-bridge inverter circuit, which is used in the L2 onboard charger. There has been lots of discussion around this over the last decade already, where this type of circuit has been implemented since the beginning of Tesla, but has not been activated until now.

The original Roadster already had V2G, and in fact many of the Hyundai/Kia/Volvo etc EV's already do this exactly the same way using the same electronics. The point is that the circuit they use is already bi-directional and they can choose to use it like that or not.

I haven't looked at the Tesla latest onboard charger circuits, but it is highly likely that other already existing Tesla have kept this and all have this capability through the NACS port, but it has been disabled by Tesla until now. It could well be possible, together with the safety switching implemented in the Universal home charger now, that they could enable V2G on the rest of the fleet as well. This "trump" V2G/V2H card has been known and documented for nearly a decade now.

The only variation that might need some more switching, is the V2V (vehicle to vehicle) setup, where there would be a negotiation compatibility issue, and it would depend on the recipient vehicle to be able to negotiate delivery. This could well be dealt with either a dedicated V2V cable and some switching, or if hardware compatible a OTA update.

Either way the addition of V2X is a huge addition in functionality and performance.

A CT is quite literally he cheapest $kWh house battery you can buy, and it comes with a "free" car.

Hence why I placed multiple orders at the time, one being for my offgrid/workshop house, after seeing they had the inverter output installed in the original prototype and that it allowed access to the pack storage. Should work well with 30kW of solar on the roof.

 

[JBee]

And there are electronic sub-panels that let you load shed on the fly.

However, I understood @Jhodgesatmb to say that when he is on the gen, he can charge the car. So that should mean that without the gen, the CT can feed the same circuits that the gen feeds. Yes???

Yes.

The critical point is simply that the house circuit the charger is on is not connected to the grid as well as the CT, whilst using the CT as a "generator".

 

[anionic1]

Do you know what is the wire AWG and the breaker's max current in your home electrical panel?
I wonder if my AWG 6 and 50 Amp would be enough

I have installed 20 Tesla Chargers. They want a 60 amp breaker to pull the full 48 amps. It asks you when you set up the charger how many amps the breaker is. If you tell it 50, it might not let you pull the full 48 amps. You could probably tell it 60 and see if you have any issues with it tripping the circuit. The 50 amp breaker will protect your #6 conductor. I have a feeling like this V2H is a little more complicated than just having the charger. Most utilities require rapid shutdown due to a power outage so you will have to have a transfer switch. The charger may have a switch in it so that it cuts off V2H in the case of an outage but i am sure thats why most people want it in case of an outage. So you would need some other system in place to allow the utility power to stay disconnected and the charger to continue to power the home. This charger alone will not include all that. The same way the ford system doesn't do it all with the charger. They have additional equipment that needs to be installed. I believe its just a transfer and some rewiring of the main house panel switch that communicates with the charger to let it know its safe to put power back to your house. I believe i heard that the tesla charger will put back about 9kW to the house which is about 75 amps at 120V, which should run most basic needs of any typical house.

People shouldn't think that they can just install a bidirectional charger and suddenly have backup power. Its more complicated that that. Should probably budget about $1500 all in to get this actually acting like a backup generator. Note that some solar systems are set up to turn off the grid so people with solar may already have the capability and would only need to install the charger. Anyone with a powerwall almost certainly already has ability to disconnect from the grid and this charger integration should be very seemless.

Lastly, one interesting thought, is that as many areas are overwhelmingly converting to solar and home power systems, the utility grid are being greatly relieved of stress and my guess would be that black outs due to stress to the grid will become much less likely. Obviously random blackouts and acts of god will still occur. Also, one very smart move will be to use your vehicle to power your home during peak hours so you avoid higher rates and then recharge at off peak hours. If used frequently this will have negative effects on your vehicle battery and shorten its life in the vehicle.

 

[anionic1]

I hope this is no different than the universal wall connector Tesla brought out a month or so ago because I got one and don't feel like getting another one. Not that I need power sharing to the house (I have a whole home generator) but I don't like to waste money and I like to be prepared. The power sharing capability would be just one more way to be prepared just in case.

I also just bought 2 of those universal chargers a month ago (back when they were $450). I would be surprised if they are different because they only started shipping them in October. For anyone interested, they are almost identical to the NACS wall connector. The difference is they are probably about 1" deeper. Likely to accommodate the larger adapter mounted on the connector recess. Other than that, side by side they look almost identical.

 

[fhteagle]

anti-islanding protection

Shouldn't that be auto-islanding?

 

[anionic1]

Also the new powerwall from tesla which recently came out is really slick. as it combines the battery and inverter in one system. i believe you still need their backup gateway to have the transfer switch. I bet to use the new bidirectional charger as emergency power tesla will sell people the backup gateway. Here are the specs on the powerwall 3.

 

[anionic1]

Shouldn't that be auto-islanding?

yes.

 

[anionic1]

That purely depends on where the Backup/Transfer switch is installed, either between the sub-panel and the main panel, or the main panel and the grid.

If you have a manual generator input switch, this will also disconnect either sub/main panel from the grid. If you connect the CT via the bed 240V outlet to the generator switch you will only get 9.6kW to the house, and you will have to do the connecting and switching completely manually.

On the other hand if you use the V2G setup and the Tesla bi-directional charger, you will be able to simply plug in the CT on the outside NACS port and it will be able to automatically switch off the grid connection and connect the CT power to your house, but with the full 11.5kW available.

This is because the NACS charge plug has a higher rating of 250,000W than the 240V NEMA plug in the bed, being only 240V x 40A = 9600W.

It's important to point out here, that this capability is just by using the bi-directional capabilities of a full H-bridge inverter circuit, which is used in the L2 onboard charger. There has been lots of discussion around this over the last decade already, where this type of circuit has been implemented since the beginning of Tesla, but has not been activated until now.

The original Roadster already had V2G, and in fact many of the Hyundai/Kia/Volvo etc EV's already do this exactly the same way using the same electronics. The point is that the circuit they use is already bi-directional and they can choose to use it like that or not.

I haven't looked at the Tesla latest onboard charger circuits, but it is highly likely that other already existing Tesla have kept this and all have this capability through the NACS port, but it has been disabled by Tesla until now. It could well be possible, together with the safety switching implemented in the Universal home charger now, that they could enable V2G on the rest of the fleet as well. This "trump" V2G/V2H card has been known and documented for nearly a decade now.

The only variation that might need some more switching, is the V2V (vehicle to vehicle) setup, where there would be a negotiation compatibility issue, and it would depend on the recipient vehicle to be able to negotiate delivery. This could well be dealt with either a dedicated V2V cable and some switching, or if hardware compatible a OTA update.

Either way the addition of V2X is a huge addition in functionality and performance.

A CT is quite literally he cheapest $kWh house battery you can buy, and it comes with a "free" car.

Hence why I placed multiple orders at the time, one being for my offgrid/workshop house, after seeing they had the inverter output installed in the original prototype and that it allowed access to the pack storage. Should work well with 30kW of solar on the roof.

Man! are you running a pot farm or a welding shop. I have a hard time believing that you can actually use that much solar, unless its all pointed north and you live in alaska.

 

[scottf200]

V2H is 11.5 kW ? (I haven't seen any doc)

• 240v 48 amps
• 120v 96 amps

 

[Snòók]

Anyone have an installation manual for the new UWC? That they could post.

 

[CyberGus]

Anyone have an installation manual for the new UWC? That they could post.

https://digitalassets.tesla.com/tes...-Wall-Connector-Installation-Manual-NA-EN.pdf

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