bkervaski

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whether it tows 14k or not, the versions being released on Nov 30 won’t be directly competing with anyone who actually needs a 3/4 ton pickup

Someday they might offer a version that tows 14k, but the CT will still have less cabin room (and seating) than a 3/4 ton, less bed cargo room, and a restricted (if not impossible) ability to tow goose neck, etc.




This CyberTruck is competing for a more profitable market segment - something about as big as a midsized truck, but nearly as spacious and with more cargo room than any 1/2 ton ICE truck

that’s a pretty large and compelling market - both midsize and 1/2 ton segments.
Without any confirmation yet this is how it's looking, they will sell all that they make. If it's successful, I bet we see an HD version at some point when battery supply isn't as constrained.
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cvalue13

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Without any confirmation yet this is how it's looking, they will sell all that they make. If it's successful, I bet we see an HD version at some point when battery supply isn't as constrained.
Generally agree, but think it’s less about number of cell constraints as it is energy density per cell. There is simply no physical space in the design of the cyber truck for an extra ~40% more pack, size and physical dimensions.

regardless, the main point is the same: on November 30 the biggest news will be aside from purchase price, any comments regarding Teslas future plans and timing for a longer range version
 

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on November 30 the biggest news will be aside from purchase price, any comments regarding Teslas future plans and timing for a longer range version
That, and what the Range is with this battery pack configuration. 300? 350? Is it too much to hope it's EPA range is even higher....
 
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That, and what the Range is with this battery pack configuration. 300? 350? Is it too much to hope it's EPA range is even higher....
sure, if you're in the camp of still having your fingers in your ears about what's been said and seen on this forum for the last several months

i don't blame anyone with fingers in their ears, exactly, but I'm not one of them didn't list range as an unknown (in rough magnitude) at this point, because it's not an unknown (in rough magnitude) as far as I'm concerned

there'll be a single pack size, range will start with a "3", and it wont be a high "3" - end of story (far as I'm concerned)
 

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While the 2019 unveil understandably mislead or confused people into thinking the models shown on screen would all be release simultaneously, at no point I'm aware of has Tesla rolled out all and every model variant at once. They change, add, improve (or diminish) over time. On Nov. 30, they're basically releasing only that one "Dual" model variant (even then, significantly changed) - that there will be a "Dual - performance" version (which happens to have 3 motors), does not mean they are releasing the 2019 "Tri Motor" variant.
the distinction here, what is *not* the ‘normal tri-motor’, is that it lacks the unveil higher range and higher towing.
...
Been trying to amplify that folks need to shake this mindset from 2019, where number of motors is indicative of a broadly different class of CyberTruck across the stats, pack size, suspension duty, etc.

While a trim option will include a third motor, it is not the 2019 “Tri Motor”
Where did you read or what gives you the mindset that there are only dual motors terminology [tossing the Tri-Motor Plaid conventional terminology]?
I'm sorry if you explained that or pointed to a source but I couldn't find it.
  • - dual:
    • 1 motor front
    • 1 motor rear
  • - dual performance [beast] trim:
    • 1 motor front
    • 2 motors rear
 


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Where did you read or what gives you the mindset that there are only dual motors terminology [tossing the Tri-Motor Plaid conventional terminology]?
I'm sorry if you explained that or pointed to a source but I couldn't find it.
  • - dual:
    • 1 motor front
    • 1 motor rear
  • - dual performance [beast] trim:
    • 1 motor front
    • 2 motors rear
I think you are misinterpreting what they are trying to convey. They’re saying to eschew the dual v tri of 2019 and expect something like Cybertruck (Dual Motor) and Cyberbeast/Cybertruck Performance (Tri-Motor). Trucks with largely the same specs (aligned closer to the dual motor presented in 2019) aside from the increased performance (0-60, Top Speed, etc.) of the Cyberbeast.
 
