CyberTruck competitor Chevy Silverado EV looks pretty good

ÆCIII

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Just zooming out of this conversation's weeds a little to note the simple glaring obvious.

If one goes on 'looks' alone then they deserve what they get. GM and legacy auto have 'looks' and advertising quite polished by now. Of course they've had decades to to do it.

Substance however, is weakened and reduced by GM's business model bloated with heavy non-vehicle indirect costs of dealerships, advertising, with political/union entanglements. This means your purchase money is split off and distributed to all these extra entities with less of it going into the substance of a vehicle for You.

GM is masterful at advertising a vehicle while leaving out what goes on behind the scenes. You only realize this after owning the vehicle, when it's obvious that Tesla is 'eating your lunch' in cost of ownership, performance, and features.

GM has a big problem with debt, and many outdated manufacturing systems needing updated too (which is even more debt). Don't think that your purchase of a GM vehicle is not going to partially pay for that, because it definitely is (or the tax payer might have to pay for it also if GM begs for a bailout again).

If GM were really secure in their vehicle substance, they really wouldn't need all the advertising hype and political entanglements. GM is sort of like a teacher's pet hiding behind a teacher when challenges are too real.
 

charliemagpie

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I feel sorry for legacy auto. They are just business going about their business.

Easy to say they could have changed earlier, but they have to undo before they are able to Redo, and that is practically impossible. We have a word... Disruption. Might as well be caused by an Asteroid or War. Same.

Business competition, like sport, had evolved to form an equilibrium. All the expertise, 100 years of knowledge, honed skills to play the game. Now, counts for nothing when there is a different sport taking over the field of play.
 

Ogre

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I feel sorry for legacy auto. They are just business going about their business.

Easy to say they could have changed earlier, but they have to undo before they are able to Redo, and that is practically impossible. We have a word... Disruption. Might as well be caused by an Asteroid or War. Same.
Hard for me to feel sorry for GM and much of legacy auto when they spent so much time and effort lobbying against efficiency standards and working around them. Essentially, they’ve spent the past 20+ years fighting the effort to make them clean their shit up instead of just making clean cars.

Remember just 3 years ago Mary Barra was cozying up to Trump administration and suing the state of California to escape their harsher clean air mandates. If the Democrats lose in 2024, you can bet legacy auto with be begging for regulatory relief to help them fight off Tesla.

No sympathy save for the workers who are going to get the shaft here.
 


BahamaTodd

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The only part of this I would question is when?

Is GM even planning on building out 120 Gigawatt Hours of battery capacity any time soon? They would likely need that for the trucks and about half that much if they want any other capacity for EVs.
GM has four battery US factories planned with each having between 35-50 GWh. The first in Ohio starts production later this year, and the others each consecutive year. Tennessee in 2023, Michigan in 2024, and the location for 2025 has not been announced yet.

That doesn't even account for GM's China battery factories. The first started production last year.

Ohio battery factory as of last week.
 

BahamaTodd

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Hard for me to feel sorry for GM and much of legacy auto when they spent so much time and effort lobbying against efficiency standards and working around them. Essentially, they’ve spent the past 20+ years fighting the effort to make them clean their shit up instead of just making clean cars.

Remember just 3 years ago Mary Barra was cozying up to Trump administration and suing the state of California to escape their harsher clean air mandates. If the Democrats lose in 2024, you can bet legacy auto with be begging for regulatory relief to help them fight off Tesla.

No sympathy save for the workers who are going to get the shaft here.
Actually, four years ago when GM announced they were all-in on EVs that blindsided the other legacy auto makers and the Trump administration who were planning to relax emissions regulations.

https://www.eenews.net/articles/how-gm-made-everyone-in-washington-mad/
 

Ogre

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GM has four battery US factories planned with each having between 35-50 GWh. The first in Ohio starts production later this year, and the others each consecutive year. Tennessee in 2023, Michigan in 2024, and the location for 2025 has not been announced yet.

That doesn't even account for GM's China battery factories. The first started production last year.

Ohio battery factory as of last week.
Crissa pointed this out a couple pages up and I ran some numbers. https://www.cybertruckownersclub.co...o-ev-looks-pretty-good.4972/page-5#post-95626
 

Ogre

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Actually, four years ago when GM announced they were all-in on EVs that blindsided the other legacy auto makers and the Trump administration who were planning to relax emissions regulations.

https://www.eenews.net/articles/how-gm-made-everyone-in-washington-mad/
When it comes to EVs GM is the ultimate big hat, no cattle.

They make a lot of waves with big announcements, but at the end of the day they still Joined Trumps efforts to force the EPAs less stringent air quality guidelines on California.

https://www.pbs.org/newshour/nation/automakers-side-with-trump-in-legal-fight-with-california

Of course once they saw the writing on the wall, they dropped out and cozied Up to Biden really tight.
 

firsttruck

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Actually, four years ago when GM announced they were all-in on EVs that blindsided the other legacy auto makers and the Trump administration who were planning to relax emissions regulations.

https://www.eenews.net/articles/how-gm-made-everyone-in-washington-mad/
GM was not blindsided. GM's Mary Barra lobbied the Trump administration to kill California lower standards.

Same thing GM did with EV1 in late 1990s to early 2000s.
Once GM got California to weaken regulations, GM killed the EV1.
 


Crissa

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If LG Chem's batteries hadn't been faulty, GM would be looking good right now. Their new battery factories will put them ahead of Ford.

Looking back, I wonder if they weren't for loosening regulations to give them more time to build up while other automakers dithered. 🤷‍♀️

-Crissa
 

Ogre

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It’s not super hard to be ahead of Ford.

Agree on the Bolt fire/ LG thing, but that’s kind of what happens when you outsource such a critical piece of your vehicle.
 

firsttruck

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If LG Chem's batteries hadn't been faulty, GM would be looking good right now. Their new battery factories will put them ahead of Ford.

Looking back, I wonder if they weren't for loosening regulations to give them more time to build up while other automakers dithered. 🤷‍♀️

-Crissa
Sounds probable.

Slow adoption of EVs which results in more innocent people killed/injured from the air pollution so a few people can make more profit (executive bonuses and shareholder dividends).
 

Crissa

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It’s not super hard to be ahead of Ford.

Agree on the Bolt fire/ LG thing, but that’s kind of what happens when you outsource such a critical piece of your vehicle.
It could happen either way. See also the Raptor 2 falling behind when moving to production last year or the BE-4 just straight up failing to meet delivery. It happens all the time.

Sometimes it's good to be lucky.

-Crissa
 

charliemagpie

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Even though GM is looking better than Ford… They are both headed for the cliff edge. More of an academic exercise to differentiate, but the reality is where they are heading. One will get there sooner than the other. That's all.
Sponsored

 
 




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