Yes 'Exoskeleton'?

[CyberGus]

that said, I have found that it’s real-world engineers (even civil!) who tend to believe they’re the best internet lawyers, internet doctors, internet husbands, and really … anything.

objection!
move to strike

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[PilotPete]

objection!
move to strike

Objection to his objection!
Badgering the witness!
Move for mistrial!
Move to strike CyberGus with a right hook!

 

[Mini2nut]

Found this on Twitter today...

 

[JBee]

Monroe obviously doesn't want to identify CT as an exoskeleton anymore...

But good on him for only saying what it isn't, and not what it is.

I think it is an important lesson, that by naming something you take ownership of it, even if it is only an idea, to which you move heaven and earth to defend it. So you're better off not defining it exclusively, but rather inclusively, to make sure you have less to defend. But language without definition is just grey noise, so you need to find the right balance, otherwise everything you say is just meaningless, and then you take offence when no-one takes you seriously anymore.

Lol. To late for me I suppose.

 

[RVAC]

I apologize if this was stated already, but Munro's latest video on Twitter about the Cybertruck (7/17) stated that the Cybertruck "would not be classified as an exoskeleton" based on the latest frame photos.

Whether the Cybertruck merits the exoskeleton moniker is certainly debatable. However when Sandy points to the conventional body side outer and claims that as proof "the exoskeleton idea probably didn't work" tells me the guys at Munro didn't pay much attention to this render and that their assumptions were divergent to Tesla's right from day one:

But they did concede the marketing guys "come up with some real BS names for some of our ideas. So those yo-yos might refer to something with that term. But they're wrong as often as they're right."

Likely an important driving force behind the decision to use the exoskeleton term over unibody given the latter gets a bad rep in the truck world.

 

[cvalue13]

Likely an important driving force behind the decision to use the exoskeleton term over unibody given the latter gets a bad rep in the truck world.

a 4-week old follow up with Cory at Monroe, where he more or less backpedaled his prior “not an exoskeleton” comments to instead drill into how a unibody is essentially an exoskeleton, and that the CT’s most exoskeleton-like qualities will be at the rear end

 

[CyberGus]

a 4-week old follow up with Cory at Monroe, where he more or less backpedaled his prior “not an exoskeleton” comments to instead drill into how a unibody is essentially an exoskeleton, and that the CT’s most exoskeleton-like qualities will be at the rear end

As has been noted previously, "exoskeleton" is a biological term, not an engineering one.

So if Elon says it's got an exoskeleton, then it's got a goddamn exoskeleton. Got it? Ok, moving on.

 

[cvalue13]

So if Elon says it's got an exoskeleton, then it's got a goddamn exoskeleton. Got it? Ok, moving on.

Not really interested in the word “exoskeleton”, but instead the substantive descriptions Musk made about what he meant by that term - and the degree to which the production CT makes good on those descriptions.

" [T]he functionality I’m going to describe is within a space that is less than the most popular pickup truck in the United States, the F150... [W]e’re able to achieve much greater capability in the same dimensions, same weight ... [due to a] fundamental design change, we moved the mass to the outside. We created an [BLEEP BLEEP].​

​

So normally the way that a truck is designed, you have a body on frame, you have a bed on frame and the body and the bed don’t do anything useful. They’re carried like cargo, like a sack of potatoes....​

​

The key to creating an effective monoplane was a stressed skin design. You move the stress to the outside skin. Allows you to do things that you can’t do with a body on frame. So we’re able to make the skin out of thick, ultra hard stainless steel."​

On a strict read of the above: the [BLEEP BLEEP] is [a complete] fundamental design change, that moved [all] the mass to the outside, has [no] 'body on frame' elements, has [no] 'bed on frame' elements, and [all] the stress is moved to the outside.

On a lenient read of the above: the [BLEEP BLEEP] [includes] a fundamental design change, thta moved [some] of the mass to the outside, has [some] 'body on frame' elements, has [some] 'bed on frame' elements, and [some] of the stress is moved to the outside.

