Tesla charging below 0 degrees Fahrenheit.

[m_jorge]

Reading the news online, I see many articles on the same theme, that EVs won't charge in cold weather. Here is an example: https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/com...ures-hit-chicago/ar-AA1n7FAq?ocid=socialshare
Conveniently none of the articles allow public comment.

I have two coworkers here in MN (Where cold weather means sub-zero in Fahrenheit) and have asked both of them 1) "Does your vehicle charge OK in cold weather?" and 2) "Does the cold drastically affect your daily driving range?"

Both coworkers stated that 90% of the time they charge at home and have had no problem. When they charge at Tesla chargers neither of them have had issues either.

They also both stated that their normal daily drive (approximately 100mi/day) has been unaffected, but neither has done a long road trip in sub-zero weather.

Since many of the forum readers are prior Tesla owners with years of use, and since there are a few Cybertrucks on the roads these days, I was wondering what your experiences have been. Also wondering why there are SO VERY MANY articles slamming EV charging/performance in cold weather.

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[Cybertruck2024]

I live in Buffalo, NY. We don't get below 0 Fahrenheit very often, but we do spend a good part of the winter in the teens. I park in disconnected unheated garage and use Tesla Wall Connectors. I've never had a problem charging at home.

Range in these temperatures pretty much drops to 50% of EPA, so that's not a lie or exaggeration. I'd only buy an EV in a cold weather area if the EPA is 2x your daily commute range. I go about 40 miles daily, so even my 230 mile range Lightning gets the job done at 50%.

 

[CyberGus]

The charge curve is highly impacted by cell temperature, that's why Tesla always "preconditions" the pack to a higher temperature for Supercharging. When the thermal management system cannot raise the pack temp sufficiently, charge rate is reduced to avoid damage.

In frigid temps, the pack might shed heat faster than the thermal management can add it. It's unclear where those limits are.

Tesla has very good thermal management, though. It's usually other brands I see getting stuck. If a Tesla fails to charge in the cold, I would suspect it is malfunctioning.

 

[cvalue13]

Powerwalls installed outdoors have related challenges …

 

[Cybertruck2024]

The charge curve is highly impacted by cell temperature, that's why Tesla always "preconditions" the pack to a higher temperature for Supercharging. When the thermal management system cannot raise the pack temp sufficiently, charge rate is reduced to avoid damage.

In frigid temps, the pack might shed heat faster than the thermal management can add it. It's unclear where those limits are.

Tesla has very good thermal management, though. It's usually other brands I see getting stuck. If a Tesla fails to charge in the cold, I would suspect it is malfunctioning.

There's a notice that comes up on my Lightning when you park and it's very cold out, saying "plug in now for best battery performance" or something similar.

I've never been in sub-zero temps where I wasn't either running the vehicle or charging for more than a day, that might be what's causing some of these events being reported. If you live in an apartment building and are dependent fully on supercharging, having the Tesla sit for a few days in sub-zero temperatures would likely be tough on the vehicle. If you are able to stay plugged in a good amount of the time, like the OP's friends that charge at home, likely won't ever be a worry.

 

[GhostAndSkater]

TLDW: If your pack is a block of ice, it will take a up to one hour for it to warm enough for it to start charging

TLDW2: If you live in cold places, install at 240 V outlet/charger, precondition 1h before leaving or set the automatic schedule to do so and you will never have an issue

This is why preconditioning exists and why Teslas says on the screen to pre condition, the heating power on Teslas goes from 4.5 kW (single motor) up to 11.5 kW, all of those are more than enough to heat and keep it hot

The only occasion what @CyberGus said of it losing heat faster than it can heat up will happen is at low power AC charging, 110 V or really low current 240 V, the power the outlet provides isn't enough to heat and charge at the same time, so it will cycle between them and take ages to charge

 

[pricedm]

No issues charging in -17*F temps.