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cvalue13

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Where did you read or what gives you the mindset that there are only dual motors terminology [tossing the Tri-Motor Plaid conventional terminology]?
I'm sorry if you explained that or pointed to a source but I couldn't find it.
  • - dual:
    • 1 motor front
    • 1 motor rear
  • - dual performance [beast] trim:
    • 1 motor front
    • 2 motors rear
I think you are misinterpreting what they are trying to convey. They’re saying to eschew the dual v tri of 2019 and expect something like Cybertruck (Dual Motor) and Cyberbeast/Cybertruck Performance (Tri-Motor). Trucks with largely the same specs (aligned closer to the dual motor presented in 2019) aside from the increased performance (0-60, Top Speed, etc.) of the Cyberbeast.
exactly as @KScheidt said - and if only to exercise my own emphasis of his explination:

there will be a cybertruck that has three motors

but people still equate having three motors to the vehicle described on-screen in 2019 called the "Tri Motor". Because since 2019, the term "Tri Motor" has become shorthand for "version that has longest range, highest towing capacity, and is fast"

so now, when people hear there is a cybertruck coming with 3 motors, but not with longer range or higher towing capcity, they say "where's my 'Tri Motor'"

to which I'm saying: that 2019 truck is not being released on Nov 30; instead, in 2019 terminology, they're only releasing the "Dual Motor" (but now with a surprise option to make a "Dual Motor" fast, by adding a third motor)
 

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exactly as @KScheidt said - and if only to exercise my own emphasis of his explination:

there will be a cybertruck that has three motors

but people still equate having three motors to the vehicle described on-screen in 2019 called the "Tri Motor". Because since 2019, the term "Tri Motor" has become shorthand for "version that has longest range, highest towing capacity, and is fast"

so now, when people hear there is a cybertruck coming with 3 motors, but not with longer range or higher towing capcity, they say "where's my 'Tri Motor'"

to which I'm saying: that 2019 truck is not being released on Nov 30; instead, in 2019 terminology, they're only releasing the "Dual Motor" (but now with a surprise option to make a "Dual Motor" fast, by adding a third motor)
I think a lot of the confusion surrounding the 2019 trims vs what is now (presumably) being released comes from the fact that in 2019, Tesla named the variants by motor number, rather than range. It made sense at the time, assuming they had originally intended that each variant would have a unique pack. If they had instead named them by pack size/range, we could have had a short range, standard range, and long range, which in 2019 would have had 1, 2, and 3 motors respectively. Using those terms instead, what it looks like we are getting on Nov 30 would be a standard range (which will have 2 motors), and a standard range performance (which will have 3 motors).
Thank you for your patience. I think this wording by bwhntr78 helped change my minds-eye perspective that was trapped in motor count focus.

range below = miles_per_kWh * usable_kWh
[usable_kWh could be all of battery or same battery but software limited like past examples]
  • short range [ a ]
    • 1 motor trim
  • standard range [ b ]
    • 2 motor trim - regular performance
    • 3 motor trim - beast performance
  • long range {'standard' towing range] [ c ]

    [ a ] something like 200-300 mile range
    [ b ] something like 300-400 mile range
    [ c ] something like 400-500 mile range
 
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cvalue13

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Thank you for your patience. I think this wording by bwhntr78 helped change my minds-eye perspective that was trapped in motor count focus.

range below = miles_per_kWh * usable_kWh
[usable_kWh could be all of battery or same battery but software limited like past examples]
  • short range [ a ]
    • 1 motor trim
  • standard range [ b ]
    • 2 motor trim - regular performance
    • 3 motor trim - beast performance
  • long range {'standard' towing range] [ c ]

    [ a ] something like 200-300 mile range
    [ b ] something like 300-400 mile range
    [ c ] something like 400-500 mile range
yes, basically - thanks to @bwhntr78 for that framing

and as for your enumeration above, I would maybe advance it a click forward as follows (as I see it):

(a) SHORT RANGE (previously dubbed "single motor")

(b) STANDARD RANGE/towing/payload/speed
  • 2 motor trim - regular speed/acceleration (previously dubbed "dual motor")
    • meets >300mi range expectation
    • exceeds >10K towing expectation
    • exceeds 0-60 speed expectation (previously 4.5 sec, expect Lightning parity at 3.9 sec)
    • misses expectations on payload, 6 seats/interior room, 6.5' bed, ramp, etc.
    • adds unexpected features like 4WS, SBW,
  • 3 motor trim - beast speed/acceleration (new offering, never before considered)
(c) LONG RANGE/increased towing /speed (previously dubbed "tri motor")


And on Nov. 30, neither (a) nor (c) are being released. I can't see (a) ever being released. We'll be all ears to see if Tesla says whether (c) will be ever released, and if so, when.

