⚡️ PowerShare Install, Specs, Details confirmed! No load shifting (for now)

[Cybertruck 1974]

Gateway v3 is full installed. The UninWall connector and my house backup loads are all connected to the gateway. The only thing missing to make it work is the firmware which is delayed until March sometime. And won’t be an OTA update. Once the update the firmware manually it’ll operate with OTA updates.

The solar is still connected to the main feed and not the gateway. Eventually when solar is supported I’ll need to move it to the gateway. This will extend backup time. It’s not clear if they will support excess solar charging the car or not during a blackout. I’m guessing not but hoping it will.

My general sense is that V2H is supported but maybe not V2G functions like time shifting or allowing solar to directly charge the car in a blackout. Time will tell unless they release a roadmap of planned features for PowerShare. So powerwalls may have that advantage and eventually might make sense to add a couple to get support for those features.

Thank you for the info.

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[RollingRefrigerator]

so someone like me with a 4k solar system that produces maybe 10kwh a day in summer because of trees blocking and in winter 2k a day production with 2 wall batteries and going to get the power share with Cybertruck what will NEM 3.0 do to me? I already pay $1600 a year in Tru Up Fees....

Quick summary is NEM 2.0 has buy/sell rates equal to each other, meaning you can offset usage with exports (hence the Net equiv metering). NEM 3.0 only gives you wholesale rates for export, meaning you only get 4-6 cents per kwhr instead of 40-60 cents. It's a big deal, and has led to something like a 75% reduction in new solar installs since Apr-2023 if my memory is correct.

And my understanding is that any replacement, upgrade, etc will result in resetting NEM status and putting you on the 3.0.

Do your own research though, and let me know what you all find out! It's confusing as hell (by design), and everyone's situation is different (i.e. net importer, net exporter, seasonal variation, etc etc).

EDIT: Adding source for wild claims - https://pv-magazine-usa.com/2023/12...olar-installations-drop-80-following-nem-3-0/

 

[RollingRefrigerator]

No mention of any PGE issues at all. I’m a legacy EVA rate home, so we get really aggressive off peak charges.

Yes I have a nice 11kw solar array. Hopefully when the gateway software supports it I’ll connect it up to the gateway. For now they are under explicit instructions to not connect the solar to the gateway.

Highly recommend you contact PG&E on this, because this could be a problem. It sounds like you are on NEM 2.0 or maybe even 1.0 (the dream plan!) And if this resets you to NEM 3.0, the benefit you get of that 11 kW array will be significantly reduced. I bet (unless you have a powerwall or other storage) you're exporting in the peak hours. This is offsetting the dark hours and your charging. With NEM 3.0, you'll only get a few cents per kWh, so you're basically giving PG&E nearly free electricity during their peak need hours, and then paying full price when you need to draw off the grid.

 

[OnTheSnap]

Highly recommend you contact PG&E on this, because this could be a problem. It sounds like you are on NEM 2.0 or maybe even 1.0 (the dream plan!) And if this resets you to NEM 3.0, the benefit you get of that 11 kW array will be significantly reduced. I bet (unless you have a powerwall or other storage) you're exporting in the peak hours. This is offsetting the dark hours and your charging. With NEM 3.0, you'll only get a few cents per kWh, so you're basically giving PG&E nearly free electricity during their peak need hours, and then paying full price when you need to draw off the grid.

Nah - calling them is basically self reporting. Hard pass.

 

[RollingRefrigerator]

Nah - calling them is basically self reporting. Hard pass.

Getting a permit is self reporting.

But actually I'm guessing they wouldn't change you until/if you hook the solar up to the gateway. I could see them just treating the v3 and wall connector as a change not relevant to the solar.

 

[gaubong053]

Highly recommend you contact PG&E on this, because this could be a problem. It sounds like you are on NEM 2.0 or maybe even 1.0 (the dream plan!) And if this resets you to NEM 3.0, the benefit you get of that 11 kW array will be significantly reduced. I bet (unless you have a powerwall or other storage) you're exporting in the peak hours. This is offsetting the dark hours and your charging. With NEM 3.0, you'll only get a few cents per kWh, so you're basically giving PG&E nearly free electricity during their peak need hours, and then paying full price when you need to draw off the grid.

Any chance made to your system via permit will reset NEM to 3.0. This happened to me. So if you have NEM <= 2.0 then should not install powershare.

 

[RollingRefrigerator]

Any chance made to your system via permit will reset NEM to 3.0. This happened to me. So if you have NEM <= 2.0 then should not install powershare.

That's my suspicion as well, but do you have any confirmation/details on what is considered a change in this regard? For example, I am simply replacing a v2 gateway with a v3. I already have Tesla v2 gateway, solar, and powerwall. Is this a reset? I would call PG&E, but after wasting an hour on the phone with them simply trying to change rate plans (unsuccessfully due to an error in their system), I am not up for it until I get my truck.

Especially without load shifting currently, so it's just a backup system. It's unfathomable simply adding a v3 for offline backup only is considered a change that would impact your solar NEM status, but it's PG&E, so of course they'll take the opportunity to screw us a little bit more...