In my 12 minutes at the Kremmling, Colorado Supercharger, there were five Teslas, one Rivian, and one Audi Etron (2nd from left). No one had any issues. -17*F January 15. My 2023 Model Y accepted max 250 kW flow rate.

But hey, this doesn't get as may clicks as 'doom and gloom' mainstream media lol.

Yes, a stone-cold battery needs to warm up before charging. Like an ICEmobile needs to warm up before it can be driven. Non-issue.

 

[Gurule92]

My vehicle charges fine. Yesterday was 0 in the morning for me. I preconditioned my car before I went out to drive for lyft. Performance wise the car was fine, but my wh/mi was up significantly. So yea, range takes a hit, but I think if you are preconditioning before charging at a supercharger you would be fine and I had no problems charging at home

 

[scottf200]

Since many of the forum readers are prior Tesla owners with years of use, and since there are a few Cybertrucks on the roads these days, I was wondering what your experiences have been. Also wondering why there are SO VERY MANY articles slamming EV charging/performance in cold weather.

TLDW: If your pack is a block of ice, it will take a up to one hour for it to warm enough for it to start charging

By chance, all the news made me remember this situation from Jan 2020 while on a road trip.
NOTE: You read the below TeslaFI table from the bottom up.

Novel real world example below. TeslaFI view makes the story easy to reenact/tell on its own. I actually used to think the batteries would warm up within 10-15 minutes but the question/answer is really what is the starting temp.

Situation:
Battery cold soaked overnight and it was "only" 9F/-12C. I forgot to precondition but was planning to navigate to the nearby (14 miles / 17 min) supercharger from the hotel in the morning so the battery heater would be on the whole time (it was 96%).

I 'charged' for 10 minutes and used 0.32 kWh but the batteries didn't charge (assume all energy still warming but expected more kWh to be used during that time. Supercharger apparently not working well either.)

I had enough charge to make it to the next supercharger on our road trip and the battery continued to warm (17% of the time heating). I was able to charge OK there (141 kW max speed in our 2017 model X - top row below).

 

[scottf200]

FYI, Kyle from OutOfSpec mentioned in a recent cold weather energy use testing (not charging) video that Rivian very recently came out with an OTA that keeps the battery around 32F IIRC
so that when you go to charge it will be a reasonable ramp-up.

I think it was toward the end when summarizing his two test (new precond TMS plaid with heat pump vs older cold soaked TM3 without heatpump)

 

[Outdoors]

People in Norway are pretty smart.

Me not so much, but I still figured it out.
A Tesla does just fine in the winter.

Like -20F or so in Manitoba.

 

[WormtownKris]

Journalism in 2024: "Never Let the Truth Get in the Way of A Great Story". Everyone in the media piggybacked on the same story about some cold Teslas in Chicagoland, but you weren't allowed to comment on them. Butthurt Tesla haters like Fred at Electrek did the same thing. (Gotta get the clicks, ya know!) Today, after the hype died down, he printed a low-key article stating correctly that EVs fail less frequently than ICE vehicles in extreme cold. Most of the sensation seekers will have already moved on with the false narrative that Teslas suck again, but Fred would rather capture clicks on his stories than be objective, even if it hurts the EV movement in the process.
As everyone above stated, range takes a deep hit, Teslas charge fine in extreme cold, but do charge much more efficiently if the battery is pre-conditioned.

 

[mark555055c]

Getting in before the FUDsters show up to try to back up the fake news....

My car lives outside and 0deg F occurs in winter here and there, and i've not had any issues. Telsa has thought of this and taken it into account long ago. Disregard the mainstream media.

 

[CyberGus]

the heating power on Teslas goes from 4.5 kW (single motor) up to 11.5 kW, all of those are more than enough to heat and keep it hot

That's quite a bit of heating power. I'm surprised it takes up to an hour to heat the pack. It is very massive, of course.

Would it make sense to insulate the underside in cold climates?

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