But hey, if you were into (c) mostly for the increased speed, you'll still be covered on Nov 30
 

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yes, basically - thanks to @bwhntr78 for that framing

and as for your enumeration above, I would maybe advance it a click forward as follows (as I see it):

(a) SHORT RANGE (previously dubbed "single motor")

(b) STANDARD RANGE/towing/payload/speed
  • 2 motor trim - regular speed/acceleration (previously dubbed "dual motor")
    • meets >300mi range expectation
    • exceeds >10K towing expectation
    • exceeds 0-60 speed expectation (previously 4.5 sec, expect Lightning parity at 3.9 sec)
    • misses expectations on payload, 6 seats/interior room, 6.5' bed, ramp, etc.
    • adds unexpected features like 4WS, SBW,
  • 3 motor trim - beast speed/acceleration (new offering, never before considered)
(c) LONG RANGE/increased towing /speed (previously dubbed "tri motor")


And on Nov. 30, neither (a) nor (c) are being released. I can't see (a) ever being released. We'll be all ears to see if Tesla says whether (c) will be ever released, and if so, when.

But hey, if you were into (c) mostly for the increased speed, you'll still be covered on Nov 30
If beast mode is priced right and 300+ miles of range I'd get it.

So far so good with my MYP which u believe was originally rated 303

Although. Acceleration boost possibility exists for dual motor non beast mode.. hmmm
 


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cvalue13

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Where did you read or what gives you the mindset that there are only dual motors terminology [tossing the Tri-Motor Plaid conventional terminology]?
I'm sorry if you explained that or pointed to a source but I couldn't find it.
I’m not suggesting that Tesla has said anything along this line regarding how they’ll frame nomenclature

Instead that I’m framing the expectation, and making a distinction/clarification that just because a model being offered happens to have three motors (as a matter of hardware) does not mean that’s “The Tri Motor” (as a matter of model differentiation)

That said, do notice that you haven’t seen Musk talk about “Dual” or “Tri” - he’s talked instead only about “The Cybertruck” and “the performance model” or the “beast mode” model.

Nov 30 will be interesting in part to see how they officially frame this release compared to the 2019 framing/expectations
 

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I’m not suggesting that Tesla has said anything along this line regarding how they’ll frame nomenclature

Instead that I’m framing the expectation, and making a distinction/clarification that just because a model being offered happens to have three motors (as a matter of hardware) does not mean that’s “The Tri Motor” (as a matter of model differentiation)

That said, do notice that you haven’t seen Musk talk about “Dual” or “Tri” - he’s talked instead only about “The Cybertruck” and “the performance model” or the “beast mode” model.

Nov 30 will be interesting in part to see how they officially frame this release compared to the 2019 framing/expectations
I, of course, heard about the beast mode as it was all over the socials.
End of this clip where he mentioned beast mode version.

"We're are aiming to get the 0-60 below 3 seconds ... for the, yea know, the beast mode ... "​

 
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I, of course, heard about the beast mode as it was all over the socials.
End of this clip where he mentioned beast mode version.
"We're are aiming to get the 0-60 below 3 seconds ... for the, yea know, the beast mode ... "​

See also

 

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[ Tweets/post don't show up natively in my browser when on this forum but do on others like TMC. I just see a box with 'Loading tweet' :) ]

Thanks for that reminder. I had seen but forgot about that.

Elon tweet: "I just drove the performance Cybertruck today and it kicks ass next-level"​
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