In this whole thread, I'm only pointing out that the lenient read continues to be displayed in the BIW photos. The strict read was propagated by some, whose followers now say Tesla reversed course. That the lenient read is still viable, may just go to show that the strict read was never the correct in the first place.

None of which has anything to do with the word [BLEEP BLEEP].

 

[CyberGus]

" [T]he functionality I’m going to describe is within a space that is less than the most popular pickup truck in the United States, the F150... [W]e’re able to achieve much greater capability in the same dimensions, same weight ... [due to a] fundamental design change, we moved the mass to the outside. We created an [BLEEP BLEEP].​

​

So normally the way that a truck is designed, you have a body on frame, you have a bed on frame and the body and the bed don’t do anything useful. They’re carried like cargo, like a sack of potatoes....​

​

The key to creating an effective monoplane was a stressed skin design. You move the stress to the outside skin. Allows you to do things that you can’t do with a body on frame. So we’re able to make the skin out of thick, ultra hard stainless steel."​

On a strict read of the above: the [BLEEP BLEEP] is [a complete] fundamental design change, that moved [all] the mass to the outside, has [no] 'body on frame' elements, has [no] 'bed on frame' elements, and [all] the stress is moved to the outside.

On a lenient read of the above: the [BLEEP BLEEP] [includes] a fundamental design change, thta moved [some] of the mass to the outside, has [some] 'body on frame' elements, has [some] 'bed on frame' elements, and [some] of the stress is moved to the outside.

In this whole thread, I'm only pointing out that the lenient read continues to be displayed in the BIW photos. The strict read was propagated by some, whose followers now say Tesla reversed course. That the lenient read is still viable, may just go to show that the strict read was never the correct in the first place.

None of which has anything to do with the word [BLEEP BLEEP].

 

[JBee]

Isn't it nice that Monroe is posting videos on the CT design after reading this thread.

The rear is the only part that an exoskeleton will help, IF it doesn't have opening sails. Which is probably one of the reasons they had to go.

That, and admittedly the lack of space since they put that darn cast in the sail. Now my sail storage ideas have been blown of course, cast overboard in fact.

But given the above definition, I somehow think the original CT design was fully intended to have the bleep bleep exoskeleton, but as discussed at length before, it was in fact too difficult to get the whole exoskeleton in the load path to the wheels, and a cast was just so much cheaper and faster to make.

I do wonder now if the whole vehicle is 3mm SS, or if only the doors and frunk where the SS is the primary structure. That way its still mostly 9mm proof and of course rust proof.

 

[cvalue13]

But given the above definition, I somehow think the original CT design was fully intended to have the bleep bleep exoskeleton,

I think you mean to refer here to the strict reading of the definition

Because Musk does continue to use [BLEEP BLEEP], and the lenient reading (as reflected in the door patent, etc.) all continues to seem likely

 

[CyberGus]

I think you mean to refer here to the strict reading of the definition

Because Musk does continue to use [BLEEP BLEEP], and the lenient reading (as reflected in the door patent, etc.) all continues to seem likely

Why is everyone afraid to say exoskeleton out loud

It's not like saying Voldemort or Betelgeuse.

Or is it... ?

 

[cvalue13]

Why is everyone afraid to say exoskeleton out loud

Is this a trap?

So if Elon says it's got an exoskeleton, then it's got a goddamn exoskeleton. Got it? Ok, moving on.

plus, it does turn out that removing the word [BLEEP BLEEP] helps clear the weeds away from the substantive discussion of the functionality described and the construction method implied

once you remove the word [BLEEP BLEEP] you avoid discussions of crabs and turtles, or discussions or whether engineers use the term [BLEEP BLEEP], and any number of the goose chases that distract from the substantive chit-chat that a couple of internet idiots (eg me) find interesting

but back to your original question: yes, saying [BLEEP BLEEP] is like saying “Beetlejuice” (itself a reference to an [BLEEP BLEEP]: say it three times and @Jhodgesatm appears

 

[WHIZZARD OF OZ]

Found this on Twitter today...

Photoshop at BEST!

 

[Mini2nut]

I see one major Giga casting (green) with 6 smaller aluminum castings attached to it.

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