 

[Cybertruck 1974]

That's my suspicion as well, but do you have any confirmation/details on what is considered a change in this regard? For example, I am simply replacing a v2 gateway with a v3. I already have Tesla v2 gateway, solar, and powerwall. Is this a reset? I would call PG&E, but after wasting an hour on the phone with them simply trying to change rate plans (unsuccessfully due to an error in their system), I am not up for it until I get my truck.

Especially without load shifting currently, so it's just a backup system. It's unfathomable simply adding a v3 for offline backup only is considered a change that would impact your solar NEM status, but it's PG&E, so of course they'll take the opportunity to screw us a little bit more...

Would you keep the old V2 when they replace it with V3? Also I just had a second power wall installed where they quoted me 1 power wall, 1 gateway, accessories, labor, permit, taxes and rebate because of two batteries now but when I got the bill it shows all that on invoice but they didn't install a gateway as I already have one from solar and first battery install.. $900 value. I contacted them about it but no response. Im wondering where this will go?

 

[gaubong053]

That's my suspicion as well, but do you have any confirmation/details on what is considered a change in this regard? For example, I am simply replacing a v2 gateway with a v3. I already have Tesla v2 gateway, solar, and powerwall. Is this a reset? I would call PG&E, but after wasting an hour on the phone with them simply trying to change rate plans (unsuccessfully due to an error in their system), I am not up for it until I get my truck.

Especially without load shifting currently, so it's just a backup system. It's unfathomable simply adding a v3 for offline backup only is considered a change that would impact your solar NEM status, but it's PG&E, so of course they'll take the opportunity to screw us a little bit more...

No confirmation at all. I only discovered new exporting rate via bill statement. As I understand, any update in your solar profile in their system after NEW 3.0 start date will reset it to the current NEM. Even you can call them, I guess the representative will have no idea as the implementation is in their backbone. The permit for powershare will just like adding a new “powerwall” or “battery storage” and likely will reset your NEM.

 

[RollingRefrigerator]

Would you keep the old V2 when they replace it with V3? Also I just had a second power wall installed where they quoted me 1 power wall, 1 gateway, accessories, labor, permit, taxes and rebate because of two batteries now but when I got the bill it shows all that on invoice but they didn't install a gateway as I already have one from solar and first battery install.. $900 value. I contacted them about it but no response. Im wondering where this will go?

Good question. I'm betting the install crew just loads that v2 up in their truck when they head out! But now I'm wondering if the path to all this working is just have them install the v3 downstream of the v2, and use it solely for backup if/when the regular system is depleted. If it's even possible (supported by the Gateways), it seems to me I could make the case that I haven't touched the NEM 2.0 approved system, just added an offline backup that isn't even tied in to the system unless the grid is down.

 

[CyberGus]

Discussion of the V3 Gateway and PowerShare by certified installers.

Tesla says 3 to 20 seconds for power switchover, according to them.

 

[OnTheSnap]

According to this video

Powershare will _never_ be grid "interactive" which simplifies UL/permitting. And therefore should have zero effect on your PGE plan.

It's equivalent to buying a diesel generator with cutover switch.

 

[RollingRefrigerator]

According to this video

Powershare will _never_ be grid "interactive" which simplifies UL/permitting. And therefore should have zero effect on your PGE plan.

It's equivalent to buying a diesel generator with cutover switch.

Agree! That was one of my main takeaways from this (very informative) video. He also said that it won't do grid forming with solar, meaning that if you have solar, it won't act like a traditional gateway+powerwall and switch between export, import, and offline (backup).

But the other main point, which is even bigger (at least for me and anyone else with powerwalls!):
Starting at about 26:00, he explicitly states that if you have a powerwall and wall connector with any generation of Tesla gateway, you are already good to go and don't need to move to v3/3v gateway. He said it will 'intelligently share power with your powerwall and increase the duration of backup' or something like that. He then says "eventually" and admitted OTA updates were needed. It does make some sense, though, because if I understand it right, it is the powerwall that does the grid forming, neutral balancing, etc, when the grid is offline. So that complex v3 system is already in there.

This, assuming it's true, is immense - not only would we not need to worry about resetting NEM status, but we don't even need to install the new gateway at all?!?! I wonder if they would offer us PW peeps the free supercharging then? Yeah, I know, unlikely...

 

[Cybertruck 1974]

Discussion of the V3 Gateway and PowerShare by certified installers.

Tesla says 3 to 20 seconds for power switchover, according to them.

I love how it's not a grid active part where NEM 3 is out of the scope of billing. Good to know. I have 2 wall batteries so will always have instant, uninterrupted power and the Truck will just be in case batteries run out. Or will just use at my cabin instead of the 13kw gasoline generator.

 

[Cybertruck 1974]

Some of this information about v3, wall charger doesn't make sense to what the Tesla installer told me while installing my second battery and had done the v3 powershare install in Cal. these guys didn't know the price of units, etc but said they have pallets of the equipment ready to go???

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